Use of deadly force

A forum to discuss home defense and personal defense to keep out crime.

Moderators: La. Hunter, badandy970, Montanafowler

Use of deadly force

Postby caleb » Thu Jan 08, 2009 10:12 pm

I would like to know if anyone here knows anybody that has ever had to use deadly force while legaly defending them self or their family. I dont want "hero" stories, I just want to know if there are more of us out there. Its a tough thing to deal with after it has happened to you. It will play on your mind for a long time (3 years for me).

--c--
User avatar
caleb
State Moderator
 
Posts: 834
Joined: Mon Dec 11, 2006 8:08 pm
Location: Canton, GA


Postby pgquackstacker » Thu Jan 08, 2009 10:19 pm

I have luckily not had to use deadly force but if my family or I were in danger I would have no problem pulling that trigger.
User avatar
pgquackstacker
hunter
 
Posts: 5150
Joined: Tue Sep 09, 2008 8:33 am
Location: NorCal

Postby Montanafowler » Thu Jan 08, 2009 10:52 pm

i too have never had to use it, but if the event did occur, i would not hesitate to eliminate a threat to myself or others.
Booney3721 wrote:Try being a dishwasher/Grill cook/ellectrition/garbage disposer and your owner/boss is a fat greek woman who cals you names as Retard, stupid, idiot, molocah, f*** face and tard, and tells you that you was the inspiration for abortion and birth control.
User avatar
Montanafowler
Forum Moderator
 
Posts: 6650
Joined: Thu Jun 21, 2007 9:54 pm
Location: Livingston, Montana

Postby Dep6 » Fri Jan 09, 2009 2:53 am

In my career I have been lucky more than once, yes I have been shot at a couple times, circumstances were that I could not shoot back for bystanders, I hate it but I can't take it back once it is fired but then they didn't even hit my patrol car neither.


It is an awful feeling, I know of a couple of officers that have had to shoot to defend or stop a threat and I can tell you from speaking with them, it is a feeling that I know I face daily but I pray that I never feel.
Saving the Poodles of America, one Alligator at a time!!
User avatar
Dep6
Site Admin
 
Posts: 6674
Joined: Mon Dec 12, 2005 12:17 pm
Location: GA

Postby captainduckhead » Fri Jan 09, 2009 6:23 am

For those that never have, you should pray you never have to. It makes you sick to your stomach. It's a huge burden on your mind, and time stands still. Seconds seem like hours, and the decision to pull the trigger or not is a life altering decision one way or the other.
It's easy to say, "I would not hesitate" but the fact is, you do hesitate, unless you are a trained law enforcement agent of some sort, or in the Military. Consequences run through your mind a million miles an hour, and you do everything you can NOT to pull the trigger. It's horrible to say the least.

There Caleb, I joined in with real participation, not just ball busting. Does that cheer you up?
Mojo Mallards are gay
captainduckhead
hunter
 
Posts: 3816
Joined: Thu Nov 16, 2006 3:21 pm
Location: St. Lawrence River, NY

Postby La. Hunter » Fri Jan 09, 2009 12:01 pm

captainduckhead wrote:For those that never have, you should pray you never have to. It makes you sick to your stomach. It's a huge burden on your mind, and time stands still. Seconds seem like hours, and the decision to pull the trigger or not is a life altering decision one way or the other.
It's easy to say, "I would not hesitate" but the fact is, you do hesitate, unless you are a trained law enforcement agent of some sort, or in the Military. Consequences run through your mind a million miles an hour, and you do everything you can NOT to pull the trigger. It's horrible to say the least.

There Caleb, I joined in with real participation, not just ball busting. Does that cheer you up?


Believe it or not, but I believe it is harder for an officer to not hesitate than it is for an ordinary citizen. Yes we are trained on making split second decisions that we will have to live with for the rest of our lives, but we are also constantly reminded of liability issues. Luckily, I have never had to completely pull the trigger on anyone, but there have been several times that the suspect made the last minute decision to drop his weapon when I was over 75% through the trigger pull. I know this sounds like I had a while to think about whether I was going to shoot or not, but this happened in only a couple of seconds.

To give you an idea of what happened on one occasion, we made a traffic stop when we observed a vehicle parked in the middle of the roadway, surrounded by a group of about 8 black males around 4:00 one morning and the driver quickly accelerated into a driveway. You could tell the passenger was getting ready to bail out so I had already unfastened by seatbelt and had my door open ready to chase them. As soon as my partner stopped the car, sure enough, the passenger bails. I then exit the car and begin to attempt to catch the passenger. As I am running towards them, I notice that the driver has also jumped out of the car and is going into the back seat. At this point I am at the right rear quarter panel of their vehicle. As soon as I recognized that he was attempting to retrieve a shotgun from the back seat of his car, I began to draw my weapon and try to use his car for as much cover as possible. My partner was slow to get out of the car due to the seatbelt hanging up on his holster on the way out of the car, but he came out of the car with his gun drawn. The suspect is raising his shotgun on my partner while my partner is trying to get his gun on target. At this point I was squeezing the trigger on my handgun (the hammer on my Beretta 96 was about to the breakover point) the suspect glanced over and for the first time realized that I didn't continue to chase his passenger and that I had beat him to the draw. He immediately lets go of the shotgun before I had to finish the last 1/2 or so pounds of my trigger pull. After we had him in handcuffs and back at the station, he admitted that had he not seen me he would have shot my partner. He said that he knew he had a chance against him but had no chance against me. We found out later that he was a suspect in several murders in the past and eventually went to jail for murdering someone after he got out when we arrested him. I know this is wrong, but I have often wondered if I should have been just a hair faster that day.
User avatar
La. Hunter
Site Admin
 
Posts: 6104
Joined: Tue Nov 02, 2004 10:13 am
Location: Northeast Louisiana

Postby Dep6 » Sat Jan 10, 2009 6:30 am

LA that sounds like one of those that you could WHAT IF from now until hades freezes over, I am glad that you didn't chase and stayed on target with him, I believe the good lord meant for you to stop your partner from getting shot that day.
Saving the Poodles of America, one Alligator at a time!!
User avatar
Dep6
Site Admin
 
Posts: 6674
Joined: Mon Dec 12, 2005 12:17 pm
Location: GA

Postby HuntersDad » Tue Jan 13, 2009 12:30 pm

I had a couple of guys try and break into my house in Nov. 2007. I had my 12 gauge handy and caught them as they got the back door open and proceeded to give them demands to get down and put their hands behind their backs. They did, and it all went down smoothly....thank God. Neither was armed, but one did have a larger folding knife out (what they used to pry the door). I would not have hesitated to take his life if he threatened mine.

If they severely hurt/killed me, there is no telling what they would have done to my wife and kids. I wouldn't have waited to find out.

I would rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6.
Image
User avatar
HuntersDad
hunter
 
Posts: 359
Joined: Wed Aug 20, 2008 6:56 pm
Location: Syracuse, NY

Postby greencop43 » Tue Jan 13, 2009 5:35 pm

I have been a police officer for over 6 years now and have never had to used deadly force, Thank God. If you want to know what it is like to use deadly force read the book "On Combat" by Lt Col. Dave Grossmen. Grossmen is a former army Ranger, paratrooper and West Point Psychology Professor. The book takes you through what will happen to you before, during, and after a deadly force encounter. The book should be a must read for every officer out there
Stay Safe
User avatar
greencop43
hunter
 
Posts: 31
Joined: Fri Jan 09, 2009 6:55 am
Location: Rhode Island

Postby don taylor » Wed Jan 14, 2009 10:16 pm

I've been arrested two times for attempted murder that were self defense situations that got out of hand for my attackers. In Pa failing to offer help and walking away from a unconscience person is illegal and the D.A. said I left them to die. Both recovered and were arrested on multiple charges including racial intimidation. I find it easier to try and beat someone to death than shoot them because one time I was armed and never drew my gun. Even facing someone with a bat didn't trigger the instinct my life was in danger enough to shoot them. It took my children and my wife entering my life to make the idea of shooting someone easier. There is no gradual increase in shooting someone, where I can show compassion to a lifeless body thats just out cold.
BIGGER WATER DECOYS

Chairman- The Allegheny Chapter of Delta Waterfowl.

https://www.facebook.com/groups/4277478 ... 6859634909
User avatar
don taylor
Forum & State Moderator
 
Posts: 7534
Joined: Fri Feb 01, 2008 7:38 pm
Location: Westmoreland County, Pa.

Postby usmc2220 » Sun Jan 18, 2009 9:40 am

HuntersDad wrote: I would rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6.


Words to live by be it in your home, or across the pond.
User avatar
usmc2220
hunter
 
Posts: 572
Joined: Wed Sep 20, 2006 6:01 pm
Location: Danbury, NH

Postby TEAM WEBFOOTPOSSE » Tue Jan 20, 2009 5:24 pm

shooting someone would be an awful experience for me
User avatar
TEAM WEBFOOTPOSSE
hunter
 
Posts: 1720
Joined: Fri Jul 11, 2008 4:39 am
Location: Nebraska

Postby tlegere104 » Tue Feb 03, 2009 8:28 pm

I've been on the job 20 years this week. I have been through hundreds of doors and made hundreds of arrests. I did go through a door knowing that it would be a shoot. He fired I returned. It was systematical and very "sterile" like any other workday. That was the problem. The thought that I could take a life without any hesitation or regret, that I would be able to let my training take over my body and instinct rule the day.

No one who has ever truly been in a deadly force situation can do so without being affected. Anyone who thinks that they can drop hammer on someone without thought or hesitation, scares the crap out of me.

If you are a copper and have been in that situation, talk to the old fat 20 year guy who has been throught it, he will red ass you but it will help.

If you are a civillian and have been in that situation, talk to the old fat 20 year guy who has been through it, you will have to buy the beer.

my .02
"No I don't have to arrest you, I choose to."
User avatar
tlegere104
hunter
 
Posts: 411
Joined: Tue Dec 09, 2008 11:24 am
Location: Murphysboro, Illinoi

Postby caleb » Thu Feb 05, 2009 11:10 pm

tlegere104 wrote:If you are a civillian and have been in that situation, talk to the old fat 20 year guy who has been through it, you will have to buy the beer.my .02


I agree and have taken the advice and it did help.
User avatar
caleb
State Moderator
 
Posts: 834
Joined: Mon Dec 11, 2006 8:08 pm
Location: Canton, GA

Postby devildog28 » Sat Feb 07, 2009 7:48 pm

I have had to more times than i can count. There is no exageration there only truth. My life was in a great amount of trouble each time since I was getting shot at with ak-47's on full auto.

the first time was kind of surreal but after a few times it became a simple math equation of making sure my bullet hit the target. I'm pretty much immune to feeling any kind of emotion these days for taking a life, but hesitation=dead IMO.
User avatar
devildog28
hunter
 
Posts: 2265
Joined: Mon Jun 09, 2008 9:36 am
Location: Katy, TX

Postby josephdistefano » Wed Feb 11, 2009 3:24 am

usmc2220 wrote:
HuntersDad wrote: I would rather be judged by 12 than carried by 6.


Words to live by be it in your home, or across the pond.
yeah no kidding!
founder of the aflak fan club...
Image
bud lite pro/fieldstaff
maxwell house field staff
marlboro light field staff
User avatar
josephdistefano
hunter
 
Posts: 736
Joined: Sat Jul 05, 2008 8:39 am
Location: where the good lord takes me


Return to Home and Personal Defense Forum

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest