rem 10ga black base vs yellow base

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rem 10ga black base vs yellow base

Postby goose_gunner » Sun Feb 16, 2014 4:13 pm

I looking for load data for the black base and all I can find is 13/8oz load and have loaded 23/4 yellow and black and they seem to be the same is this also true for the 10ga ps im talking about the bright green black base not the olive drab black base
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Re: rem 10ga black base vs yellow base

Postby bassmaster624 » Sun Feb 16, 2014 6:28 pm

you might want to cut 1 of each open to make sure.they have several height's on there basewads.i know one is .250 and the other 2 there might be .020 difference.not near my note's at the moment.
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Re: rem 10ga black base vs yellow base

Postby 10gaOkie » Sun Feb 16, 2014 6:42 pm

The same rules for Rem 12ga do not apply the same to 10ga. The volume of these hulls is the key to reloading with them. Here is the scoop....
12ga in both 2 3/4 and 3" the yellow bw is the large volume hull. Any other color bw may be a diff volume which is most likely smaller. I have seen some black bw 2 3/4 hulls that have the large volume. The only way to know for sure is to use the salt test and check their volume.
10ga Rem or SP hull, normally has the black bw which is the large volume hull. I have seen some gray and white bw that were also large volume. The yellow bw in 10ga is normally a small volume hull. AGAIN, check the volume in these as there are no set rules with Remington. I have also ran across some 10ga yellow bw that were large volume hulls but they are rare.
When loading a particular load, and you get hold of some small volume hulls, you will likely noice right off that the components dont fit. Thats always a good sign to keep things safe.
What I do is sort my hulls by checking volume and put in ziplocks marking the outside for future use. Of course I dont do the salt test to every huil, once you determine one hull in a batch, use a pencil to meaure depth on the rest.

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Re: rem 10ga black base vs yellow base

Postby 3200 man » Sun Feb 16, 2014 7:00 pm

Great Info Chris , wondering myself I will keep this in mind ! Thanks ....Again !
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Re: rem 10ga black base vs yellow base

Postby 10gaOkie » Sun Feb 16, 2014 7:09 pm

Once you establish which you have in one batch of hulls, the sticking a pencil down in them to measure depth will show a variation of about 1/8" or slightly more between large and small volume hulls. This holds true for both 12 and 10 gauge.
One of the things that has me scratching my head, is 2 3/4" unibody Rem hulls you would think they would be large volume not having a basewad. However, they are the same volume as a tapered STS Rem hull. Crazy!

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Re: rem 10ga black base vs yellow base

Postby BT Justice » Mon Feb 17, 2014 4:50 am

10gaOkie wrote:Once you establish which you have in one batch of hulls, the sticking a pencil down in them to measure depth will show a variation of about 1/8" or slightly more between large and small volume hulls. This holds true for both 12 and 10 gauge.
One of the things that has me scratching my head, is 2 3/4" unibody Rem hulls you would think they would be large volume not having a basewad. However, they are the same volume as a tapered STS Rem hull. Crazy!

Chris

This is again because ammunition companies do not make hulls for reloading purposes they make them to suit their needs when they make a given load. As You stated you can't tell by the color of the base wad what a given hull volume will be, measuring it is the best and safest way.
The Remington Unibody hulls are exactly what the name implies, a Unibody--read that one piece hull(actually two piece), they have no separate basewad. The yellow, black and white/clear basewad hulls are three pieced hull having a separate tube, basewad and brass section.
With most of the Remington hulls things aren't that bad as many of them come in close to being the same no matter what the outside of the hull says the load is, the real fun starts if you try to match up Winchester hulls which not only have different basewad heights but also different basewad shapes.. :huh:
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Re: rem 10ga black base vs yellow base

Postby BT Justice » Mon Feb 17, 2014 5:12 am

goose_gunner wrote:I looking for load data for the black base and all I can find is 13/8oz load and have loaded 23/4 yellow and black and they seem to be the same is this also true for the 10ga ps im talking about the bright green black base not the olive drab black base

If the basewads turn out to be the same height as the Yellow basewad hulls, which in many cases for the older Bright Green hulls was a considered a high basewad hull, I usually reduce down from the listed Alliant load data 1 grain of STEEL powder from the listed RSI wad loads. With the Olive Drab low basewad hulls I don't reduce down. For BP and PR wad loads I'm not sure as I don't use them that much in the Remington hulls.
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Re: rem 10ga black base vs yellow base

Postby baltz526 » Wed Feb 19, 2014 6:34 pm

Most Remington 10ga hulls have the same volume. No matter what color the base wad is. Yellow, White, Black. Some tubes are 1/16" to 1/8" longer than average, some are 1/16 to 1/8" shorter than average. I use a fixed measurement cutter to trim all Remington hulls for use in my Gold. Once trimmed they all have the same OAL and internal depth. Some OLD yellow base wad hulls where .250" But I do not find many in my buckets of Remington 10ga hulls. They load the same but you might find the final crimp is not set for them, after doing the .200" base wad. You will feel them.
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Re: rem 10ga black base vs yellow base

Postby 10gaOkie » Wed Feb 19, 2014 6:53 pm

You are right about the Rem 10ga hull length variation but not about the volume. Base wads have different heights depending on which rem hull you have.

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Re: rem 10ga black base vs yellow base

Postby baltz526 » Wed Feb 19, 2014 7:49 pm

I just went through a bunch of black base, white base, yellow base hulls. All where trimmed with the same tool. It is a piece of CPVC with an Exacto blade melted into it at a slight angle. To bite into hull. Stick it into hull, turn and it cuts the over spec hulls to correct length. Base wad is the rest that sets the cut. On all the hulls after I was done, Excluding a few under spec olive hulls. The Over All Length was the same. Color of base wad made no difference. All finished at the same inside and outside measurements. Run them with the same exact load and you get the same fit and crimp. Other than a few olive that may give a open center crimp. Your hulls might have different thickness base wads, But the vast majority of my 10ga Remington hulls all have the same thickness basewad, Color makes no difference.
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Re: rem 10ga black base vs yellow base

Postby goose_gunner » Wed Feb 19, 2014 8:59 pm

Thanks guys I think I will be doing a lot of sorting and testing
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Re: rem 10ga black base vs yellow base

Postby 10gaOkie » Wed Feb 19, 2014 11:07 pm

I have even cut Rem 10ga hulls in half (sectioned), the ones I compared were yellow and black. The black bw was a little over 3/16" shorter than the yellow. You are lucky that yours turned out the same volume. Take my word for it, all are not the same. Like I said, I have run across yellow bw that were both large and small volume. I have never seen black bw that were anything but large volume. Both sizes in white. If you are used to loading the large volume Rem hulls, when you try the same load in a smaller volume hull, you will know it because the components wont fit.

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Re: rem 10ga black base vs yellow base

Postby goose_gunner » Thu Feb 20, 2014 12:36 am

10gaOkie wrote:I have even cut Rem 10ga hulls in half (sectioned), the ones I compared were yellow and black. The black bw was a little over 3/16" shorter than the yellow. You are lucky that yours turned out the same volume. Take my word for it, all are not the same. Like I said, I have run across yellow bw that were both large and small volume. I have never seen black bw that were anything but large volume. Both sizes in white. If you are used to loading the large volume Rem hulls, when you try the same load in a smaller volume hull, you will know it because the components wont fit.

Chris


Well I have less than 100 yellow base and 200 to 300 olive drab newest rem hulls but I have tons of the older bright green black base wad that I plan to load first
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Re: rem 10ga black base vs yellow base

Postby BT Justice » Thu Feb 20, 2014 3:49 am

baltz526 wrote:Most Remington 10ga hulls have the same volume. No matter what color the base wad is. Yellow, White, Black. Some tubes are 1/16" to 1/8" longer than average, some are 1/16 to 1/8" shorter than average. I use a fixed measurement cutter to trim all Remington hulls for use in my Gold. Once trimmed they all have the same OAL and internal depth. Some OLD yellow base wad hulls where .250" But I do not find many in my buckets of Remington 10ga hulls. They load the same but you might find the final crimp is not set for them, after doing the .200" base wad. You will feel them.

Maybe I lost what your doing here in the explanation, but if your trimming the hulls wouldn't they start out being a different internal diameter?
Your Modifying them for your needs and to get the OAL down for better feeding, the keyword here is your modifying them.
The Older Yellow basewad Premier hulls did have less internal volume than the newer Olive Drab hulls do also.
You do know that Remington also makes two different types of Olive Drab 10 ga hulls don't you, one has much less internal volume for lighter loads and can be shorter than the others.
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Re: rem 10ga black base vs yellow base

Postby baltz526 » Thu Feb 20, 2014 4:58 pm

I must be lucky. But The only basewads I have seen in a Remington 10ga hull that was of the taller height was a very few boxes of OLD steel shot. These are the loads the hulls had. 1 3/4oz 1260fps steel in the yellow base green hull, 1 3/8oz 1500fps in the whitebase olive hull with silver base metal, 1 3/8oz 1500fps in the white base olive hull with brass color metal base, 1 1/2oz 1500fps white base in the dark green hull. All these are the same base height. Then there is the one high base hull which is the very old 1 3/4oz yellow base green hull. 5 hulls are the same except for the color of base. 1 is very noticeably a taller base wad and the printing on the hull is crude. Obviously Remington may have other hulls, but in the last 25yrs these are the ones I have collected.
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