Need advice on buying an auto!!!

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Need advice on buying an auto!!!

Postby kilndux » Wed Jan 07, 2004 3:07 am

I am in the market for a 3.5 inch auto that will be used for ducks and geese. Yeah, after 12 years with my trusty 870's, its time for something new and automatic. Besides, cant bum 3.5 inchers off my friends, lol.

My brother uses an 11-87, he likes it.
Two of my friends use Browning Golds and they claim its the best.
My other buddy uses a Benelli Black Eagle and he likes it.

Now, if I go with the 1187, I will quickly adjust cuz of similiarities with the 870s. I have shot my brothers and like it.

I have seen the Super Black Eagle and like not only the raised rib, but also the Xtra shell trick.

I have shot my other buddies' Browing Golds and didn't mind it. Killed a couple dux. Saw one jam.

WHICH GUN SHOULD I GO WITH?
Mybuddies who own the browning golds talk smack about the benellis so i could use a little input on those. And has anyone been shooting the Beretta Extrema ? I read some nice reviews on that gun.
Thanks
I'd rather be hunting.
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Postby 10ga » Wed Jan 07, 2004 3:41 pm

i personally shoot a super X2 Winchester, but before you buy anything try out the new mossberg 935. you can get one for $500 and if i were in the market for a new auto loader it would be the gun. the sbe are over-rated, and the 11-87 has a lot of problems with ejecting 2 3/4" shells. the browning gold is a great gun. for the $$ you won't be able to beat the mossberg. just my .02
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Auto's ???

Postby Str8Meat » Wed Jan 07, 2004 6:47 pm

1. Berretta Extrema 3.5
2. Browning Gold 3.5
3. Benelli SBE
4. Win. Super X2
All of the above.
CAMO UP, CALL EM IN, CUT EM ALL
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Postby jubnut » Thu Jan 08, 2004 12:55 pm

howdy, i reckon that for reliability, pointability and quality you just can't beat a Remi, i have an m1100 and i just can't fault it. go with the 1187 and you will be a happy happy man.
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Postby berettaman » Fri Jan 09, 2004 11:09 pm

I have to disagree with Jubnut....sorry Sir but remington is junk :( . I live in the State they are produced (NY) and am ashamed at the poor quality firearms they produce. I would rather not hunt if I had to shoot a remington.......actually I did own one and I take it back, it works really well, as a boat anchor. It even has a nifty spot to tie the rope to. :lol:

I exclusively shoot a Beretta 391 Urika and a browning gold.....no jams=more dead birds. Go with a beretta 391 and you won't be disappointed.
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Postby jubnut » Sat Jan 10, 2004 6:49 am

ah mate i've had this remi for ages and i have never ever had a problem with it. i know several gamekeepers who use them daily and they come i for saome rough treatment and still maintain their reliability time after time. as for browning and berretta i wouldn't have one, not due to any prejudice but where i am it is extremely hard to get spare parts for them as their depot is somewhere stupid like australia. so it makes choosing them a bit of a risk. howeveri did know a man who had a benelli which was a fine weapon and i have known mossbergs but my opinion of them is that they are very rough and nasty weapons, anyway my personal opinion is remi every time, obviously you have had some bad experiences.
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Postby jubnut » Sat Jan 10, 2004 6:56 am

Ah - i have heard that the 3 inch version of the m1100 has a problem with jamsi don't know wether this is true as mine is 2 3/4 chambers
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Postby berettaman » Sat Jan 10, 2004 10:26 pm

Bad experience does not even begin to describe my ordeal with my 3inch 1100. I came pretty close to tossing it in the river last season. To sum it up, last flight of birds for the day....two birds shy of the limit and a perfect set in front of me.....end up one shy of the limit due to a jam after the first shot.

Truth of the matter is that it jams more than it cycles and I won't have it. My browning gold will hang about every 75 rounds and the beretta is yet to hang in all kinds of conditions. I simply wont stand for a gun that jams. I know three people who own them and all of them are a POS. I prefer my beretta 391.

My bro has switched to an o/u exclusively and I have two as well (browning citori and beretta bl-1)....for those nasty days, I sometimes take it as I know I will always have 2 shots and not have to worry about a possible jam. Of course with the new 391 I don't usiually think about jams.

My advice.......get a beretta 391 and you will not be unhappy.
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Postby Worc » Thu Jan 22, 2004 12:28 pm

I have a Browning Gold 3 1/2. In the last three years I have never had a single jam. It gets cleaned only a few times during duck season. My best buddy has a Winchester Super X-2. he has only had one jam due to ice in tthe same time frame. My other buddy has a SBE. In the last four years I've seen it jam a least 6-8 times and the bolt handle fell out and was lost. Both the Browning and Winchester will cycle H.V. 7/8 loads. The SBE won't. I've put 100 rounds thru a beretta xtrema and Franchi 912 each. They both shot fine. I don't hunt with their owners so, I can't comment on their feild performance. They are both "BIG" guns! He are my picks in order.

1. Browning "Gold"

2. Winchester "Super X-2"

3. Benelli "SBE"

4. Franchi "912"

5. Beretta "Xtrema"
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autos

Postby jonnyp390 » Fri Jan 23, 2004 10:46 am

Kilndux,
I think that you have got some great advice here to sort out. I think that the bottom line here is that any of the guns listed will work just fine for you, as long as you stay with the name brands (I woudn't rush out and buy a $179.99 auto imported by European American Arms). I work in the gun department of a large nationwide hunting store and I have come to realize that asking a guy which shotgun is the best can be equated to asking them what brand of truck is the best, or arguing over the merits of blondes, brunettes or redheads. Everyone has their own and different opinion.

With that said, I will give you my own, admittedly biased, opinion. I have shot just about every semi auto on the market and both of the semi's I own are Berettas. I have used them for every type of shotgunning; waterfowl, upland, skeet, trap, and sporting clays. I have shot close to 2,000 rounds through my synthetic 390 without cleaning it and never had a jam. But, this does not mean that I doubt that a benelli, remington, or browning will do the same. They probably could, it's just that I have had excellent success with my beretta and I will stick with it as long as it stays reliable and dependable. The last peice of advice that I will give you is try to catch a sporting clays event on TV (Outdoor Life Channel or ESPN if you have cable). I know that sporting clays is a lot different than duck hunting in extreme weather conditions, but the overall goal of the shooter is the same; both want a gun that will handle well, pattern well, have the least amount of recoil possible, and most importantly cycle reliably. If anyone is picky about the performance of their gun it is a target shooter, where a jam could cost a whole lot of prize money. For that reason most of the guys you see will be shooting over and unders. Ignore them. Look at the guys shooting autos. You may see one or two shooting a remington or even a benelli. But the majority of the autos you see will browning golds or Beretta 391's. If you go with the beretta, I don't think you will be disapointed. If you like the Browning, I would strongly advise you to check out the Winchester Super X2. Both companies are owned by FN and both guns have an identicle gas system (Ask the salesman to pull the foreend off each gun to show you). There is a magazine cutoff on the browning, but most guys don't end up using those anyway. I personally like the wide rib on the X2 a little better, it costs about $100 less, and right now they have a rebate going where you get a free leather jacket when you buy one.

Good luck with your decision, sorry the message is so lengthy.

Jonny P
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Benelli Super Black Eagle

Postby earlyriser » Fri Jan 23, 2004 2:09 pm

If you have the money go with the Benelli Super Black Eagle. This gun will not let you down!
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Decision reached!

Postby kilndux » Fri Jan 23, 2004 10:56 pm

I have decided to go with the Benelli SBE. This decision was not easy, but no other gun felt as good in my hands and when pulled up "for a shot" the raised rib made sighting down the barrel effortless. ( Didn't have to lower my head/cheek down tight to the barrel like on some guns).

Now my decision is what length of barrel do I need? Couple friends of mine say to get a 26 inch barrel for easy swinging while hunting ducks.
Anyone have any suggestions???
Thanks to all that have replied.
I'd rather be hunting.
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barrel length for your SBE

Postby jonnyp390 » Sun Jan 25, 2004 12:07 am

Hey Kilndux,
What was the barrel length of your 870? If your trusty 870 was a 28" and you shoot that well, I would agree with your friend to go with a 26" barrel on your SBE. The reason for this is that the reciever on the SBE is longer to accomodate the 3 1/2" shells. You will find that a 26" SBE will have about the same overall length as a 28" 870. This way the amount of effective lead you have to give a bird will stay pretty consistent with both guns.

good luck and good hunting
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Postby phillipstd » Sat Jan 31, 2004 12:49 pm

I have a sbe and I've seen alot of other guns jam or misfire, get dirty and won't eject, freeze, they'r not gas operated like a berretta, so they don't get as dirty and you don 't loose anything off your shell, as far as fps, I don't know how anybody could contest that there not the ultimate 3.5 auto for hunting, they are by far, and if anybody thinks other wise it's cause they have a pre determined opinon from one brand the the next, and they didn't do there research before they made that opinion or bought a gun, the sbe is the cleanest and worry free gun I've seen, and most importantly it doesn't use the shells gas to eject the shell.
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www.MARSHMUTT.com
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Postby marksl » Wed Feb 04, 2004 1:24 pm

I am in the market for my first 3.5 inch semi-auto. I own quit a few other shotguns but none for ducks and geese. Any thoughts on the Stoger model 2000. Cost is a consideration and this will run @ $495. Is $799 a good price for a Super X2?
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Postby Worc » Fri Feb 06, 2004 12:10 pm

The Stoeger is not a 3 1/2" gun. $800.00 for the Super X-2 is a pretty good price as long as it's for the 3 1/2" model. Add about $100.00 for the camo. Look as much as possible before buying and pick the one YOU like best.

As far as the SBE being the ultimate 3 1/2" shotgun.... I don't think so! I'll admit they are nice but, not as problem free as some of their owners claim. I've seen first hand one jam several times and even loose it's bolt handle. Mind you this is a well maintained 5 year old gun. I'm not saying that they are all bad. I would say there is as high as or higher percentage of failers of this gun as compared to the other high end 3 1/2's". By talking to owners first hand and reading posts on different sites confirms it.
I hear things like. Install a Sure Cycle kit's in the stock ($100.00) and magazine tube ($25.00) for reliable cycling. You have to use aftermarket tubes ($50.00 +) for good patterns. Make sure you push the bolt foward before you shoot so you don't hear the dreaded Benelli "click". Make sure the stock is firmly planted on overhead shoots or the ineritia system won't work. Make sure the bolt is well lubed at all times. Benelli's customer service is the worst.
It's no more relaible than a well designed gas system. If it were the new M-4 would be inerita operated not gas. By the way the Benelli M-4 is the U.S. militaries new shotgun. Besides, the most reliable firearm is gas operated. The AK-47.
Don't get me wrong, I'm not bashing the SBE. Infact I like it better than most other semi-auto 3 1/2" shotguns. Just my un-predetermined opinion!
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Postby marksl » Fri Feb 06, 2004 1:19 pm

Thanks, I was all set to order a Winchester Super X when I spotted the Mossberg 935 on the shelf. It shouldered well but is pretty hefty, which is probably a good thing. It only shoots 3's and 3.5 though. I'll keep looking.
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Look at a guns fit!!!!!!!!!

Postby ohsobad_hunter » Thu Jul 15, 2004 8:45 am

There is only one thing that you need to consider when buying a new auto. You need to see if the gun fits or feels right to you. It doesnt matter if you are shooting a Beretta, Browning, Benelli (I have shot them all) The gun should fit you and then you should worry about the functionality.

just my .02
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Winchester Super X2

Postby X2durable » Sat Jan 08, 2005 9:24 pm

X2 durable = twice as durable.

I'll point any person in the market for a new "do-all" shotgun towards the Winchester Super X2. As a person that truly needed a shotgun for everything (deer, turkey, geese, ducks, pheasants, quail, doves, sporting clays, etc), I didn't need to buy 3 or 4 different guns. So I made the best gun purchase I ever made!

Ok...here's the story on the Winchester Super X2. In 1999, the X2 was introduced by Winchester. As most of you know...the investors at Browning bought Winchester and decided to expand upon their already successful rifle line. As I understand it, a gentleman by the name of Jose Rousseau was the project leader responsible for the reintroduction of auto-shotguns to Winchester. This auto-shotgun (Super X2) was to be based off of the already proven Browning Gold. The Browning Gold is a good gun, however, during development, financial constraints did not allow the project team to design "the gun of all guns" that they felt needed to be built. With few financial constraints enacted upon then, and using the Browning Gold as a "base", the project team built "the gun of all guns", the Super X2.

My first trip to Canada w/ the Super X2 was accompanied by an Rem 11-87, (2) Benelli SBE, & Beretta 391. I'm sure that most of you know what the conditions are like in Canada. The 3" and 3.5" shells are enough, but It's amazing...You can actually be standing in mud while dirt is blowing in your face. It's rough going for ANY gun. Long story short, after two hours of hard pounding, one Benelli and the Beretta were in pieces on the floorboard of the truck. Good news is we got them working later that evening after a good cleaning. The next day both Benelli's, the Beretta, and the 11-87 went down. We took them apart, cleaned them, and we were back in action. Needless to say the X2, with dirt, straw, and mud hanging from the receiver kept hammering away.

My second trip to Canada was basically a repeat of year one. This time, I took a back-up. Before leaving, I bought a 2nd brand new Super X2. I knew how frustrated my friends were when their guns went down, and I wasn't going to let this happen to me. After tearing down his Benellis SBE for the third time in three hours, my buddy came to me and asked if it'd be alright if he borrowed my second X2 (still in the box). No problem..they're meant to be shot, right??? Needless to say, that was the last shot he ever fired through the Benelli. He traded up for an X2 when we got back to the States.

Shotgun Speed!!!!
You hear it all the time, and every gun manufacturer has a trick shooter that tells you how fast their shotgun is. Well, I found an article called "Speed Shotgun" by Patrick Kelley. All excerpts below are from this article. Interesting stuff regarding the cycle times of stock shotguns.

Remington 1100/11-87 = "Shot-to-shot speed stops at 14 hundredths. While it is possible to pull the trigger faster, the disconnect will not reset until the bolt is fully closed."

Benelli M1 Super 90 = " 13 hundredths of a second. That's it. Any faster, and the hammer follows the bolt. Some of the testing I have on video tape documents 11 of the aforementioned hammer follows in 50 rounds fired. For all that fanfare, "the world's fastest shotgun" is one lousy hundredth faster than the Remington 1100."

Browning Auto 5 (let's face it, there's a ton of these out there, and don't you want to know where your gun stacks up?) = " the Browning Auto 5 proved itself to be faster than the "world's fastest cycling shotgun," leaving the Benelli buried in its empty hulls." Spooky huh? 1900 technology faster than 2000 technology??? Marketing is an amazing thing isn't it?

Browning Gold/Super X2 (these are grouped together because the cycling action of the guns are identical) = 11 hundredths of a second. In fact... "Idaho state police officer David Neth....(fired off) five shots in 51 hundredths! The splits were three .13's and one .12. This gun is full auto fast! By the way, this was with Federal 00 buck. No, not the low recoil stuff, this was Federal MAX 2 3/4 Classic."

Interesting stuff.... Winchester Super X2 Reliable (see Canada story above), Fast (see #'s above), Easy Maintenance (I blow it out w/ an air hose after every hunt, and Scotch Brite the powder build up).

Have fun and happy hunting!
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Postby Waterfowl_Widowmaker » Sun Jan 09, 2005 5:16 am

man thats some cool stuff to know but what is the mossbergs 935 speed on all this man
why do whales beach themselves?
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Postby tome » Sun Jan 09, 2005 9:51 am

I don't know how the SBE 2 is w/ 31/2 ", but my SBE will ring your chimes w/ a 31/2'..the only time i use the 31/2' is for turkey..i was pattering on a bench..you'd think it was a 500 express the way it kicked..i got a 10 oz mule for the stock..helped but still not pleasent..if you want to shoot a lot of 31/2 " ...get a gas gun
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Mossberg 935

Postby X2durable » Mon Jan 10, 2005 8:10 pm

Not sure on cycle times of a 935. I've been looking around on the internet, but have not seen any studies done yet. As soon as I find something, I will post. Happy hunting!
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