best steel shot

Interact with others on shot gun shells, reloading, ballistics, chokes, or anything that has to do with your shooting.

Moderators: donell67, Ohio Wildfowler, NV Guide, pennsyltucky

best steel shot

Postby woodduckhunter » Wed May 10, 2006 2:17 pm

I was wanting to know the best shotgun shells there are for an economical price. I shot Xpert high velocity this season and did great.(73 gadwalls, 23 wood ducks, 27 mallards, 34 ringnecks, and 39 widgeon) I have heard people downing and saying that Xpert shells suck because all of the pellets are not the same size. I cut one shell open out of ten boxes, and they were all the same. Just like to know what else is out there.
woodduckhunter
hunter
 
Posts: 1022
Joined: Thu Dec 29, 2005 9:52 am
Location: Texas


Postby Hoosier Drake » Wed May 10, 2006 4:05 pm

I have hit every thing I've shot at with them.
they are the most economical price around here.
Cuz hunting ain't catch and release.
User avatar
Hoosier Drake
hunter
 
Posts: 134
Joined: Wed Nov 02, 2005 12:28 pm
Location: Crown Point IN.

Postby Sagebrush » Wed May 10, 2006 5:14 pm

Some hunters like them, other don't.

I just know I can get tripples on Honkers with the 3" BB at 1550fps.

Sage
User avatar
Sagebrush
hunter
 
Posts: 4753
Joined: Mon Oct 03, 2005 10:28 pm
Location: Reno Nev.

Postby Citori12 » Mon May 15, 2006 6:05 am

The million dollar question!!!!! What it comes down to is each individuals personal preferences. I do not use one shell to fit all. The hunting conditions determine what I use. Because I reload, my shells are the best... :laughing: But they take time to build and are not inexpensive. I do not use the cheapest components or the most expensive either. I want a shotgun shell that performs without having to pay an exuberant amount of money to use them. A box of premuim high power rifle shells cost $24.00 per 20 and I only shoot one while I am hunting. If my shotgun ammunition costs as much as my high power rifle ammo then I think I am defeating my purpose. As I will go through a couple of boxes of 25 a year. And several thousand rounds on target ranges. so let you concience and your budget determine what works best.
Citori12
Membership permanently suspended
 
Posts: 2119
Joined: Wed Sep 28, 2005 1:50 pm

Postby Sagebrush » Mon May 15, 2006 8:56 am

Ahh yes, the old rifle range, I rememer it well. 500 to 1,000 rounds
a year.

Now I do that much at the trap range.

A must for top notch shooting skills to be achieved ! :thumbsup:

Yes; :withstupid: Sage
User avatar
Sagebrush
hunter
 
Posts: 4753
Joined: Mon Oct 03, 2005 10:28 pm
Location: Reno Nev.

Postby Jim Broadbridge » Mon May 15, 2006 9:54 am

The best buys around here are the Remington Sportsman steel in 3" 1 1/8 0z. at 1550 and thier pellots are like ball bearings, unlike the footballs that are in the HV # 3's.
I'm not as good as I once was, but I'm as good once as I ever was.
Jim Broadbridge
hunter
 
Posts: 1914
Joined: Thu Dec 08, 2005 10:18 am
Location: Brantford Ontario Canada

Postby Citori12 » Mon May 15, 2006 10:58 am

Maybe I ought to come out with C12 ammunition it would be the best around. Except I cannot compete with the volume that Remington, winchester, federal, kent, wolf, estate, and fiocchi can put out...so I guess I will stay a small volume, high mix, premuim ammunition company for awhile!!!! :laughing: :laughing:
Citori12
Membership permanently suspended
 
Posts: 2119
Joined: Wed Sep 28, 2005 1:50 pm

Postby LIGHT12 » Mon May 15, 2006 11:49 am

I grilled some birds last night that had been frozen late in January. After thawning them an ugly piece of steel shot from my HVs fell out of the packet. I don't know how it got in there if it sucked so much. :smile:

I think we all have our preferences. I'm going to pattern some Fiochii and others this year and perhaps shoot something different. But even then I'll probably just use what is in my trunk at home.
Have you ever woke up one day and said. Damn when does the season start.
User avatar
LIGHT12
hunter
 
Posts: 1220
Joined: Fri Nov 11, 2005 3:59 pm
Location: ARIZONA

Postby Jim Broadbridge » Mon May 15, 2006 12:31 pm

Even a 8 year old kid picking rocks out of the driveway for his sling shot knows he has to pick the round ones in order to hit anything. I don't care how big or fast they are if they arn't round I don't want them in my shells.

Light-12 only the #3 pellots were deformed all the rest I checked in the HV were fine and I killed plenty of birds with them too.

C-12 would you please send me a price list. :laughing:
I'm not as good as I once was, but I'm as good once as I ever was.
Jim Broadbridge
hunter
 
Posts: 1914
Joined: Thu Dec 08, 2005 10:18 am
Location: Brantford Ontario Canada

Postby Citori12 » Wed May 17, 2006 7:32 am

In the day there used to be square shot...this was made for very open patterns for close in shotgun work. No pellet is perfectly round, however the more uniform they are and in the case of steel the smoother and rounder they are the better they perform ( many years of patterning and experimentation led me to this conclusion).
For you Jim I can give ya a deal on some good shotgun shells :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
Beings my steel will perform as well as Hevi at reasonable shotgun ranges, my premuim 3" 12ga handloads should sell for 30$ per 10 rounds.

My prime early duck load is a 1oz #5 2 3/4" shell at 1600fps. It costs me about 8$ a box.
My late season cold weather mallard load is a 3" 1 1/8oz #3 steel load at 1550. And my goose load is that same load in #1 steel. They cost me about 9$ to 10$ a box to load.
My public hunting area, late season, goose load is a 10ga 1 5/8 oz #1 steel load at 1375fps. And or 1 1/2oz #1 at 1500fps. They cost about 12$ a box. Of course those prices do not include my time to painstakinly weight each powder and shot charge.
The shot that I purchase is either zinc coated and is very round and uniform, or BP's polished steel which is very smooth and uniform...premuim shot for premuim loads. :thumbsup:
Citori12
Membership permanently suspended
 
Posts: 2119
Joined: Wed Sep 28, 2005 1:50 pm

Postby Jim Broadbridge » Wed May 17, 2006 8:31 am

C-12 in your opinion would there be any advantages to buffering steel shot loads?
I'm not as good as I once was, but I'm as good once as I ever was.
Jim Broadbridge
hunter
 
Posts: 1914
Joined: Thu Dec 08, 2005 10:18 am
Location: Brantford Ontario Canada

Postby BurnZ » Wed May 17, 2006 8:59 am

Well, judging by your stats "(73 gadwalls, 23 wood ducks, 27 mallards, 34 ringnecks, and 39 widgeon)" I'd say that the Xpert shot works quite well. :thumbsup:

no point in fixin something that aint broke. :laughing:
User avatar
BurnZ
hunter
 
Posts: 593
Joined: Mon Mar 06, 2006 2:50 pm
Location: Minnesota

BUFFER

Postby Sagebrush » Wed May 17, 2006 9:30 am

Buffer is ment for soft pellets like lead & bismuth, to keep
them from deforming on the "setback" force when fired.

Since steel & hevi are six times harder and can not be flattened with pliers
like lead can, the use is minimal.

Selecting the correct choke for the range that you will be shooting is
a more important issue !!!

Sage.
User avatar
Sagebrush
hunter
 
Posts: 4753
Joined: Mon Oct 03, 2005 10:28 pm
Location: Reno Nev.

Postby Citori12 » Wed May 17, 2006 10:18 am

:withstupid: :thumbsup: I am with Sage.....I have not ever noticed a performance difference with steel using buffered loads vs non-buffered. With steel its not deformation that causes poor performance its "Bridging". Bridging is a condition that happens when force is applied to hard steel making it want to act like a solid projectile. In fast steel patterns when you look at the pattern watch for 2,3 or 4 pellets that are very close together. I mean that there is a "clumping" of pellets. This is bridging. I have observed 90% and higher pattern percentages that have quite a bit of bridging. Now before I get crucified...in long distance shooting 50 yards + you loose pattern effeciency with bridging. Even though bridged patterns kill.....
My hottest lead loads were buffered to keep "set back" pressures from deforming the shot...in hard non-toxic shells its possible to keep pellets from bridging with buffer but once you hit that majic velocity level in some loads bridging will occur regardless.
Citori12
Membership permanently suspended
 
Posts: 2119
Joined: Wed Sep 28, 2005 1:50 pm

Postby Jim Broadbridge » Wed May 17, 2006 10:39 am

Sage ! I realize the main function of buffer is to prevent deformation at set back but I also know it adds some fluidity to the shot column when it reaches the choke. I recall you and C-12 talking about steel pellots bouncing around somewhat and was wondering if the buffer would help the bouncing syndrome or help at the choke. :smile:
I'm not as good as I once was, but I'm as good once as I ever was.
Jim Broadbridge
hunter
 
Posts: 1914
Joined: Thu Dec 08, 2005 10:18 am
Location: Brantford Ontario Canada

Postby Citori12 » Wed May 17, 2006 1:07 pm

Jim, you are correct...but remember that the steel shot column hits the forcing cone of the chamber first. Though standard plastic buffereing may add some to the fluid travel of shot down the barrel with steel the benefits are really negligable.....there is some mica/plastic buffer that helps with keeping the steel smooth but as far as overall performance adding buffer in my book has not made enough difference to warrent special buffered steel loads.
Citori12
Membership permanently suspended
 
Posts: 2119
Joined: Wed Sep 28, 2005 1:50 pm

Postby pennsyltucky » Wed May 17, 2006 5:54 pm

i dont get anything better when i add buffer, unless i add enuf of it to make the load so slow it patterns better, but thats not because of the buffer at all.

all buffer does is slow down ur handloads with steel.
User avatar
pennsyltucky
Forum Moderator
 
Posts: 3167
Joined: Mon Feb 27, 2006 2:21 pm
Location: stoneboro, PA

Postby Citori12 » Wed May 17, 2006 6:48 pm

Penny....You are correct to a piont! There are some very speedy steel loads that require buffer in thier recipies....But buffer was invented many years ago in the form of corn flour....the did this many many moons ago in the lead era!!!! Times have changed...this is the era of non-toxic for waterfowl and soon for upland as well..The reason most people opt for hevi or bismith is because we as hunters and sportsmen have not yet grasped the concept of non-toxic shot.....non-toxic does not deform...hevi, bismith nor steel, steel/tungsten or any other material....lead did...so if your comparing non-tox to steel your in trouble already...its not even close...the best performance from non-tox requires a whole different set of rules...you can quote me on this... I have used hevi on the pattern board...not in the field...the velocities are something to scoff at...even in lead I can get 1350fps loads to pattern well...in hevi I cannot find a load quite that fast with the same payload...my steel patterns out perform the hevi-hands down...but that depends....patterning a shotgun has been around since corn flour buffer and before..including flintlock fowling pieces...here is what I will say....give up the notion that we want patterns to look like lead patterns and our pellets to perform like lead...if your hunting conditions dictate 70 yard shots there is nothing that can do that...if you are looking at 45 yard patterns look closely at what your using and what the pattern really tells ya....I cannot say I killed a hundred birds this year as some others but I will tell ya is that I do my share...currently I am working on better loads for big game season...for now I know what works in my shotguns...but everyone has thier own theroy....mine work pretty well......

C12
Citori12
Membership permanently suspended
 
Posts: 2119
Joined: Wed Sep 28, 2005 1:50 pm

Postby Sagebrush » Wed May 17, 2006 9:17 pm

Jim;
When shooting extra hard pellets that dont give when going down a barrel, buffer gives a hunter that shoots with a choke that
is too tight for the larger size pellets a little " insurance " from
splitting his barrel of his gun !!!

The wad can only give way so much, before the hard steel (hevi) wears through the wad 100% and scores the metal of the shotgun. If the choke
at the muzzle is too tight, somthing has to give, and it will not be the
steel or hevi pellets cramed "solid" at 1500 fps.

Buffer & the thicknes of the wads are the only safe guard in keeping
your gun in good shape.

Sage
User avatar
Sagebrush
hunter
 
Posts: 4753
Joined: Mon Oct 03, 2005 10:28 pm
Location: Reno Nev.

Postby pennsyltucky » Thu May 18, 2006 7:37 am

Citori12 wrote:Penny....You are correct to a piont! There are some very speedy steel loads that require buffer in thier recipies....But buffer was invented many years ago in the form of corn flour....the did this many many moons ago in the lead era!!!! Times have changed...this is the era of non-toxic for waterfowl and soon for upland as well..The reason most people opt for hevi or bismith is because we as hunters and sportsmen have not yet grasped the concept of non-toxic shot.....non-toxic does not deform...hevi, bismith nor steel, steel/tungsten or any other material....lead did...so if your comparing non-tox to steel your in trouble already...its not even close...the best performance from non-tox requires a whole different set of rules...you can quote me on this... I have used hevi on the pattern board...not in the field...the velocities are something to scoff at...even in lead I can get 1350fps loads to pattern well...in hevi I cannot find a load quite that fast with the same payload...my steel patterns out perform the hevi-hands down...but that depends....patterning a shotgun has been around since corn flour buffer and before..including flintlock fowling pieces...here is what I will say....give up the notion that we want patterns to look like lead patterns and our pellets to perform like lead...if your hunting conditions dictate 70 yard shots there is nothing that can do that...if you are looking at 45 yard patterns look closely at what your using and what the pattern really tells ya....I cannot say I killed a hundred birds this year as some others but I will tell ya is that I do my share...currently I am working on better loads for big game season...for now I know what works in my shotguns...but everyone has thier own theroy....mine work pretty well......

C12


C12, why on earth are u yellin at me? :help: we agree on this whole steel/pattern subject, remember? :umm:

or did u just get up on the wrong side of the soapbox this mornin..... :mrgreen:
User avatar
pennsyltucky
Forum Moderator
 
Posts: 3167
Joined: Mon Feb 27, 2006 2:21 pm
Location: stoneboro, PA

Postby WIgunner30 » Mon Jun 19, 2006 11:43 pm

I have shot winchester and remington steel loads. I have settled on the Xpert Hi velocity steel. U get good patterns and plenty of duck stopping power with them at a lesser price then the drylok and the nitro steel. As for the remington sportsman the ammo sucks it not as fast and has a tendency to jam the hell out of my gun as does some nitro steel. ive even had a remington heavy shot turkey load jam in my turkey gun and a copper solid slug jam in my bps. ive had terrible luck with remington ammo. the only ammo i like better then the Xpert is the newer heavy steel wich i use if i know im gonna get longer range pass shooting at ducks not so much over decoys.
WIgunner30
hunter
 
Posts: 397
Joined: Mon Jun 19, 2006 9:48 pm
Location: Wisconsin

Postby LA.Call'emClose » Fri Jun 23, 2006 8:49 am

pattern your shotgun with many different brands of shotguns shells and see which brand you gun thinks is the best.
• I think we consider too much the good luck of the early bird and not enough the bad luck of the early worm.- Franklin D. Roosevelt
• Life's tough...It's even tougher if your stupid.- The Duke
User avatar
LA.Call'emClose
hunter
 
Posts: 1614
Joined: Wed Feb 08, 2006 10:59 pm
Location: SW LA

Postby ohsobad_hunter » Fri Jul 07, 2006 12:36 pm

Yup, different shells pattern differently out of different guns. The best thing to do is try different choke,load combos till you find one that patterns good outta your gun. I have shot Win. supremes outta my 870 and when I bought my Franchi 912, I couldnt get them to pattern out of it, so i switched to kent fassteel. :thumbsup:
>>---Mat---->
User avatar
ohsobad_hunter
hunter
 
Posts: 2281
Joined: Mon Jul 05, 2004 2:27 pm
Location: Oklahoma


Return to Shotshell, Reloading, Ballistics, & Chokes

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: LeakyBoot, z51 and 11 guests