better "used" shotgun?

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better "used" shotgun?

Postby DuckManClyde » Sat Dec 21, 2013 9:36 pm

as i am in the market for a new gun i like to spend alot of time online researching about almost every model in my price range. its really come down to these 3 guns. A brand NEW weatherby pa08, a USED bps, or a USED 870 WM. the bps seems to be the most reliable pump ive ever researched. but the wingmaster is the easier gun to break down and reassemble, ( i watched a couple videos for the bps and everything i read seemed to over exaggerate how hard it really is ) And theres always the turkish pump, which im perfectly ok with. but the others are alot better quality. so whats a good deal on a used one? or should one buy new? ( NOT the new wm there like 800$ and thats way too much ) i also looked at the nova, but i do believe bluing and hardwood is the way to go. help me out fellas! im getting down to another month or two and im gonna pull the trigger on something and i dont want to be disappointed. thanks!


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Re: better

Postby cluckmeister » Sat Dec 21, 2013 10:23 pm

Id buy a nice used Remington 870 Wingmaster, NOT EXPRESS Ive had the Browning but just didn't care for it JMHO
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Re: better

Postby winchester1852 » Sat Dec 21, 2013 11:41 pm

bps all the way simply to take apart ,I would not touch the pa-08 if you want to be cheap pick up a 535 or 500.
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Re: better

Postby DuckManClyde » Sat Dec 21, 2013 11:53 pm

winchester1852 wrote:bps all the way simply to take apart ,I would not touch the pa-08 if you want to be cheap pick up a 535 or 500.


id feel better about a mossy if the forearm wasnt so sloppy
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Re: better "used" shotgun?

Postby winchester1852 » Sun Dec 22, 2013 12:05 am

For the price they are a fine shotgun That won't let you down.
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Re: better

Postby copterdoc » Sun Dec 22, 2013 12:10 am

Don't buy a pump.

They really aren't a lick more reliable than a good semi-auto.
And they kick one hell of a lot harder.

Pumps need to be allowed to go the way of the Dinosaur. Extinct.
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Re: better "used" shotgun?

Postby DuckManClyde » Sun Dec 22, 2013 12:37 am

copterdoc wrote:Don't buy a pump.

They really aren't a lick more reliable than a GOOD semi-auto.
And they kick one hell of a lot harder.

Pumps need to be allowed to go the way of the Dinosaur. Extinct.


I must admit, the only reason im looking at the pumps is because i cant get an auto with a nice wood stock for the same price.



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Re: better "used" shotgun?

Postby winchester1852 » Sun Dec 22, 2013 7:56 am

copterdoc wrote:Don't buy a pump.

They really aren't a lick more reliable than a good semi-auto.
And they kick one hell of a lot harder.

Pumps need to be allowed to go the way of the Dinosaur. Extinct.



That's just not true pumps are alot of fun.
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better "used" shotgun?

Postby Nelliboy2 » Sun Dec 22, 2013 8:07 am

DuckManClyde wrote:
copterdoc wrote:Don't buy a pump.

They really aren't a lick more reliable than a GOOD semi-auto.
And they kick one hell of a lot harder.

Pumps need to be allowed to go the way of the Dinosaur. Extinct.


I must admit, the only reason im looking at the pumps is because i cant get an auto with a nice wood stock for the same price.



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Why would you want a nice wood stock for waterfowling? IMO it would get destroyed rather quickly with water and mud which is pretty common in the duck blind. I would also recommend spending a hair more and getting a camo gun, they are a layer of rust protection which will come in handy down the road.

As far as the options listed I haven't personally own one. My group all bought Novas and haven't look back since we bought them 8 years ago.
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Re: better "used" shotgun?

Postby DuckManClyde » Sun Dec 22, 2013 10:06 am

yeea, ill pass on the camo. and im not as rough on my guns as most people are. i did see a synthetic pa-08 for 319$ it sounds like a good deal, but i still have yet to shoulder these. im just waiting for an opportunity to visit the gun shop.


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Re: better

Postby mudpack » Sun Dec 22, 2013 10:44 am

DuckManClyde wrote:id feel better about a mossy if the forearm wasnt so sloppy


Ever wiggle the forearm on a Wingmaster or a BPS? I own examples of both of those guns and Mossberg does not have a monopoly on "sloppy" forearms.

clyde, you are comparing an autoloader to two pumps. Do you prefer one type of action over another? If so, let us know which you prefer, and we'll weigh in on the pros/cons. If you do not, then get the WM or the BPS. The quality of those two guns are above the SA, and they will retain their value far better.
Buy a good used Wingmaster or BPS and they'll never be worth less than what you paid for it. Buy a new Weatherby shotgun and you immediately lose 30% of it's cost.
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Re: better

Postby DuckManClyde » Sun Dec 22, 2013 11:09 am

mudpack wrote:
DuckManClyde wrote:id feel better about a mossy if the forearm wasnt so sloppy


Ever wiggle the forearm on a Wingmaster or a BPS? I own examples of both of those guns and Mossberg does not have a monopoly on "sloppy" forearms.

clyde, you are comparing an autoloader to two pumps. Do you prefer one type of action over another? If so, let us know which you prefer, and we'll weigh in on the pros/cons. If you do not, then get the WM or the BPS. The quality of those two guns are above the SA, and they will retain their value far better.
Buy a good used Wingmaster or BPS and they'll never be worth less than what you paid for it. Buy a new Weatherby shotgun and you immediately lose 30% of it's cost.


I think you read that wrong, Im looking at the PA not the SA ( although if i had seen an SA for 319, i wouldnt have hesitated). I did get to shoot my buddies dads WM. And I must say i was very impressed.
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Re: better

Postby Hat Flats » Sun Dec 22, 2013 2:45 pm

copterdoc wrote:Don't buy a pump.

They really aren't a lick more reliable than a good semi-auto.
And they kick one hell of a lot harder.

Pumps need to be allowed to go the way of the Dinosaur. Extinct.


That is one of the most Ignorant statements I have heard in a longtime! I guess I should sell all of my Over Unders because they kick to hard to! :rolleyes: (A good quality recoil pad make all the difference) There is not an Automatic made that is more reliable than a properly functioning pump gun if you remove the human factor, They stay cleaner they are not lubricant or temperature sensitive and are rarely affected to the point of stopping by dirt and debris. Some people will actually shoot better on follow up shots with a pump because they usually have to reacquire there site picture after cycling the action rather than just keeping on squeezing the trigger in the same place they missed the first time! The only real down side to a pump vs. an Auto is pumps do not have the stock adjustability (Shims) supplied with most auto's.
And as far as wood stocks go... Here is a little tip, a thorough application of Clear Thompsons water seal will make it look beautiful and totally seal it from the effects of water, mud & crud . Please do yourself a Favor and get the BPS or Wingmaster don't buy junk buy quality! If the Wingmaster does not have choke tubes then the BPS may be the ticket as long as it fits you!

Good Luck, Kurt
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Re: better

Postby DuckManClyde » Sun Dec 22, 2013 4:53 pm

Hat Flats wrote:
copterdoc wrote:Don't buy a pump.

They really aren't a lick more reliable than a good semi-auto.
And they kick one hell of a lot harder.

Pumps need to be allowed to go the way of the Dinosaur. Extinct.


That is one of the most Ignorant statements I have heard in a longtime! I guess I should sell all of my Over Unders because they kick to hard to! :rolleyes: (A good quality recoil pad make all the difference) There is not an Automatic made that is more reliable than a properly functioning pump gun if you remove the human factor, They stay cleaner they are not lubricant or temperature sensitive and are rarely affected to the point of stopping by dirt and debris. Some people will actually shoot better on follow up shots with a pump because they usually have to reacquire there site picture after cycling the action rather than just keeping on squeezing the trigger in the same place they missed the first time! The only real down side to a pump vs. an Auto is pumps do not have the stock adjustability (Shims) supplied with most auto's.
And as far as wood stocks go... Here is a little tip, a thorough application of Clear Thompsons water seal will make it look beautiful and totally seal it from the effects of water, mud & crud . Please do yourself a Favor and get the BPS or Wingmaster don't buy junk buy quality! If the Wingmaster does not have choke tubes then the BPS may be the ticket as long as it fits you!

Good Luck, Kurt


I almost need to be told what to get since my mind can never be made up! BPS or WM it is!
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Re: better

Postby everythings ducky » Sun Dec 22, 2013 4:59 pm

The BPS and 870 wm are both nice guns. It would be one of those two if it was me. My 870 wm is very smooth and nice gun. My 2003 870 express has been good too, just not as smooth and nice. As time goes on, it gets worked in more and smoother.
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Re: better

Postby winchester1852 » Sun Dec 22, 2013 5:38 pm

buy the bps done deal :beer:
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Re: better

Postby DuckManClyde » Sun Dec 22, 2013 8:42 pm

When it comes to the price ( 3-400) is the mossberg 500 u guys mentioned a better buy than the weatherby?
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Re: better "used" shotgun?

Postby winchester1852 » Sun Dec 22, 2013 10:53 pm

DuckManClyde wrote:When it comes to the price ( 3-400) is the mossberg 500 u guys mentioned a better buy than the weatherby?



Don't settle for something,if you want a nice gun save for it.
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Re: better

Postby copterdoc » Sun Dec 22, 2013 11:41 pm

Hat Flats wrote:....There is not an Automatic made that is more reliable than a properly functioning pump gun if you remove the human factor, They stay cleaner they are not lubricant or temperature sensitive and are rarely affected to the point of stopping by dirt and debris. Some people will actually shoot better on follow up shots with a pump because they usually have to reacquire there site picture after cycling the action rather than just keeping on squeezing the trigger in the same place they missed the first time! The only real down side to a pump vs. an Auto is pumps do not have the stock adjustability (Shims) supplied with most auto's.....
Blaa, blaa, blaa.

You can't remove the Human Factor.
Pumps are obsolete, and for good reason.

At least the quality over-unders and side-by-sides are works of art, that appeal to a part of us that is not necessarily scientific, and thus doesn't need to make sense.
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Re: better

Postby ohio mike » Sun Dec 22, 2013 11:51 pm

There are some pump guns that are very easy on the eye,bet you wanna do away with stick and recurve bows too.
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Re: better

Postby Hat Flats » Mon Dec 23, 2013 1:22 am

copterdoc wrote:
Hat Flats wrote:....There is not an Automatic made that is more reliable than a properly functioning pump gun if you remove the human factor, They stay cleaner they are not lubricant or temperature sensitive and are rarely affected to the point of stopping by dirt and debris. Some people will actually shoot better on follow up shots with a pump because they usually have to reacquire there site picture after cycling the action rather than just keeping on squeezing the trigger in the same place they missed the first time! The only real down side to a pump vs. an Auto is pumps do not have the stock adjustability (Shims) supplied with most auto's.....
Blaa, blaa, blaa.

You can't remove the Human Factor.
Pumps are obsolete, and for good reason.

At least the quality over-unders and side-by-sides are works of art, that appeal to a part of us that is not necessarily scientific, and thus doesn't need to make sense.


You are correct you can not remove the human factor that is why so many people post on this site "my ______ automatic has _____ issues" you fill in the blanks, 90% of the issues are owner related.
Pumps are the number 1 selling repeating shotgun in the U.S., and to quote you "for good reason"!. Carrying my Wingmaster into the marsh always puts a big smile on my face, Pumps will never be obsolete that's like saying Trucks will be obsolete.

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Re: better

Postby mudpack » Mon Dec 23, 2013 8:08 am

Just because the pump shotgun is not the most-carried gun by America's duck hunters...as it once was...does not make it "obsolete". It is far from it.
If it is not the most-sold shotgun in the USA, it's not far behind. ( everything I read says it is No. 1 )

While it's been years since I took my 870 Special Purpose Waterfowl (Wingmaster) into a duck blind, I still pick it up off the rack when I walk by, put it to my shoulder, and sight in on an imaginary pintail drake. Then I work the action, just to hear that lovely, oily, clack-snick sound. :thumbsup: After that, I smile, put it back on the rack, and remember.


I missed the "PA" part in the original post, my bad for sure. WM or BPS, either is the way to go.
Last edited by mudpack on Mon Dec 23, 2013 7:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: better

Postby mauserfan » Mon Dec 23, 2013 12:54 pm

An older 870-pre 90's-would be a great bet. Just a couple of parts when you break them down. Ultra reliable. I have shot the same one since 1972 and will not switch. There are a lot of great used ones for 350-500. Merry Christmas....mauser
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Re: better

Postby winchester1852 » Mon Dec 23, 2013 1:17 pm

mudpack wrote:Just because the pump shotgun is not the most-carried gun by America's duck hunters...as it once was...does not make it "obsolete". It is far from it.
If it is not the most-sold shotgun in the USA, it's not far behind. ( everything I read says it is No. 1 )

While it's been years since I took my 870 Special Purpose Waterfowl (Wingmaster) into a duck blind, I still pick it up off the rack when I walk by, put it to my shoulder, and sight in on an imaginary pintail drake. Then I work the action, just to hear that lovely, oily, clack-snick sound. :thumbsup: After that, I smile, put it back on the rack, and remember.


I missed the "PA" part in the original post, my bad for sure. WM or BPS for sure.


pumps will never die.
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Re: better

Postby Jon Bergren » Mon Dec 23, 2013 2:25 pm

I have a 1970's Wingmaster. I also have two 1100's with Hastings barrel, a 935, Condor O/U and a Excell auto. The Ecell is built like the 1100 wih the bolt spring around the magazine. It also won't shoot off the bolt handle. They have eliminated all the items that have to be replaced on the 1100's. It now costs $400 at the Academy. I paid $300 for mine 5 yrs ago. It is my most used gun and I have had zero problems with it. I use nothing but Hoppes Gun Oil, Same as I used when I was 7 yrs old. Ned S
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