Dog bell

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Dog bell

Postby FLT MEDIC » Wed Mar 12, 2014 11:32 am

Anyone use a bell while hunting upland. I have a tiny brittany and I loose sight of him all the time while hunting in tall sage. He is a big runner for a brittany and I can't always tell if he is on point or just running in tall grass sage or behind rocks. I feel like his neck is really small in diameter and may not accommodate an e collar and beeper. Plus a bell is only a few bucks. Anyone's experience with this or suggestions is appreciated. Thank you.
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Re: Dog bell

Postby Rick Hall » Wed Mar 12, 2014 11:44 am

Bells don't ring when you need them most, but beepers beep when you need them to. If you do decide to go with a bell and Pup has any wheels at all, go big. The most satisfactory bell I ever had was an antique goat bell:
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Far and away my favorite beeper came with the Tritronics Upland Special e- and beeper combo and could be turned on and off from the transmitter, but there are standalone beepers that will do a fine job for you.
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Re: Dog bell

Postby Dakota Creek » Wed Mar 12, 2014 12:25 pm

Yup .... bell user here! We hunt a number areas of areas where you are unable to see the dogs working and I like that I can hear them even if I can't see them. As well, we use different bells (therefore different sounds) on the working dogs so you can determine which dog is where.

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Re: Dog bell

Postby HNTFSH » Wed Mar 12, 2014 1:52 pm

I don't use a bell nor do my partners. Running birds (Pheasant) we believe it pushes birds and makes the exact location of the dog more apparent. Would be fine on pen raised birds. As Rick suggested a remote beeper allows you to briefly locate a dog in addition to not listening to a beeper while enjoying a hunt. That can be annoying.

I'd orange vest a smaller dog. The labs are big enough to track by sound in the tall stuff.
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Re: Dog bell

Postby Rick Hall » Wed Mar 12, 2014 2:05 pm

HNTFSH wrote:I don't use a bell nor do my partners. Running birds (Pheasant) we believe it pushes birds and makes the exact location of the dog more apparent.


Having hunted wild, run prone birds with both close workers and wide ranging pointing dogs, I've concluded it's the man behind the dog, more than the dog itself, that pushes birds, unless the dog is stalking/creeping like a predator that has it located. As long as the dog is well removed from the man, which is also well beyond common flushing dog range, I think it a good thing that birds know exactly where the dog is at and think hiding is working until the dog the bird thought was missing it suddenly stops and the standoff begins. There, again, as long as hiding seems to be working, which the beeper on a staunch dog confirms, the bird's apt to stay put at least until another danger, man, enters the picture. And if that man knows what he's doing, he'll arrive in a manner that makes the bird think hiding is still working until he's got it in a pickle between dog and gun.
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Re: Dog bell

Postby HNTFSH » Wed Mar 12, 2014 2:29 pm

Rick Hall wrote:
HNTFSH wrote:I don't use a bell nor do my partners. Running birds (Pheasant) we believe it pushes birds and makes the exact location of the dog more apparent.


Having hunted wild, run prone birds with both close workers and wide ranging pointing dogs, I've concluded it's the man behind the dog, more than the dog itself, that pushes birds, unless the dog is stalking/creeping like a predator that has it located. As long as the dog is well removed from the man, which is also well beyond common flushing dog range, I think it a good thing that birds know exactly where the dog is at and think hiding is working until the dog the bird thought was missing it suddenly stops and the standoff begins. There, again, as long as hiding seems to be working, which the beeper on a staunch dog confirms, the bird's apt to stay put at least until another danger, man, enters the picture. And if that man knows what he's doing, he'll arrive in a manner that makes the bird think hiding is still working until he's got it in a pickle between dog and gun.


Shame on the hunter then. Dogs hunt the birds not the man and anyone pushing the bird, or allowing others to, is sure mistaking the game.

Don't know many that slam the truck door when arriving at the deer spot in the dark either. Bell no different.

The idea around here is work the bird, confuse the bird and await the birds mistake (flight). Be great if they held more often but about the 29th guy that's chased 'em - they just prefer escape by ground and the pathways out well defined. Good number of birds flushed at feet mean bird worked to hunter.

Bell theory comes from both flushing and pointing dogs here on wild birds. Might by mistake we take near the top 10% number of Roosters in a year.
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Re: Dog bell

Postby Rick Hall » Wed Mar 12, 2014 2:45 pm

You da man, Stan.
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Re: Dog bell

Postby HNTFSH » Wed Mar 12, 2014 3:03 pm

Rick Hall wrote:You da man, Stan.


Don't know about that. Do put a bit of time and effort in it though.
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Re: Dog bell

Postby Dakota Creek » Thu Mar 13, 2014 7:00 am

Agreed that the bell may push birds, but for the areas we hunt with heavier (read tall) cover it also gives you the ability to gauge the distance the dog is away from you working the cover and where they are. Rather than in front of you, are they working on a bird off to your side or following a bird that is swinging back behind you.

Besides .... IMO can't think of anything more enjoyable than working a field on a sunny cool morning listening to the bells tinking as the dogs are working and someone yelling "Rooster"! :biggrin:
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Re: Dog bell

Postby HNTFSH » Thu Mar 13, 2014 7:56 am

Dakota Creek wrote:Agreed that the bell may push birds, but for the areas we hunt with heavier (read tall) cover it also gives you the ability to gauge the distance the dog is away from you working the cover and where they are. Rather than in front of you, are they working on a bird off to your side or following a bird that is swinging back behind you.

Besides .... IMO can't think of anything more enjoyable than working a field on a sunny cool morning listening to the bells tinking as the dogs are working and someone yelling "Rooster"! :biggrin:


Like most thing opinion related, regardless of how many times one says it - where and how you hunt drive a lot of behavior and belief. I know our approach to upland and Roosters would vary quite a bit in Kansas or Nebraska versus Ohio. Our tall grasses are all switch grass. That which you can readily track a dog in the tall stuff by sound alone. Heck - that tail beating grass alone can tell you how close the dog is to a bird, and the hunter readiness thereof.

Another reason trained silent sit. If unseen and perhaps too far out you silent sit the dog and walk up, the release again. Be it Pointer or flushing dog nobody I know can shoot a wild flush at 100 yards. Busting up maybe two Roosters in a day makes them all count if you want a bag.

Chocolate was pretty easy to see in the field. My now Yellow will be tougher. I don't care for vests but an orange will be on next year. I used to use bells as did my Pointer friends. I do believe we gained more without just had to adjust.

I agree they sound nice, somewhat reminiscent of the early 70's behind GSP's in the morning and I wouldn't hesitate a moment on Game Farms.
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Re: Dog bell

Postby Rick Hall » Thu Mar 13, 2014 8:26 am

Folks, the OP has a pointing dog with wheels. Hunt it most anywhere but short grass prairie without a locator of some sort and you've got problems.
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Re: Dog bell

Postby HNTFSH » Thu Mar 13, 2014 8:31 am

HNTFSH wrote:As Rick suggested a remote beeper allows you to briefly locate a dog in addition to not listening to a beeper while enjoying a hunt.


Don't think a bell would help much.
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Re: Dog bell

Postby Rick Hall » Thu Mar 13, 2014 8:33 am

Unless it's too small to hear at the ranges the dog works, it would help a dang sight more than nothing.
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Re: Dog bell

Postby HNTFSH » Thu Mar 13, 2014 8:47 am

Rick Hall wrote:Unless it's too small to hear at the ranges the dog works, it would help a dang sight more than nothing.


Don't know the OP or his dog so can't comment on form. It could be maybe big wheel needs to be reeled in.

Wouldn't be the first time. But then again a good friend trials English Pointers on horseback and needs a GPS unit on his dogs to train.
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Re: Dog bell

Postby Rick Hall » Thu Mar 13, 2014 8:53 am

Again, I've had and hunted far more extensively than most over both and like my chances with wheels. (Cut my wingshooting teeth in your state hunting pheasants with GSP guys who thought anything white was a run-off. Later learned they just didn't know how much they didn't know.)
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Re: Dog bell

Postby HNTFSH » Thu Mar 13, 2014 9:06 am

Rick Hall wrote:Again, I've had and hunted far more extensively than most over both and like my chances with wheels. (Cut my wingshooting teeth in your state hunting pheasants with GSP guys who thought anything white was a run-off. Later learned they just didn't know how much they didn't know.)


Plenty of those boots in the field. You should come up and run wild birds with me. I'm guessing it's a been a couple decades for ya on public grounds round here.
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Re: Dog bell

Postby Rick Hall » Thu Mar 13, 2014 9:57 am

HNTFSH wrote:
Rick Hall wrote:Again, I've had and hunted far more extensively than most over both and like my chances with wheels. (Cut my wingshooting teeth in your state hunting pheasants with GSP guys who thought anything white was a run-off. Later learned they just didn't know how much they didn't know.)


Plenty of those boots in the field. You should come up and run wild birds with me. I'm guessing it's a been a couple decades for ya on public grounds round here.


I would rather bet I haven't shot a wild pheasant on public land in Ohio than that I have. The friend's father and his buddies who started me belonged to clubs that leased and stocked private farms, both in Spring and pre-season. (Maybe during, too, don't remember.) Pretty sure they took me because my father having done time as a small town minister also opened a few gates to wild birds for them. We stayed clear of the circus on public areas. Later, when I'd moved to the southeast corner of the state, I'd shoot some refugee pheasants on Salt Fork on my way to or from visits with my folks, but almost always in woodcock coverts well away from stocking areas. Also shot pheasants at Killdeer Plains, where some claimed there were wild birds in the unstocked waterfowl lottery hunt area that was opened to small game after those hunts, but the odds against them being anything but refugees were mighty slim. Was, however, blessed to have a friend who worked at Killdeer with some good area contacts for wild birds on what area farms weren't yet road-to-road crops.

Given the incredible pressure on public lands then, it flips me out that you say Ohio still has any public wild pheasant hunting now.
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Re: Dog bell

Postby HNTFSH » Thu Mar 13, 2014 10:33 am

Rick Hall wrote:Given the incredible pressure on public lands then, it flips me out that you say Ohio still has any public wild pheasant hunting now.


Wouldn't have thought so 20 years ago and would have been right. All it requires for population is habitat. Between land filter strips of CRP, planted CRP, Landowner willing of parcels, State planting on their grounds...the birds have returned over the last 15 years. You won't find good habitat or population at the likes of major public land draws...just released birds.

State bird guys joke about the grocery store release of birds and enjoy the fact it draws all the surrounding Elmer Fudd's and their Pointers with Pin-ball sounding collars. A zoo to be sure and expect some lead rain if you participate. I'll take a young dog on those grounds a few days after release and do a 2:00 pm hunt just to work the dog. Fact is 20 minutes in that field with a decent dog tells you if any birds were released in that area at all.

The biggest challenge now on wild birds is all the planted CRP surrounding the huntable stuff. Doesn't take long for the bird to figure out the next fence row over is danger free, except for Coyotes.

So as it goes - if you have a big wheelin dog pushing birds on the 30 acre plot you are working birds, you'll likely get run to a fence row you cannot cross to hunt.
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Re: Dog bell

Postby ScaupHunter » Thu Mar 13, 2014 10:36 am

Collars for an ecollar can be adjusted for small dogs and extra holes can be drilled in the collar very easily.

The Dogtra T & B 2500 has shock and tone options. You can set it so it beeps when the dog is on point. You can set it to regularly beep when the dog is working and go silent when it is on point, etc.......

Bella is a flushing lab, so apples and oranges for the OP here, my experience working Bella in thick cover using the Dogtra has been excellent. I can hit a single or double tone manually to find her when I need to, or just to check on her location and distance from me when I loose her in tall sagebrush or grain fields. I have also trained her to tone commands so I can work her with the tone button while she is looking for and working birds.
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Re: Dog bell

Postby Rick Hall » Thu Mar 13, 2014 11:56 am

HNTFSH wrote:
Rick Hall wrote:Given the incredible pressure on public lands then, it flips me out that you say Ohio still has any public wild pheasant hunting now.


Wouldn't have thought so 20 years ago and would have been right. All it requires for population is habitat. Between land filter strips of CRP, planted CRP, Landowner willing of parcels, State planting on their grounds...the birds have returned over the last 15 years. You won't find good habitat or population at the likes of major public land draws...just released birds.

State bird guys joke about the grocery store release of birds and enjoy the fact it draws all the surrounding Elmer Fudd's and their Pointers with Pin-ball sounding collars. A zoo to be sure and expect some lead rain if you participate. I'll take a young dog on those grounds a few days after release and do a 2:00 pm hunt just to work the dog. Fact is 20 minutes in that field with a decent dog tells you if any birds were released in that area at all.

The biggest challenge now on wild birds is all the planted CRP surrounding the huntable stuff. Doesn't take long for the bird to figure out the next fence row over is danger free, except for Coyotes.

So as it goes - if you have a big wheelin dog pushing birds on the 30 acre plot you are working birds, you'll likely get run to a fence row you cannot cross to hunt.


Say what you will, I still can't believe there are enough wild pheasants to make a casserole on public land open to hunting in Ohio. As an upland bird biologist once said, "Every time we create a covey on public land, we're also creating two hunters and four dogs." Hard to believe that's not the case in any well populated state.
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Re: Dog bell

Postby HNTFSH » Thu Mar 13, 2014 1:37 pm

Rick Hall wrote:
Say what you will, I still can't believe there are enough wild pheasants to make a casserole on public land open to hunting in Ohio. As an upland bird biologist once said, "Every time we create a covey on public land, we're also creating two hunters and four dogs." Hard to believe that's not the case in any well populated state.


Not everything in Ohio is 30 years ago Rick. As long as the uninformed here believe the same too, we'll have some good hunting. Love guys like you.
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Re: Dog bell

Postby Rick Hall » Thu Mar 13, 2014 2:45 pm

HNTFSH wrote:
Rick Hall wrote:
Say what you will, I still can't believe there are enough wild pheasants to make a casserole on public land open to hunting in Ohio. As an upland bird biologist once said, "Every time we create a covey on public land, we're also creating two hunters and four dogs." Hard to believe that's not the case in any well populated state.


Not everything in Ohio is 30 years ago Rick.


Of course not, a million more people live there now.
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Re: Dog bell

Postby OHIODUCKA5 » Thu Mar 13, 2014 2:51 pm

HNT, I don't know what part of the state you are in , but there isn't a wild pheasant in the 5 counties I hunt on public or private land. They release a bunch, the ones that dont get shot end up as coyote food.
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Re: Dog bell

Postby ScaupHunter » Thu Mar 13, 2014 3:05 pm

It is the same in Washington. Anything you might call wild just managed to escape last season and evaded the Coyotes. I would bet that less than 1% make it from one season to the next here.
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Re: Dog bell

Postby HNTFSH » Thu Mar 13, 2014 3:10 pm

Rick Hall wrote:
HNTFSH wrote:
Rick Hall wrote:
Say what you will, I still can't believe there are enough wild pheasants to make a casserole on public land open to hunting in Ohio. As an upland bird biologist once said, "Every time we create a covey on public land, we're also creating two hunters and four dogs." Hard to believe that's not the case in any well populated state.


Not everything in Ohio is 30 years ago Rick.


Of course not, a million more people live there now.


And thousands of acres of prime habitat that didn't exist. You must also believe the Biologists that crow count in the Spring do so after the throw the bird off the truck. And that all the State biologists, game folks, rabid Pheasant enthusiasts and people who actually live/hunt here conspire to lie to Rick Hall. I thought you knew something about habitat and it's relationship to bird population.
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