Obama's 57 states

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Postby David » Fri May 16, 2008 11:55 am

Pillowcasr wrote:The right wing conservatives know what is coming, so they are starting to bring out the slime machine. This year they will use more fear mongering, guilty by association claims.


And this is different from what your doing in this post how? This is exactly what you did in your whole post.

Pillowcasr wrote:He said in his speech that the war in iraq would be over by 2013, while some time back he said we would be in iraq for a hundred years. Flip flop er!


He never said that. He said he hopes but cannot guarantee that the war will be over by the end of his first term, 2013. He said we may be in Iraq for a 100 years, "As long as Americans are not being injured or harmed or wounded or killed, it's fine with me and I hope it would be fine with you if we maintain a presence in a very volatile part of the world where al Qaeda is training, recruiting, equipping and motivating people every single day."

Stop your fear mongering.

Pillowcasr wrote:Then to top it all off more scandal! Karl Rove, this jackleg, is in for it now. He thinks he can site executive privledge to deter him from being supeoned. The baiting you see on these forums is nothing compared to what ole Rovie is gonna face. They will get this guy to purjure himself or bring more of the bush administration into this scandal.


Yes, republican will claim guilt by association, but you never would. :no:
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Postby rman114 » Fri May 16, 2008 12:05 pm

jrockncash wrote:Ya I see that. I guess it was a matter of time until the Obama camp figured they better infiltrate the hunting community. My favorite quote so far was the one from Obamas website that says he is all about duck hunting and hunting rights. :rofl:

And everyone gets mad at hillary for doing anything to get elected. Look at the RECORD. Sheeple in abundance these days.


I wouldn't call it infiltrate...believe it or not all hunters are not republicans.
What evidence do you have that says he isn't for duck hunters?

The gun laws listed below, whether you agree with them or not, never effected a hunter's ability to go duck hunting or any kind of hunting. And also last i checked the people of Illinois are still hunting as well.
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Postby jrockncash » Fri May 16, 2008 12:12 pm

You need to learn up on what category a Semi auto duck gun goes in when he was voting for the ban of Semi autos. (See above mentioned voting record)

The Obama people still crack me up. Still after all the debate no one has said a single thing he is going to do to this country that is going to be positive.

Are you a Socialist?

The most Liberal Senator in the Senate.

I dont want the most of anything when it comes to politics.
Thinnest Resume of anyone to ever run for president.
Overwhelming voting record that is against guns, pro gay, pro illegal immigrant. And in his very short tenure in the senate the negatives go on and on.
Not even the Dude can write up a compelling arguement for Obama.

Change is right, change from spiraling to full flush.


"all duck hunters arent Repubs" Really, huh, very incitefull. :rofl:
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Postby rman114 » Fri May 16, 2008 12:20 pm

I'll put it this way.

The Republicans have been in office for 8 years and i don't think they've led the country on a good course. Time to change the people at the wheel.

The democrats won't completely disengage in Iraq but combat operations as we know them today need to be ended. The Iraqi government needs to handle it's own civil and ethnic problems. would i think it was worth it to go blind or lose my legs in Iraq...no.

The Democrats want to re-energize the War in Afganistan a war i completely support and a war that has played second fidle even though that is the front where those who attacked us came from.

Healthcare needs to be reformed. The Republicans do not have an adequate plan to improve it.
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Postby jrockncash » Fri May 16, 2008 12:39 pm

You are misinformed my friend.

First off have you ever served oversees? Particularly in Iraq? If not maybe you shouldnt second guess the relevance of the guys doing it. You think they want to tuck tail and run? If your country told you they needed you would you go?

Do you want to socialize health care? Thats what your heros are trying to do.

You dont think making health care like your car insurance will encourage competition and availability?

Lots of poor people have car insurance. You get to pick who you want to give you your insurance and what level of coverage you want. You also get to pick how much you spend on it. Sounds a little better to me than having the government give me mass coverage and charging me for the guys that sit on their ass. (See welfare)


If you want to quote Paul Bigalla or Axelrod or any of the other liberal mouth pieces you should look at the other side also. Ill bet you never even new that was McCains plan for healthcare. (revised and summarized of course)
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Postby rman114 » Fri May 16, 2008 12:40 pm

jrockncash wrote:You need to learn up on what category a Semi auto duck gun goes in when he was voting for the ban of Semi autos. (See above mentioned voting record)

The Obama people still crack me up. Still after all the debate no one has said a single thing he is going to do to this country that is going to be positive.

Are you a Socialist?

The most Liberal Senator in the Senate.

I dont want the most of anything when it comes to politics.
Thinnest Resume of anyone to ever run for president.
Overwhelming voting record that is against guns, pro gay, pro illegal immigrant. And in his very short tenure in the senate the negatives go on and on.
Not even the Dude can write up a compelling arguement for Obama.

Change is right, change from spiraling to full flush.


"all duck hunters arent Repubs" Really, huh, very incitefull. :rofl:


You have to look more into what the heck he was voting on. He didn't want the assault weapons ban from expiring. The assault weapons ban was in effect for years and never effected hunters use of semi auto shotguns.

I don't mind his vote because i don't need an AR-15 for deer hunting, a flash suppressor, folding stocks, more than 5 rounds in my shotgun.

He was not voting to take away your semi...but anyway...REAL hunters use pumps :tongue:

Here are the provisions he voted on:

The bill bans, by name, the manufacture of 19 different weapons:

Norinco, Mitchell, and Poly Technologies Avtomat Kalashnikovs (all models);
Action Arms Israeli Military Industries UZI and Galil;
Beretta Ar70 (SC-70);
Colt AR-15;
Fabrique National FN/FAL, FN/LAR, and FNC;
SWD M-10; M-11; M-11/9, and M-12;
Steyr AUG;
INTRATEC TEC-9, TEC-DC9, AND TEC-22;
revolving cylinder shotguns such as (or similar to) the Street Sweeper and Striker 12.
The bill also bans "copies" or "duplicates" of any of those weapons. The failure to include a ban of these "copies" or "duplicates" would have opened the door for widespread evasion of the ban. Even so, some unscrupulous gun manufacturers have tried to evade the law by making minor changes to their assault weapons in order to skirt the restrictions.

The 1994 law also prohibits manufacturers from producing firearms with more than one of the following assault weapon features:

Rifles

Folding/telescoping stock
Protruding pistol grip
Bayonet mount
Threaded muzzle or flash suppressor
Grenade launcher
Pistols

Magazine outside grip
Threaded muzzle
Barrel shroud
Unloaded weight of 50 ounces or more
Semi-automatic version of a fully automatic weapon
Shotguns

Folding/telescoping stock
Protruding pistol grip
Detachable magazine capacity
Fixed magazine capacity greater than 5 rounds
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Postby jrockncash » Fri May 16, 2008 12:46 pm

You got that from his website I think. No way they could of worded it in his favor, could they?

Explain to me why I cant own an AR-15?

And feel free to respond to the other post of mine.


PS Im not trying to pick on you. Yer boy Barry, or is it, oh ya its Barrack now, makes me sick.
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Postby don taylor » Fri May 16, 2008 12:49 pm

We need a change because your unhappy with the last 8 years? I wish everyone in my state held the same idea. We have been dealing with poverty, job loss, a higher murder rate ect in this democratic controlled part of PA for 40 years and my idiot neighbors keep voting in dems. Funny how all the republican controlled areas recovered from katrina but the dem controlled areas are still scooping out the mud. Who controls the cities with the highest murder rates? The list goes on and on......
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Postby David » Fri May 16, 2008 12:50 pm

rman114, that is just one of the bills. He also help author a bill to ban all semi-automatic weapons. That includes all semi-auto pistols, rifles and shotguns. That effects hunters. He also pushed bills for every gun to leave a unique stamp when it's fired and every box of bullets to be uniquely stamped. Luckily all this was voted down, but this lets you know his views.

Wanting change is fine, just know what change is before following blindly.
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Postby rman114 » Fri May 16, 2008 12:54 pm

jrockncash wrote:You are misinformed my friend.

First off have you ever served oversees? Particularly in Iraq? If not maybe you shouldnt second guess the relevance of the guys doing it. You think they want to tuck tail and run? If your country told you they needed you would you go?

Do you want to socialize health care? Thats what your heros are trying to do.

You dont think making health care like your car insurance will encourage competition and availability?

Lots of poor people have car insurance. You get to pick who you want to give you your insurance and what level of coverage you want. You also get to pick how much you spend on it. Sounds a little better to me than having the government give me mass coverage and charging me for the guys that sit on their ass. (See welfare)


If you want to quote Paul Bigalla or Axelrod or any of the other liberal mouth pieces you should look at the other side also. Ill bet you never even new that was McCains plan for healthcare. (revised and summarized of course)


His plan is not to create universal health care. It's to keep the current system but bring in those who are uninsured or uninsurable.
The uninsured get a good group rate because there are millions, the hospitals don't get screwed by people who keep going bankrupt because they can't afford their operation and the government gets the uninsurable covered by helping the companies out with catostrophic care, which makes up large percentage of insurance complany costs.

Does McCain's plan allow those with pre existing diseases get coverage?

I think people would by cheap health insurence but if the coverage is crap (because it's cheap) they will probably go bankrupt anyway attemting to pay their bills and the system will still get screwed and costs will stay sky high.
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Postby rman114 » Fri May 16, 2008 12:58 pm

Well sometimes you just have to agree to disagree. But i'm telling you, we'll still have our semi auto duck guns in 2012 should he be elected President.
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Postby don taylor » Fri May 16, 2008 1:07 pm

He wants to ban all semi autos. What don't you understand?
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Postby jrockncash » Fri May 16, 2008 1:16 pm

Can someone with a DUI still get car insurance? They have to pay more but yes they can.

Who pays for all these people that dont have coverage?

Sounds alot like welfare.
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Postby jrockncash » Fri May 16, 2008 1:18 pm

Explain to me why I cant own an AR-15?
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Postby cjc » Fri May 16, 2008 7:30 pm

I would quote everything jrock has posted, but that's too long. I just want to say bravo and well put rockncash. If i'm not a fellon and don't use guns to rob banks or people, i don't see why I couldn't own a freakin howitzer (if I could afford it).
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Postby LIGHT12 » Fri May 16, 2008 8:16 pm

Do you people really want the ones responsible for running Social Security, our Schools, our Roads, and every other service we complain about running our health care? Just a thought.

Oh, and Please tell me one thing Obama has said of substance. Charisma a good president does not make. Plus why does his campaign finance violations from his first election to the Senate not get brought up. Oh i forgot it was pushed under the rug when it happened. Can't have your annointed boy involved with a man Charged with Rico violations.

So tell me how Obama is going ot do all that he claims.

And keep in mind when you read this I live in Arizona and have never voted for McCain. Stop with the Personal attacks of Dumb and Old. Makes you look like a moron*.

If you wan to say he blows with the wind like the other three when it comes to politics go right ahead. But put something behind it besides he is old, and you think he is dumb. I could take an hour typing and give you reasons all three of the candidates should be dumped. They all will make bad presidents.

*MORON was used for effect. Same thing as calling McCain old and dumb.
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Postby big savage » Fri May 16, 2008 10:51 pm

i don't need an AR-15 for deer hunting, a flash suppressor, folding stocks,


So just because you have no use for them, you don't see a reason for anyone to be able to own one?

I don't have any use for a blue tooth hands free earpeice. I know a bunch of people have them, use them, and enjoy them...but I don't care for them. So I think they should be banned.

The bill bans, by name, the manufacture of 19 different weapons:

Norinco, Mitchell, and Poly Technologies Avtomat Kalashnikovs (all models);
Action Arms Israeli Military Industries UZI and Galil;
Beretta Ar70 (SC-70);
Colt AR-15;
Fabrique National FN/FAL, FN/LAR, and FNC;
SWD M-10; M-11; M-11/9, and M-12;
Steyr AUG;
INTRATEC TEC-9, TEC-DC9, AND TEC-22;
revolving cylinder shotguns such as (or similar to) the Street Sweeper and Striker 12.
The bill also bans "copies" or "duplicates" of any of those weapons. The failure to include a ban of these "copies" or "duplicates" would have opened the door for widespread evasion of the ban. Even so, some unscrupulous gun manufacturers have tried to evade the law by making minor changes to their assault weapons in order to skirt the restrictions.


None of these 'assault weapons' fire some special evil magic bullet that homes in on cops, kids, and good law abiding citizens...the last time I checked they used the same cartridge as many 'hunting'/'sporting' firearms. So what makes them different? Oh, they look evil and menacing...so we HAVE to ban them. Oh...they hold more rounds than 'hunting' rifles too....OH NO!!!! Someone forgot to tell the libs that some 'hunting rifles' also have expanded capacity aftermarket magazines. BAN THEM!!!!

SAVE THE CHILDREN!!!!!

I, like many level headed intelligent law-abiding citizens, take issue with the 1994 ban.

Rifles

Folding/telescoping stock: Folding stocks usually weigh less, and are much easier to carry. They also provide different shooting styles to be enjoyed without feeling clumsy or awkward. Telescoping stocks, I use them on my AR to adjust lop, my friends like a different lop than I do, they help with gun fit.

Protruding pistol grip: Fuzzy and ambiguous wording at best. Pistol grips provide far greater control with a better grip on the firearm. Who doesn't want a better grip that offers more control?

Bayonet mount: I don't use bayonets, but I'm not going to tell joe schmoe that he shouldn't be able to have one if he wishes to own one. Check that...I think we should ban them...what with all of the rampant bayonettings in the news lately.

Threaded muzzle or flash suppressor: I use a flash suppressor on my ar. The recoil is light, but the muzzle flash is distracting through the scope. I use one to remove that annoyance, and compensators help counter what little muzzle climb is there. I like that when I'm out shooting prairie dogs and want to pick up another dog after my initial shot.

Grenade launcher: Now this one is silly. You can't even get grenades unless you are in the service or are going through illegal channels. So who cares if you have a tube on the gun for looks?

Pistols

Magazine outside grip: Because we ALL love reloading more often when we go to the range....right?

Threaded muzzle: I assume this was to stop people from using silencers...which are illegal unless you have a class 3...this is more glut in the law...enforce the law that is already in place....not stack more manure on the pile.

Barrel shroud: Because we all like being burned by a hot barrel we have just been shooting through...right? Also, who would ever want to have better control over a legal pistol while shooting...oh...everyone...my bad

Unloaded weight of 50 ounces or more: Because big huge pistols are so easy to conceal...right...oh wait. Oh, it's because they are usually more powerful and LOOK MEAN. Just ask Dirty Harry! If you want to carry a d-eagle or a python as your c/c, have fun with that. I'll be carrying my 24/7 in .40 thankyouverymuch.

Semi-automatic version of a fully automatic weapon: Once again...it looks mean. Ignore the fact that it shoots the exact same caliber of bullet that hundreds of similar non-auto-looking pistols fire.

Shotguns

Folding/telescoping stock: see above point about lop. In addition, who wants a shotgun for home defense that is easy to maneuver in tight spaces? oh...everyone again, huh?

Protruding pistol grip: Again, who wants to control their firearm better? Any of you guys turkey/deer hunt with a shotty?

Detachable magazine capacity: who cares if it's 3 or 30 rounds...we're banning them ALL DAMMIT!

Fixed magazine capacity greater than 5 rounds: Because stopping and reloading more often is more fun, right? And never mind the fact that more rounds in a home defense situation is better.


Look, I'm not knocking no-bamma or billary for personal reasons. I believe they are completely ignorant to the actual good reasons for these design features. The media points out THIS is what a BAD GUN looks like. SEE HOW IT LOOKS EVIL... JUST LIKE WHAT YOU SEE IN THE HANDS OF MURDERERS AND TERRORISTS!!!!!! BAN THEM!!! In all honesty, a large percentage of crimes are committed with stolen/illegal weapons. Moreover, most of these illegal guns used in illegal activities are pistols...namely revolvers. Just remember, laws do not stop lawless people.

I can not vote for someone who wants more gun control laws on the books. Enforce the ones already there and leave the good law abiding citizens to themselves.

Socialized health care, the Iraq war, and other issues will have to wait for another post. I'm done ranting for now.
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Postby greenster » Fri May 16, 2008 11:40 pm

Explain to me why I cant own an AR-15?
You Can own a ar-15.. or any other weapon you want. They just cant be manufactured.



But you get "Piece" together any gun you want from folding stocks, to Grenade launchers. I could put together any weapon you want in 3 days.

I say you can own anything, there are some things such as some "m" series of assault weapons, ETC. Just go to a army surplus.
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Postby LIGHT12 » Sat May 17, 2008 12:40 am

If someone can tell me the difference between my A5 and an AR-15 and that argument makes sense. I will give you some props. both are the same basic technology. Only one looks scary in the minds of libs. So we'll ban it until we can come up with the excuse to ban the other.
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Postby don taylor » Sat May 17, 2008 3:44 am

The 1994 ban was purely cosmetic. That's the only difference between sporting guns and the MEAN guns they targeted. They operate under the same principles as our sporting guns. Most of the provisions that were included were ment to stop any military style or surplus guns from being imported. Being 400 places have produced AK's, they couldn't cover every model number. Imagine how that list would have gone over if it were 15 pages long. Make no mistake, the same people who drafted that bill would take every gun you have if they could. BTW you may want to check regulations state by state, but I use my AR-180 B to hunt deer In other states. I also hunt Prarie dogs with mine.

What your saying is that you don't understand the operating principle of these guns and your driven by outward appearances.

Do that as a boss hiring someone and you'll get sued for discrimination.

That will be all, your honor. I rest my case.
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Postby Chris Bishop » Sun May 18, 2008 5:09 pm

You know what I dont understand........because you have someone that is mentally unstable take their gun, be it a AR 15 or hand gun or whatever they happen to own at any given time.......enter a school or dorm or mall and kill, wound as many people as possible ....it ALWAYS comes back to the gun. Not that the person was having mental health issues. How many times have we heard, after the fact that everyone that knew the person thought he was alittle strange or he has been battling depression and on and on. Not once have I ever heard the politicans say we need to give help to the mentally ill. They dont want to.......because it is a much more complex problem to "fix". So they set their sights on something that is an easier target......the big bad GUN. As far as crimes committed with guns.........criminals will always have guns....ALWAYS. So the politicians use these horrific spectacles to further the agenda of removing ,eventually all guns from the hands of law abiding citizens. We in Canada, do not have the types of guns that the American citizens have the legal right to own......but our politicans are pushing for banding handguns because criminals are using them. :sniper: :gatgun: :skeet:

Fight it tooth and nail!!!!
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Postby Pillowcasr » Mon May 19, 2008 7:22 am

Eight years of fearmongering really has gotten to some of you. And you should prolly quit watching Fox noise channel too.

Your guns will be OK, every political thread started here always end up in the Gun ban issues. Hmmmmmmmmmm, Clinging to guns? I think I have heard this before.
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Postby don taylor » Mon May 19, 2008 8:45 am

Ya don't worry about your guns. Obama is for changing your gun ownership. Don't worry about the economy, Obama's got a plan for change. Obama is also going to change how we deal with terrorist. He want to TALK TOUGH to them and hope they can be shown the light. They just need a cool black guy to tell them to chill out.

We migrate to guns because this is a hunting site first. You manage to get some Obama love in every post. There is more to life than your Obamagasms.

Pillow casr wrote:

I just love Obama. He has lovely teeth and a winning smile. I'd just love to pinch his cute little Mulatto tushie! (is mulatto p.c. ?) He's my dream man(for president) and can't wait to have him in the oval office. [Edited by mod] I'm hoping to intern! Go Barack!!!
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Postby dudejcb » Mon May 19, 2008 10:41 am

jrockncash wrote:Explain to me why I cant own an AR-15?

explain to me why you want to own one.
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Postby dudejcb » Mon May 19, 2008 10:46 am

don taylor wrote:Pillow casr wrote:

I just love Obama. He has lovely teeth and a winning smile. I'd just love to pinch his cute little Mulatto tushie! (is mulatto p.c. ?) He's my dream man(for president) and can't wait to have him in the oval office. [Edited by mod] I'm hoping to intern! Go Barack!!!


Don this is out of bounds. Mulatto may be technically correct but the context and meaning is not PC or even civil. It's one thing to disagree and debate but I would like it not to degrade into racism.

This is dangerous talk. We m ight think of it as only talk, but there are people whohave already threatened Obama's life just becasue he is a person of color who might attain high office. Don't fan those type flames!
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