Cheddite CX2000 primers

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Re: Cheddite CX2000 primers

Postby steelshotshooter » Sat May 10, 2014 12:30 pm

I know that the Federal 209A is a HOTTER primer! This is what makes me question a lot this info, and is why I develope my own steel shot loads. I can get a "general idea" from a published load, and then run everything through a pressure test barrel to find out the EXACT pressure reading for a specific load. I have seen loads from BPI, RSI and a few others that were off by as much 5,000+ psi pressure readings. I realize that not everyone has access to pressure test equipment but, some of the loads out there are an accident waiting to happen....
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Re: Cheddite CX2000 primers

Postby steelshotshooter » Sat May 10, 2014 12:39 pm

lostknife4 wrote:
steelshotshooter wrote:BPI also says that the Ched209 primer is a direct replacement for the Federal 209A primer and that they can be interchanged between loads. Is this true???

Me personally, I only use the exact primer that is listed for each specific load....


I think maybe Steelshooter had better go back to whomever he was talking with that told him that and get it in writing or an email answer from BPI and post it on here. Odds on you don't get it..... so what is that kind of advice worth?
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These guys will tell you one thing on the telephone but, ask them to send you that information in an e-mail and they will either hang up on you or completely ignore you. I've bee. Down this road too many times. This is why I don't 100% trust their load data....
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Re: Cheddite CX2000 primers

Postby lostknife4 » Sat May 10, 2014 12:59 pm

My point exactly however I did get an email answer from BPI re my last inquiry attached above. Straight forward and clearly this gentleman knows what he is talking about IMHO.
Without back up test data some of the posts on here are scary and I wonder if these guys realize just how Liable they really are !!
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Re: Cheddite CX2000 primers

Postby Jon Bergren » Sat May 10, 2014 1:09 pm

lostknife4 wrote:My point exactly however I did get an email answer from BPI re my last inquiry attached above. Straight forward and clearly this gentleman knows what he is talking about IMHO.
Without back up test data some of the posts on here are scary and I wonder if these guys realize just how Liable they really are !!
Lost


If BPI knows what they are talking about, why did they blow up many a 10 gage with their first steel recipes. Also why did they have to delete 55 recipes from their 2001 Status of Steel with overpressure and my favorite 7/8 oz recipe with 7 grains too much powder. I don't believe anything they say nor will I load their recipes after almost blowing up my gun with the over pressured 7/8 oz load. You only had to fire one to know their was seveere pressure problems. Ned S
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Re: Cheddite CX2000 primers

Postby lostknife4 » Sat May 10, 2014 2:30 pm

Geeze Ned you would know all that stuff with all your substitutions and loadings that don't have any test data to back them up. I guess it takes one to know one.
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Re: Cheddite CX2000 primers

Postby Jon Bergren » Sat May 10, 2014 3:39 pm

lostknife4 wrote:Geeze Ned you would know all that stuff with all your substitutions and loadings that don't have any test data to back them up. I guess it takes one to know one.
Lost

Dang, you Canadians are getting so you only do selective reading or forget what I have posted. Any Wildcat recipe that I use has been checked by others or by Jonmac for me. In fact Jonmac did check every new lot of STEEL and gave me the info. Mercy, Mercy. Ned S
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Re: Cheddite CX2000 primers

Postby lostknife4 » Sat May 10, 2014 4:49 pm

For a year or so now any of those recipes that you have posted, and test results have been requested, have never been accompanied by any test results nor any reference to test results and lo and behold now you tell us that every one of them has been tested...... nice try but I don't buy it. Your flaunting cavalier attitude toward recommended practices and procedures towards the use of primers and propellants IMHO is clearly sending the wrong message to the handloading fraternity. As far as your having information about the different Lots of ASteel with all the controversy over the difference in Lots why did you not see fit to share this pertinent information then or since? Was it not DDC who warned everyone about the recipe he gave you supposedly in confidence that you saw fit to share with the world ...... only then did you come out and say that it was DDC's not your own.
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Re: Cheddite CX2000 primers

Postby BT Justice » Sun May 11, 2014 2:21 am

There's a lot of published data that I question and why I keep repeating verify with several different sources, even that doesn't always work out correctly. A lot of it you really have to wonder how certain companies like BP can pump out hundreds of recipes every year that are supposedly tested and verified to be safe, they must have a staff of several hundred people on hand testing loads everyday of the year(doubtful).
I've had a few people question this but IMO RSI 90 is not safe, we haven't done a whole lot of testing with 3 1/2" 12 ga loads, but we did tested a few listed loads.
RSI 90. 1 1/2 oz steel load in Federal 3 1/2" 12 ga hull is also duplicated by Alliant in their data but using the Federal 209A primer. Here's what got over the chrono

With Winchester Blue Box primer average of 5 shots...1446 fps
With Federal 209A primer average of 5 shots............ 1441 fps
With Cheddite CX2000 primer average of 5 shots........1436 fps

With velocity figures that close using thee different primers, this load IMO is overpressure. We never did pressure test it basically because after seeing this we weren't going to use it anyway. Not to mention the load was blowing the crimp ends off a lot of the hulls.

Dropping down 2 grains of STEEL powder and using RSI 90 with the Federal 209A primer, the load was much more manageable, didn't blow off the crimp ends and was what we could consider a safe load to use.
Average of 5 shots minus 2 grains of powder...1336 fps Hi/Lo spread 48 fps

IMO much more in line with what a 1 1/2 oz 3 1/2" 12 ga load should be doing velocity wise.
Always read and verify , if shoots wrong then question it anyway.
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Re: Cheddite CX2000 primers

Postby lostknife4 » Sun May 11, 2014 7:32 am

X³
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Re: Cheddite CX2000 primers

Postby Jon Bergren » Sun May 11, 2014 3:22 pm

BT Justice wrote:There's a lot of published data that I question and why I keep repeating verify with several different sources, even that doesn't always work out correctly. A lot of it you really have to wonder how certain companies like BP can pump out hundreds of recipes every year that are supposedly tested and verified to be safe, they must have a staff of several hundred people on hand testing loads everyday of the year(doubtful).
I've had a few people question this but IMO RSI 90 is not safe, we haven't done a whole lot of testing with 3 1/2" 12 ga loads, but we did tested a few listed loads.
RSI 90. 1 1/2 oz steel load in Federal 3 1/2" 12 ga hull is also duplicated by Alliant in their data but using the Federal 209A primer. Here's what got over the chrono

With Winchester Blue Box primer average of 5 shots...1446 fps
With Federal 209A primer average of 5 shots............ 1441 fps
With Cheddite CX2000 primer average of 5 shots........1436 fps

With velocity figures that close using thee different primers, this load IMO is overpressure. We never did pressure test it basically because after seeing this we weren't going to use it anyway. Not to mention the load was blowing the crimp ends off a lot of the hulls.

Dropping down 2 grains of STEEL powder and using RSI 90 with the Federal 209A primer, the load was much more manageable, didn't blow off the crimp ends and was what we could consider a safe load to use.
Average of 5 shots minus 2 grains of powder...1336 fps Hi/Lo spread 48 fps

IMO much more in line with what a 1 1/2 oz 3 1/2" 12 ga load should be doing velocity wise.
Always read and verify , if shoots wrong then question it anyway.


BT, I found the same thing with 3 1/2" Fed hulls when I was developing 1 3/8 oz BB load. I shoot nothing but 3" Rem and Cheddite hulls and 3 1/2" Rem hulls. Due to age my 3 1/2'" days are over. Ned S
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Re: Cheddite CX2000 primers

Postby BT Justice » Mon May 12, 2014 4:37 am

Jon Bergren wrote:
BT Justice wrote:Dropping down 2 grains of STEEL powder and using RSI 90 with the Federal 209A primer, the load was much more manageable, didn't blow off the crimp ends and was what we could consider a safe load to use.
Average of 5 shots minus 2 grains of powder...1336 fps Hi/Lo spread 48 fps

IMO much more in line with what a 1 1/2 oz 3 1/2" 12 ga load should be doing velocity wise.
Always read and verify , if shoots wrong then question it anyway.


BT, I found the same thing with 3 1/2" Fed hulls when I was developing 1 3/8 oz BB load. I shoot nothing but 3" Rem and Cheddite hulls and 3 1/2" Rem hulls. Due to age my 3 1/2'" days are over. Ned S

I know Ned was just using that as an example, we've had more negative results than positive with most 3 1/2" 12 ga loads and published data ourselves. Best results have been with stacked 1 1/4oz loads with 3" wads on top of gas seals. Think this another reason I keep running back to the 10 ga, just have had more positive results with less problems/more predictability in the 10 ga.
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Re: Cheddite CX2000 primers

Postby Beretta06 » Mon May 12, 2014 10:27 am

The BP load I mentioned earlyer performs real well. After I answered my own questions. Because the published data wasn't right.

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Re: Cheddite CX2000 primers

Postby BT Justice » Tue May 13, 2014 2:53 am

Beretta06 wrote:The BP load I mentioned earlyer performs real well. After I answered my own questions. Because the published data wasn't right.

Dwight

Have you chrongraphed that load? Be interesting to see what results you get.
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Re: Cheddite CX2000 primers

Postby Beretta06 » Tue Jun 10, 2014 11:12 am

BT Justice wrote:
Beretta06 wrote:The BP load I mentioned earlyer performs real well. After I answered my own questions. Because the published data wasn't right.

Dwight

Have you chrongraphed that load? Be interesting to see what results you get.


I have not chronographed it, I may load a few and do that middle of this month
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