Elvis Kiwi wrote:a great thread
Hope you got something out of it!
Glad too, (although a couple yrs. old), you brought it back up.
Looks like I missed a couple posts.
There is either some non-conventional word usage here, or a misunderstanding of how the e-collar is used at the line.
swampbilly 1980 wrote:.....You want to teach him how in order to push, pull and stop the dog....
It's not a matter of " non-conventional" use of the English language it's the "conventional",tra-
ditional Copterdoc mis
-interpretation of it
And although HNTFSH was absolutely right in his assessment, I'll still at least try to clarify-
I think Swamp was referring to an earlier thread about whether a dog feels pushed to an object or an object pulls the dog - relative to pressure. Could be wrong though.
In terms of an E-collar, pressure, and how it applies to training-
I don't view a bumper
as something that "pulls" a dog in the direction of where it's at. Perhaps on marks
- bumpers being a visual would.
But a blind doesn't
"pull" the dog anywhere.
And that's what I'm referring to here. In training and application- I see the collar as a tool that will Push/Pull/and Stop the dog, and THAT'S what it's for. Bumpers don't do any of that.
In FTP it's not bumpers that "Pull" the dog to the pile.
It's Collar Pressure that Pushes
I also need to respond to this.
swampbilly 1980 wrote:....I view a collar same as a HEELING stick..it's just an extension of your arm to me....
While the heeling stick is used as an aversive, as is the e-collar, they are vastly different in application.
There is also a major difference in the dog's ability to fully understand a collar correction, vs a stick correction. The stick is much more "tangible" to the dog.
100% agree there's a difference in application/understanding of a HEELING Stick vs. a Collar-
But when used, (properly), in conjunction with each other the dog should fully understand both!
Lest we not forget-
Both are direct pressure
, and both can be indirect pressure as well.
If the dog is having some kind of a "problem" in terms of the "tangibility" of a Collar correction and understanding the differences, then someone might not have done a good job properly CC'ing the dog, and someone doesn't know how to use a HEELING Stick.
A dog doesn't need to be FF'd in order to learn concepts of pressure from a HEELING Stick and how to "turn that
Swampbilly1980- I got a feeva',..and the only cure is more Mergansers and face paint.