A Newbie and his Chesapeake

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A Newbie and his Chesapeake

Postby Go_Chessie » Sun Mar 02, 2014 5:02 pm

I have a 10 month old Chesapeake Bay Retriever that we rescued 2 months ago and I'm training her to be a gun dog. This is my first serious attempt at producing a dog that can hunt in the blind with me and my goal is to have her ready by Fall 2014.

The dog didn't have any form of obedience or boundaries at her former household, so I basically started from scratch with her. She is intelligent, athletic, and has drive. I'm at the point where I can shoot a .22 next to her and she doesn't flinch. Next step is to expose her to the feathers and the sound of a shotgun. Although she will return the decoy to hand on most retrieves she occasionally refuses to work for me and is downright defiant. I feel like we've made great progress over the last two months but I'm seeing minor signs of regression and defiance. I read in Roger Wolters' Gun Dog book that some dogs go through this stage between 8 and 10 months of age. Is there anything to this? Maybe this is normal behavior for a pup? Is it possible that I'm pushing her too hard?

I've had a Chesapeake in the past and have been around a lot of gun dogs, but I have yet to meet a dog with such a strong will. Should I consider an e-collar at this stage or is this something I just need to monitor and work through. Again, this may all be ordinary when training a dog, but it's all still new to me. Any advice you guys have would be much appreciated. I would especially like to hear from other CBR owners out there.

Thanks!
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Re: A Newbie and his Chesapeake

Postby Gj325 » Sun Mar 02, 2014 6:59 pm

I can't help you with the training. I have a 1 yr old female with Sharon Potter of Red Branch Kennels now will pick up this summer.
Good Luck with the training if you get a chance post up some photos.
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Re: A Newbie and his Chesapeake

Postby go get the bird » Sun Mar 02, 2014 7:13 pm

Go_Chessie wrote:I have a 10 month old Chesapeake Bay Retriever that we rescued 2 months ago and I'm training her to be a gun dog. This is my first serious attempt at producing a dog that can hunt in the blind with me and my goal is to have her ready by Fall 2014.

The dog didn't have any form of obedience or boundaries at her former household, so I basically started from scratch with her. She is intelligent, athletic, and has drive. I'm at the point where I can shoot a .22 next to her and she doesn't flinch. Next step is to expose her to the feathers and the sound of a shotgun. Although she will return the decoy to hand on most retrieves she occasionally refuses to work for me and is downright defiant. I feel like we've made great progress over the last two months but I'm seeing minor signs of regression and defiance. I read in Roger Wolters' Gun Dog book that some dogs go through this stage between 8 and 10 months of age. Is there anything to this? Maybe this is normal behavior for a pup? Is it possible that I'm pushing her too hard?

I've had a Chesapeake in the past and have been around a lot of gun dogs, but I have yet to meet a dog with such a strong will. Should I consider an e-collar at this stage or is this something I just need to monitor and work through. Again, this may all be ordinary when training a dog, but it's all still new to me. Any advice you guys have would be much appreciated. I would especially like to hear from other CBR owners out there.

Thanks!


Where did you start in the training? Did you start with simple here/heel/sit on a lead? What program are you following?

Heed my warning: Unless the dog has been CCd, DO NOT use the ecollar. You will only make things worse. First and foremost, you should reevaluate your position in the training. Does your dog understand what you are asking of it? If not, you need to step backwards. As a first time trainer of a 'peake, I can assure you I've had to step backwards countless times. Most of the time, it was my lack in ability to properly convey what I wanted. Very rarely was it the dog's fault.
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Re: A Newbie and his Chesapeake

Postby Gj325 » Sun Mar 02, 2014 7:17 pm

Sharon told me on the front end that it takes a 2x4 to train a CBR.

Everytime dog starts messing up she takes out 2x4 smacks herself in the head and says bad trainer.
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Re: A Newbie and his Chesapeake

Postby brsutton86 » Sun Mar 02, 2014 7:49 pm

E-collar should only be used on a command the dog already understands. Stick with the program your on. If its not working back up a step. Sometimes you can train on a certain thing 3 days in a row with not much change and all the sudden it clicks.
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Re: A Newbie and his Chesapeake

Postby go get the bird » Sun Mar 02, 2014 8:21 pm

brsutton86 wrote:E-collar should only be used on a command the dog already understands. Stick with the program your on. If its not working back up a step. Sometimes you can train on a certain thing 3 days in a row with not much change and all the sudden it clicks.

Couldn't agree more.

One day, we were running a lining drill in the park. I had the bumpers out at about 75 yards. Every time I'd send the beast, she'd haul ass to the pile, and run back, but she would suck towards the road, essentially making a bow shape. I couldn't figure it out, so I moved the pile closer. Same thing. Closer, same thing. I did this for like four days. I just couldn't figure it out. The next day, it clicked with me while driving to the park.

There was a white garbage bag in the ditch. She was trying to get close enough to figure out what it was. I let her run over to the bag once, she sniffed it, and ran back to me.

Straight lines, every time after.

It has to click with you before it can click with the dog.
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Re: A Newbie and his Chesapeake

Postby Duck_Popper » Mon Mar 03, 2014 2:06 am

Gj325 wrote:Sharon told me on the front end that it takes a 2x4 to train a CBR.

Everytime dog starts messing up she takes out 2x4 smacks herself in the head and says bad trainer.


That was pretty funny.
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Re: A Newbie and his Chesapeake

Postby Rick Hall » Mon Mar 03, 2014 5:13 am

The advice given so far has been remarkably sound. Would, however, add that any time you come to an impass, even if you're dead certain you've got it right and Pup dang well knows it, it can pay to back up anyway. Do some foundation work Pup gets right, then revisit the problem with that running start of recent successes.

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Re: A Newbie and his Chesapeake

Postby copterdoc » Mon Mar 03, 2014 5:37 am

It doesn't matter what breed of dog you are training. They ALL have to understand three things.

(1.) What they are supposed to do.
(2.) What the pressure they receive when they decide to not do it right MEANS.
(3.) What the reward that they receive when they decide to do it right MEANS.

You can dump piles of pressure, and piles of biscuits on any dog.
Neither one works, if the dog doesn't know why it happened.
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Re: A Newbie and his Chesapeake

Postby Go_Chessie » Mon Mar 03, 2014 8:52 am

One thing that I failed to mention in my original post is that I'm not trying to produce "the ultimate retriever". There will be no field trials or competitions for my dog. My chessie is a family dog first. However, I want her to be reliable and trained just enough to do some live retrieves in the rivers/ponds that I hunt.

A good analogy is that I'm not trying to produce a Division 1 athlete, a starter on the JV or Vasity is good enough for me.
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Re: A Newbie and his Chesapeake

Postby HNTFSH » Mon Mar 03, 2014 9:03 am

Go_Chessie wrote:One thing that I failed to mention in my original post is that I'm not trying to produce "the ultimate retriever". There will be no field trials or competitions for my dog. My chessie is a family dog first. However, I want her to be reliable and trained just enough to do some live retrieves in the rivers/ponds that I hunt.

A good analogy is that I'm not trying to produce a Division 1 athlete, a starter on the JV or Vasity is good enough for me.


Then better to describe all the elements you'll need the dog to perform as a hunting dog in all respects now and in the future. Using descriptions as you have don't tell a good dog trainer much at all.
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Re: A Newbie and his Chesapeake

Postby Rick Hall » Mon Mar 03, 2014 9:07 am

Go_Chessie wrote:One thing that I failed to mention in my original post is that I'm not trying to produce "the ultimate retriever". There will be no field trials or competitions for my dog. My chessie is a family dog first. However, I want her to be reliable and trained just enough to do some live retrieves in the rivers/ponds that I hunt.

A good analogy is that I'm not trying to produce a Division 1 athlete, a starter on the JV or Vasity is good enough for me.


With regard to what you've asked or been told here so far, that doesn't make a lick of difference. The principles addressed are the same.
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Re: A Newbie and his Chesapeake

Postby Go_Chessie » Mon Mar 03, 2014 9:54 am

HNTFSH wrote:Then better to describe all the elements you'll need the dog to perform as a hunting dog in all respects now and in the future. Using descriptions as you have don't tell a good dog trainer much at all.


My last comment was intended to provide some context to the original questions regarding defiance, pup behavior, e-collars, etc.
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Re: A Newbie and his Chesapeake

Postby HNTFSH » Mon Mar 03, 2014 10:10 am

Go_Chessie wrote:
HNTFSH wrote:Then better to describe all the elements you'll need the dog to perform as a hunting dog in all respects now and in the future. Using descriptions as you have don't tell a good dog trainer much at all.


My last comment was intended to provide some context to the original questions regarding defiance, pup behavior, e-collars, etc.


Try again on what type of performance you expect and people will understand. If you cannot do that - you really don't know what level and skills you want or need. THAT would make it difficult to be of help.
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Re: A Newbie and his Chesapeake

Postby TomKat » Mon Mar 03, 2014 12:22 pm

Where is pup at with basic obedience?

It's best to have a foundation to build a house (or training program) on.
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Re: A Newbie and his Chesapeake

Postby solway gunner » Mon Mar 03, 2014 12:29 pm

Can we see a picture of her?i dont know what happened to the regular chessie guys that used to post on here that may have helped you,but there was once some 1950s footage of US dog trainers in a small film -it was great and i meant to copy it but forgot.Anyway ,i remember there was a chessie trainer with a deadgrass dog who had been placed on the naughty chair by the look of things-and was made to watch on as the trainer waded into the pond to retrieve the dummy,i thought,yes, i can relate to that.. :yes:
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Re: A Newbie and his Chesapeake

Postby Go_Chessie » Tue Mar 04, 2014 10:29 am

Thank you everyone for your responses. After thinking about some of the responses and follow-up questions, it probably makes sense for me to step back and further define what I need my pup to do. I also think I need to reinforce basic obedience. Good call on building a solid foundation.

Here is a picture of my pup.

gi_chessie_pup.jpg
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Re: A Newbie and his Chesapeake

Postby solway gunner » Tue Mar 04, 2014 2:17 pm

She looks interesting.,any signs of trying it on with you /dominance issues?How far have you got-does she walk to heel and stop/recall to whistle?
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Re: A Newbie and his Chesapeake

Postby Willie » Tue Mar 04, 2014 2:44 pm

Go_Chessie wrote:Thank you everyone for your responses. After thinking about some of the responses and follow-up questions, it probably makes sense for me to step back and further define what I need my pup to do. I also think I need to reinforce basic obedience. Good call on building a solid foundation.

Here is a picture of my pup.

gi_chessie_pup.jpg


What the guys are trying to explain to you is that even for a starter on the JV or Varsity team, you still need to learn the basics/rules of the game...to PROPERLY throw/catch, block/tackle, conditioning, etc, and build from there. Then, if you want to play on the AAU team and eventually go D1, sharpen what you've already learned, get stronger, smarter, etc. Same philosopy applies to the dawg training.

Get you a good playbook (training program) and learn from there.
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Re: A Newbie and his Chesapeake

Postby Go_Chessie » Tue Mar 04, 2014 4:33 pm

Willie wrote:What the guys are trying to explain to you is that even for a starter on the JV or Varsity team, you still need to learn the basics/rules of the game...to PROPERLY throw/catch, block/tackle, conditioning, etc, and build from there. Then, if you want to play on the AAU team and eventually go D1, sharpen what you've already learned, get stronger, smarter, etc. Same philosopy applies to the dawg training.

Get you a good playbook (training program) and learn from there.


Thanks for the feedback. I definitely need to do some homework.
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Re: A Newbie and his Chesapeake

Postby culot » Wed Mar 05, 2014 3:42 pm

Hi,

i have 3 chessies in past, followed by 2 Labs ( still got them ) an since 3 year a Chessie again
Chessies are a Retriver but never think it's a Lab :wink: Chessies takes more of you,
and you have to find the " right buttons " if you understand a Swedes crappy english :smile:

Chessies was the first breed i owned myself, and i got my first 27 years ago.
have you owned a chessie you never forget :beer:

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