Chesapeake vs Labs

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Re: Chesapeake vs Labs

Postby Locked&Loaded » Tue Mar 20, 2012 3:37 pm

HNTFSH wrote:
Locked&Loaded wrote:
We can kill 7 ducks per day in Oregon, ahem I mean Utah and when the birds have landed in the decoys and are bunched-up just so, I can usually get 5-7 birds with 3 shots. Most of the kills coming with that third shell.


:lol3: That's efficient hunting. That would explain the Hot Buy spread.


Depending on the angle it can be fairly difficult to separate live birds from the decoys (especially prior to or after legal shooting time), but at $24.99 per dozen I just shoot at what looks to have real feathers. After the smoke clears, whatever doesn't sink to the bottom of the pond is either a dead duck or a decoy that can be used on the next hunt. :beer:
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Re: Chesapeake vs Labs

Postby Locked&Loaded » Tue Mar 20, 2012 3:43 pm

swampbilly 1980 wrote:
HNTFSH wrote:
Locked&Loaded wrote:
We can kill 7 ducks per day in Oregon, ahem I mean Utah and when the birds have landed in the decoys and are bunched-up just so, I can usually get 5-7 birds with 3 shots. Most of the kills coming with that third shell.


:lol3: That's efficient hunting. That would explain the Hot Buy spread.

:lol3: ..Guess it's safe to say the dawg does most of his marking after the second shot, ain't that right L&L... :devil:


:lol3: Exactly right! The first 2 shots are basically a command for the dawg to 'mark.' The biggest problem I've faced is when a single bird comes into the spread and I luck out and kill it on the first shot. One shot doesn't even seem to get the dog interested. I just throw rocks to the general area to try and coax the mutt into swimming out to investigate. My dog training skills are legendary. :biggrin:
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Re: Chesapeake vs Labs

Postby bvillekid01 » Wed Jul 16, 2014 5:59 pm

You can hope for that 1 in 1000 lab or you can just buy a good chessie
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Re: Chesapeake vs Labs

Postby HNTFSH » Wed Jul 16, 2014 7:22 pm

bvillekid01 wrote:You can hope for that 1 in 1000 lab or you can just buy a good chessie


You might wanna PM him your thoughts. The question is 2 1/4 years old and he ain't been on since February 2013.
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Re: Chesapeake vs Labs

Postby Beretta06 » Sat Jul 19, 2014 8:50 am

I'm a Chessie guy. My grandparents were from the Chesapeake bay they had used the dogs since the 1940s and brought them with them and bred them when they moved to CA. There are a couple big differences in the breeds to really take into consideration. Chessies were bred to retrieve 100s of birds a day in Icy waters for market hunters. Chessies will die in the water doing their job if your not carful that's how strong the instinct is in some of the dogs. The 2nd major differance is Chessies were bred to protect the market hunters gear and birds in the boat at the doc. So translation to today you stick your hand in the back of a pickup that belongs to a Chessie your going to loose it from the wrist. That is their job. My Chessie has a very sweet and kind disposition. Infact the breeder was just amazed with her when she stayed the week a couple months ago while breeding her. My dog is a great people dog. She does bark and growl at people walking by the house. Again that is her job. If we let strangers in and we except them she excepts them. Same with our club friendly with all the guys. She will lay on the porch of the cabin under the straps of ducks. Instinct. She refuses to let other dogs near the ducks. She is friendly with all the dogs except one. One male lab she goes after every time she gets the chance. She waits for him. But we do own the club it is hers to roam. I believe she knows that.

We don't get a lot of cold weather here in this part of CA but. A few years ago we hunted over ice on the pond. The dog was the first one in to break the ice to the blind ahead of us. After a couple limits we headed in hit the cabin compound and 2 of the guys with labs had Thier trucks running with the dogs in the cab with the heater on. I struck me as odd. As a Chessie owner it doesn't cross your mind.

Both dogs are good famialy dogs as well. It depends on what you want. If you want a big dumb happy oaf that labs are. Or a family dog that will love your family as much as a lab but stand between your kids and a stranger. And play the part of a dog that's willing to give all to protect your family.

Chessies are not for a owner who Is lazy or do not have the time to socialize their dogs with people or dogs.

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Re: Chesapeake vs Labs

Postby HNTFSH » Sat Jul 19, 2014 9:00 am

:lol3: Thank God I don't need to guard my birds.
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Re: Chesapeake vs Labs

Postby Beretta06 » Sat Jul 19, 2014 9:16 am

HNTFSH wrote::lol3: Thank God I don't need to guard my birds.

Like I said it is part of the breed. That is what is instinct to them. If your looking for a dog that doesn't have or you are not able to handle the trait. As an owner of a Chessie you have to instill you are the alpha while they are a pup. Chessies are much more intelligent than most guys want to deal with. But if you want a dog you can teach basic commands most Chessies don't need to be taught to do the job a waterfowl hunter needs done.

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Re: Chesapeake vs Labs

Postby Sonoma County Harvesters » Sat Jul 19, 2014 9:54 am

Beretta06 is right. I am now on my 3rd Chesapeake, and so far they all have been different but the constants have been great family dog, protecting the family, high hunting drive. The big thing though it is very different owning a lab and a chessie. But you gotta have your personality match the dog. Now personally I choose a chessie over lab because 1. I'm just as stubborn as they are, 2 I will hunt all day and so will they, and 3 they protect their family as do I. My hunting buddy owns a lab and she has hunted great with both my chessies. The lab and my younger chessie do get a little rigid between them, but they are the same age. Now I've only owned females cause I think they are easier to deal with than male. So if you do choose a chessie just be ready for it.
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Re: Chesapeake vs Labs

Postby Beretta06 » Sat Jul 19, 2014 10:18 am

Neuter a male as soon as you can, before he develops the typical male habits. He will be very tame, even compared to a intact female. I just had my first litter of pups. So even though are family has owned Chessies for close to 75 years. I now am learning even more about the breed. The breeder i used for stud has been breeding and showing Chessies for 30 years. She had a lot of insight into the breed that I hadn't considered

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Re: Chesapeake vs Labs

Postby Rick Hall » Sat Jul 19, 2014 5:49 pm

Hot damn, another chance to post a pic of one of my intact adult male Chesapeakes going for the throat of a stranger who made a move on the duck pile:
Image

OK, so it was just a smooch. But it brings us to the part of Chesapeake history about the breed being standardized by the likes of the Carrol Island Club, that's wealthy patrons probably wouldn't have taken kindly to being menaced by surly dogs. And some modern breed historians have suggested that The Complete Chesapeake Bay Retriever author, Eloise Cherry, championed the romantic image of a protective market hunters' dog to explain away her own dogs' surly nature. They point to the earliest breed records and largely discount market hunting's influence in favor of the gentlemen's clubs'.

I suspect the truth lies somewhere in the middle, with the best local gun dogs also having some influence on the clubs' stock. But I know none of my four Chessies have shown protective tendencies some of my pointing dogs haven't also shared. And the sweet old Brittany that just passed has been the only one of my ten dogs to date to actually bite a stranger (to him) for walking into our home unannounced. Good thing, that, as our door is open to an awful lot of folks, and all of the Chessies have spent their working lives at a busy commercial camp with strange men and dogs coming and going daily.

The Chesapeake bird "protectors" I've known belonged to men who let them think that it was acceptable, just like the Labrador bird protectors I've known. Indeed, whenever I've seen excessive Chesapeake possessiveness of any nature, it's invariably been excused by the owner as "a Chesapeake thing," so I wish folks would quit perpetuating such self-fulfilling nonsense. It's a dog thing that shouldn't be tolerated, let alone perpetuated.
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Re: Chesapeake vs Labs

Postby HNTFSH » Sat Jul 19, 2014 8:01 pm

Sonoma County Harvesters wrote:I choose a chessie over lab because 1. I'm just as stubborn as they are, 2 I will hunt all day and so will they, and 3 they protect their family as do I.


Beretta06 wrote:The 2nd major differance is Chessies were bred to protect the market hunters gear and birds in the boat at the doc. So translation to today you stick your hand in the back of a pickup that belongs to a Chessie your going to loose it from the wrist.


Beretta06 wrote:Or a family dog that will love your family as much as a lab but stand between your kids and a stranger. And play the part of a dog that's willing to give all to protect your family.


Beretta06 wrote:My dog is a great people dog. She does bark and growl at people walking by the house.


Beretta06 wrote:She will lay on the porch of the cabin under the straps of ducks. Instinct. She refuses to let other dogs near the ducks.


Beretta06 wrote:But if you want a dog you can teach basic commands most Chessies don't need to be taught to do the job a waterfowl hunter needs done.


You boys crack me up.
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Re: Chesapeake vs Labs

Postby Beretta06 » Sat Jul 19, 2014 8:35 pm

Just to be clear. The last dog I didn't allow to bark at people through the fence. Jewlz my current dog I let it go. It may be wrong. I may regret it later, but inside our perimeter fence I let it go. I live a couple miles from the lompoc federal prision. After we sell our house and move. I'm sure I'll find it difficult to break her of the habit. But it's doable.

Male habits I'm referring more to the love a male has on peeing on things.not really his disposition. When guys are looking for dogs the biggest complaints are, males pee on everything, females bleed, I live in a county in CA that requires dogs to be altered. It they arnt you have to take a class , have a vet sign off, pay triple the amount to license the dog. And pay for a breeding permit. Pretty much all dogs are altered here it's hard to get a vet to sign off because they all push spay and neuter.

You may be able to stop a male from peeing on things but that is difficult and time consuming. You would have to work on that 24/7. Most people have a couple hrs after work to work with their dog and weekends.
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Re: Chesapeake vs Labs

Postby Rick Hall » Sun Jul 20, 2014 4:07 am

Can't even imagine living in a place that regulates such things, and the peeing problem shouldn't be. "No" means no. When that's the case, nothing requires frequent application.
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Re: Chesapeake vs Labs

Postby Dawnsearlylight » Sun Jul 20, 2014 6:06 am

Rick Hall wrote:Can't even imagine living in a place that regulates such things, and the peeing problem shouldn't be. "No" means no. When that's the case, nothing requires frequent application.


This is the kind of thing that happens when irresponsible pet owners give the crazies reason to push their agendas. San Mateo actually implemented a one-year moratorium on all breeding, proposed by the Peninsula Humane Society in an attempt to lower the euthanasia rates of healthy dogs and cats. This kind of thing can happen anywhere, and it is the height of naivete to think that it can't. One way or another, we can all end up all paying the price for the moronic behavior of others.

There are organizations, state and national, that monitor legislation pertaining to pets, and specifically dogs and sporting dogs.. It would behoove all of us to support same.
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Re: Chesapeake vs Labs

Postby HNTFSH » Sun Jul 20, 2014 6:38 am

There's more wrong with that place than their dog laws. Especially the southern half.
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Re: Chesapeake vs Labs

Postby Willie » Sun Jul 20, 2014 1:35 pm

Rick Hall wrote:Can't even imagine living in a place that regulates such things, and the peeing problem shouldn't be. "No" means no. When that's the case, nothing requires frequent application.

I blame Bob Barker.
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Re: Chesapeake vs Labs

Postby HNTFSH » Sun Jul 20, 2014 2:07 pm

Willie wrote:
Rick Hall wrote:Can't even imagine living in a place that regulates such things, and the peeing problem shouldn't be. "No" means no. When that's the case, nothing requires frequent application.

I blame Bob Barker.


Barker have Chessies guarding his birds?
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Re: Chesapeake vs Labs

Postby Willie » Sun Jul 20, 2014 2:20 pm

HNTFSH wrote:
Willie wrote:
Rick Hall wrote:Can't even imagine living in a place that regulates such things, and the peeing problem shouldn't be. "No" means no. When that's the case, nothing requires frequent application.

I blame Bob Barker.


Barker have Chessies guarding his birds?

No, but he told people daily to spay and neuter their pets...for many years.
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Re: Chesapeake vs Labs

Postby Beretta06 » Sun Jul 20, 2014 4:29 pm

Anyway my point was that Chessies have several instinctual traits that are less than desirable, Unless you are equipped to handle them do the breed a favor and get a lab. That was it. My first Chessie was posseive of my truck especially it took a lot of work to correct it. Which takes time. I was 18 and didn't identify it as a problem until it was an issue which made it difficult to correct. My 2nd dog had dog issues. It took a lot of effort to make a differance with the issue. My current dog jewlz. Has issues with dogs on the porch of our cabin at the club, aswell as 1 of the labs at the club. There's 7 labs at the club not including the 3 labs from the wealthy guys that own the club straight across the rd, their dogs spend more time with us than them, but point is my Chessie is fine with 9 of the 10 dogs. I cannot put my finger on why she picks on this dog. Which makes correcting the problem difficult. Why aggression tward one dog? She just had pups 10 days ago, no protective issues toward anyone you would expect any issues to amplify. She is fine with our boxer in the whlpingbox. So go figure.

Yes southern CA sucks. If my wife didn't work for a vet clinic we would have to be like the general public I suppose.

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Re: Chesapeake vs Labs

Postby HNTFSH » Sun Jul 20, 2014 5:01 pm

So they went from the greatest dogs on earth to the hardest to manage? :huh:

News flash - Labs and other breeds pick up ducks nicely. Train easier, are very good at advanced hunting skills.

Your post seemed to suggest they were big oafs and the Chessie was the only 'worker' in the group or the only breed with zest and zeal. Plus, would 'protect your birds' by nature.

I don't have a breed favorite excepting the German Shepherd for Shutzhund, guard and protection work. Trained skills.
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Re: Chesapeake vs Labs

Postby Beretta06 » Sun Jul 20, 2014 7:05 pm

HNTFSH wrote:So they went from the greatest dogs on earth to the hardest to manage? :huh:

News flash - Labs and other breeds pick up ducks nicely. Train easier, are very good at advanced hunting skills.

Your post seemed to suggest they were big oafs and the Chessie was the only 'worker' in the group or the only breed with zest and zeal. Plus, would 'protect your birds' by nature.

I don't have a breed favorite excepting the German Shepherd for Shutzhund, guard and protection work. Trained skills.


News flash! Labs are big dumb Oafs. it's not derogatory. I just wanna hugem they are like big lovable teddy bears. I haven't met a lab that's not likeable Yet. My inlaws had a lab I would have called him a red lab very different color. He wasn't a hunting dog But Dually was a good famialy dog. All the labs I've seen or hunted over are nice dogs. a few don't seem to be super interested in hunting. They retrieve well but the will to hunt lacks in a few. A friend has hunted his German shorthair with my Chessie. I was real interested in his dog. He is a hardcore quail hunter. His dog did well blind hunting was defiantly different for his dog.

Chesapeake's are a 75 ish year tradition for our famialy. We own the Chesapake Duck Club in Los Banos CA it's not likley you will see any other dog in my possession. They are the best duck dog. If you are specifically talking waterfowl, if your talking cold environment waterfowl that would be a no brainier. I disagree on the training. Chessies are very willing to please. If you go about it wrong. It will seem difficult

As I said Chesapeake's have Undisireable traits more so than most other gun dogs. If you don't have the ability to manage some of those traits then the dog is not for you how much more plain and simple can that be said? Obviously labs are the most popular for a reason right. The draw back to the lab community is. The over breeding of the lab breed. Or dilution of genes or whatever it's called these days. Research on a good gun dog lab is really important. A $500 dog out of a backyard may not make a good hunting dog. So can be said with any breed but You see ads for labs all the time.

You know I hunted over a guys weimeriner it seemed very Nuerautic it was a one time thing not enough to make a good judgement.
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Re: Chesapeake vs Labs

Postby dogyak » Sun Jul 20, 2014 7:44 pm

Ok , I'm calling bs on this one . So it's not important to do your homework on a good gundog chessi , but you have too on a lab . Brother , I want some of what your smoking :lol: . The last I've look , chessi also have a hole lot of heath issues that breeders have cause all across the country . For the record , I've got friends who have them and hunted as well as trained for hunt test with them . They are well matter , never shown any meanness to any other dogs or people . Maybe those chessi's were rejects :huh: . Both breeds are good gundogs , and you've got to do your homework on both breeds to end up with the best dog you can with no heath issues with a strong desire prey drive , end of story ! :beer:
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Re: Chesapeake vs Labs

Postby HNTFSH » Sun Jul 20, 2014 7:49 pm

You are preaching to the choir on poorly bred animals who will spend a life working. Labs, Chessie, Weim - doesn't matter. There's no comparison of breed in that statement, only well versus poorly bred dogs.

Should I point out the number of Labs versus Chessies who are Field Trial Champions. That Is retrieving work and skilled tranability is it not? You obviously have not hunted with a well bred, or well trained, Lab based on your assertions.

The type of trainer or personality has nothing to do with being good 'training' a chessie. The question is why would I WANT to train one? If I have more to 'overcome' on a journey to excellence in the retriever skills, why not go with less idiosyncrasies? Because I am willing to trade superb trainability and bird drive for a dog that bites folks hands, attacks prison escapees and guards the duck?

I have hunted over some fine Weims BTW. Uncle lived in Germany and raised stock for hunting before being the base Vet at Langley AFB. Brought back stock and had a US breeding program. Since then and after have hunted and helped trained some excellent stock bird finders. Upland magic and a closer working dog than the typical GSP which is a benefit or disadvantage depending on territory and game.

You may idolize the Chessie and that's fine for you. I would not however cast so much doubt on the drive, perseverance, or all round capabilities of a well bred, well trained Lab.

I like Chessies for what they are. What they are doesn't serve me as well as a Lab though. Has nothing to do with my ability to not understand their strengths and weaknesses but more understand their strengths and weaknesses in comparison to what else is out there.

It's not a romantic thing as you seem to have - it's a reality thing.
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Re: Chesapeake vs Labs

Postby copterdoc » Sun Jul 20, 2014 7:51 pm

Just like the majority of the folks who browse this board, Beretta06 has never even seen a Field Bred Labrador Retriever.
Let alone owned, trained, or handled one.

As far as Chessies? Well I think they're great.
But, their owners are nuts.
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Re: Chesapeake vs Labs

Postby copterdoc » Sun Jul 20, 2014 7:59 pm

HNTFSH wrote:......It's not a romantic thing as you seem to have - it's a reality thing.
I read something posted on the RTF along those lines. About the mystique and romance surrounding the breed.

"Upon completing the last retrieve of the day, a battle weary Chessie sheds the water from his loins.
A tired Lab just curls up and licks his balls."
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