New Hevi steel

Interact with others on shot gun shells, reloading, ballistics, chokes, or anything that has to do with your shooting.

Moderators: donell67, NV Guide, pennsyltucky, Ohio Wildfowler

Re: New Hevi steel

Postby lostknife4 » Tue Jul 22, 2014 7:07 am

X2

Marketing can be taken with tongue in cheek but outright lies and deception is a different thing altogether. This style "marketing" and unsubstantiated claims wasn't your decision to make St.Patrick, so just keep telling the truth and keep your integrity intact and don't believe everything they tell you either. You are dealing on DHC with people who have many many ( 2 many's) years experience in this game and it's readily apparent they can see through this smoke screen of propaganda very easily, there is just too many facts and evidence from these gentlemen that haven't been proven wrong by the manufacturer. Some day the manufacturer may just have to prove their claims to a judge in a class action suit, marketing style notwithstanding!

I believe hamernhonkers has a very good point wrt chokes, I use Cyl or IC with TSS and get very good patterns even at range, for extreme ranges maybe as tight as a LM. High density shot patterns are better with more open chokes IMHO.

Lost
"It's not the game but the chase ~ not the trophy but the race !" from my Dad, many years ago.
User avatar
lostknife4
hunter
 
Posts: 4358
Joined: Sat Apr 03, 2010 4:32 pm
Location: Eastern Canada


Re: New Hevi steel

Postby zpstl321 » Wed Jul 23, 2014 7:50 am

Deleted by zpstl321
Last edited by zpstl321 on Thu Jul 24, 2014 8:11 am, edited 1 time in total.
zpstl321
hunter
 
Posts: 510
Joined: Fri Jul 20, 2012 11:17 am

Re: New Hevi steel

Postby zpstl321 » Wed Jul 23, 2014 8:21 am

Deleted by zpstl321
Last edited by zpstl321 on Thu Jul 24, 2014 8:11 am, edited 1 time in total.
zpstl321
hunter
 
Posts: 510
Joined: Fri Jul 20, 2012 11:17 am

Re: New Hevi steel

Postby SPatrick » Wed Jul 23, 2014 12:02 pm

Wow...Where do you get this stuff??? Bring out the tinfoil hats...
Shaun Patrick
Avery Prostaff
HEVI-Shot Prostaff
User avatar
SPatrick
State Moderator
 
Posts: 2031
Joined: Tue Oct 20, 2009 8:06 am
Location: MO

Re: New Hevi steel

Postby zpstl321 » Wed Jul 23, 2014 1:34 pm

Deleted by zpstl321
zpstl321
hunter
 
Posts: 510
Joined: Fri Jul 20, 2012 11:17 am

Re: New Hevi steel

Postby SPatrick » Thu Jul 24, 2014 4:43 pm

Honk-n-quack wrote:Hevi Metal was the worst patterning shell I ever shot. Very blown patterns


Gun, Choke, and Shell? If you remember?
Shaun Patrick
Avery Prostaff
HEVI-Shot Prostaff
User avatar
SPatrick
State Moderator
 
Posts: 2031
Joined: Tue Oct 20, 2009 8:06 am
Location: MO

Re: New Hevi steel

Postby Honk-n-quack » Thu Jul 24, 2014 5:05 pm

Baikal, Trulock Improved Mod, Heavy Metal #2. The pattern was blown all over the 40x40" patterning board. I put in a fasteel and the bb's all fit nice and tight in a 30" circle at 30 yards.
Honk-n-quack
hunter
 
Posts: 574
Joined: Tue Jan 29, 2013 10:54 am
Location: Eugene Oregon

Re: New Hevi steel

Postby On the X » Thu Jul 24, 2014 6:46 pm

zpstl321 wrote:Deleted by zpstl321

Numerous hit and runs by this poster, half this thread's posts have been this guys deletions LOL
On the X
hunter
 
Posts: 276
Joined: Mon Jan 27, 2014 7:34 pm

Re: New Hevi steel

Postby On the X » Thu Jul 24, 2014 6:53 pm

Honk-n-quack wrote:Baikal, Trulock Improved Mod, Heavy Metal #2. The pattern was blown all over the 40x40" patterning board. I put in a fasteel and the bb's all fit nice and tight in a 30" circle at 30 yards.

I shoot the same as all the above. HM is not the best patterning load by far but you can get adequate patterns with it which I do. Not the best but adequate working patterns. HM is a strange thing, it lacks in pattern on paper quality but many many users are having really good field results with it. For the record, I've been hunting ducks since '87 and have been required to shoot non tox shot since '88 so I've shot lots of steel and have been seriously impressed with how this stuff kills ducks/
On the X
hunter
 
Posts: 276
Joined: Mon Jan 27, 2014 7:34 pm

Re: New Hevi steel

Postby zpstl321 » Fri Jul 25, 2014 6:18 am

On the X wrote:
zpstl321 wrote:Deleted by zpstl321

Numerous hit and runs by this poster, half this thread's posts have been this guys deletions LOL


Trying to be nice.

The information is out there for those who care to look for it. As to the poor patterns...There are videos on the tube for those that want to see examples before buying. The example show factory tubes and aftermarket tubes with Hevi Metal. Also, look up various waterfowl sites and shotgun sites and view the numerous patterns/test posted up.

As a side note, Speedball would be a better version of hevi metal since it contains true (or at least slightly heavier than lead) tungsten pellets 12 g/cc. Provided it patterns in your guns this would be a much better option and is more likely to perform like people think hevi metal does. This of course is only true provide they haven't pulled yet another bait and switch on people.
zpstl321
hunter
 
Posts: 510
Joined: Fri Jul 20, 2012 11:17 am

Re: New Hevi steel

Postby TEN GAUGE BBB » Fri Jul 25, 2014 2:08 pm

On the X wrote:HM is not the best patterning load by far
We found this to be true in both the 10 gauge and the 12 gauge loads that we shot. The patterns were not too bad inside 30 yards but past that is when we could not get the patterns to hold together. When we used more choke we were getting large shot clumps and holes in the patterns. The loads were #2 and BB in the 10 and 12. The guns were a Browning Maxus, SX3, 870 Wingmaster, E.R. Amantino O/U and a BPS in the 12 gauge. In the 10 gauge it was the Browning Gold, Remington SP-10 and a BPS-10. I will have to dig thru my shooting notes to find the exact chokes we used for each gun. If I find them I will post if anyone is interested. What we found is that Hevi Metal may be a good load inside 30 yards BUT plain steel loads will get the job done at a fraction of the cost. :thumbsup:
TEN GAUGE BBB
hunter
 
Posts: 111
Joined: Wed Aug 14, 2013 10:52 pm
Location: OVER THE HILLS AND FAR AWAY

Re: New Hevi steel

Postby zpstl321 » Sat Jul 26, 2014 5:34 pm

TEN GAUGE BBB wrote:
On the X wrote:HM is not the best patterning load by far
We found this to be true in both the 10 gauge and the 12 gauge loads that we shot. The patterns were not too bad inside 30 yards but past that is when we could not get the patterns to hold together. When we used more choke we were getting large shot clumps and holes in the patterns. The loads were #2 and BB in the 10 and 12. The guns were a Browning Maxus, SX3, 870 Wingmaster, E.R. Amantino O/U and a BPS in the 12 gauge. In the 10 gauge it was the Browning Gold, Remington SP-10 and a BPS-10. I will have to dig thru my shooting notes to find the exact chokes we used for each gun. If I find them I will post if anyone is interested. What we found is that Hevi Metal may be a good load inside 30 yards BUT plain steel loads will get the job done at a fraction of the cost. :thumbsup:



Thank you!
zpstl321
hunter
 
Posts: 510
Joined: Fri Jul 20, 2012 11:17 am

New Hevi steel

Postby nmbrinkman » Sat Jul 26, 2014 10:24 pm

I've heard that because of their higher shot density the tungsten mixed in travels to the periphery of the pattern at longer distances. Lead itself is of a higher shot density so does that mean at 40 yds lead would travel to the periphery at 40 yds too?

I'm not a physics major nor do I have as much time patterning loads as most but I shoot HM with confidence.
User avatar
nmbrinkman
hunter
 
Posts: 119
Joined: Tue Mar 12, 2013 1:50 pm

Re: New Hevi steel

Postby TEN GAUGE BBB » Sat Jul 26, 2014 10:58 pm

Getting back to the topic of the new Hevi-Steel loads. I will give them a try,I know it is plain steel shot but I like the idea of a 1 1/4 oz load of #1 @ 1500 fps. This could be a very good all around waterfowl load. I will post results as I am sure others will too. :thumbsup:
TEN GAUGE BBB
hunter
 
Posts: 111
Joined: Wed Aug 14, 2013 10:52 pm
Location: OVER THE HILLS AND FAR AWAY

Re: New Hevi steel

Postby TexasGeese » Sun Jul 27, 2014 11:23 am

TEN GAUGE BBB wrote:Getting back to the topic of the new Hevi-Steel loads. I will give them a try,I know it is plain steel shot but I like the idea of a 1 1/4 oz load of #1 @ 1500 fps. This could be a very good all around waterfowl load. I will post results as I am sure others will too. :thumbsup:


I'll just get the Federal blue box 1.5 oz. load at 1500fps at the same price and have an even better load.
User avatar
TexasGeese
hunter
 
Posts: 256
Joined: Thu Nov 03, 2005 8:33 pm
Location: TX

Re: New Hevi steel

Postby Yuchi1 » Sun Jul 27, 2014 11:32 am

My patterning results with HM (Beretta AL390/PM, PHIM, PHMOD & TT.681 tubes) mirror that of Joe Hunter and many others in that it is basically a spreader load as >30 yards, it blooms out into uselessness.

Guys that are wingshot challenged might benefit from that, as long as they stay within the 30 yard effective range parameters.
Sent from my Sumerian tablets

Does the number of bands claimed simply mean you have an Ebay account?

FSH Pro Staffer

High Potentate, NSSB (no spinning shotcup brotherhood)
Yuchi1
hunter
 
Posts: 1608
Joined: Wed Jan 17, 2007 9:15 pm
Location: Creek Nation of Oklahoma

Re: New Hevi steel

Postby On the X » Sun Jul 27, 2014 11:56 am

Yuchi1 wrote:My patterning results with HM (Beretta AL390/PM, PHIM, PHMOD & TT.681 tubes) mirror that of Joe Hunter and many others in that it is basically a spreader load as >30 yards, it blooms out into uselessness.

Guys that are wingshot challenged might benefit from that, as long as they stay within the 30 yard effective range parameters.

Yuchi I forgot, how many ducks have you killed with HM again? I can't remember. Me.....every duck I've killed in the last 3 years have been with HM and plenty have been beyond 30 yards. But paper beats real world all the time, or is it paper beats scissors, hell that can't be right. Seriously though, you say your PAPER results mirror Joe Hunter's and MANY others. Mine mirror many many more who are killing ducks and geese and are more than satisfied (that's why we keep shooting it) with it.
On the X
hunter
 
Posts: 276
Joined: Mon Jan 27, 2014 7:34 pm

Re: New Hevi steel

Postby TEN GAUGE BBB » Sun Jul 27, 2014 5:33 pm

TexasGeese wrote:
TEN GAUGE BBB wrote:Getting back to the topic of the new Hevi-Steel loads. I will give them a try,I know it is plain steel shot but I like the idea of a 1 1/4 oz load of #1 @ 1500 fps. This could be a very good all around waterfowl load. I will post results as I am sure others will too. :thumbsup:


I'll just get the Federal blue box 1.5 oz. load at 1500fps at the same price and have an even better load.

Yes that is a fine load but I have a few guns that do not shoot 3 1/2 inch shells.
TEN GAUGE BBB
hunter
 
Posts: 111
Joined: Wed Aug 14, 2013 10:52 pm
Location: OVER THE HILLS AND FAR AWAY

Re: New Hevi steel

Postby Yuchi1 » Sun Jul 27, 2014 10:00 pm

On the X wrote:
Yuchi1 wrote:My patterning results with HM (Beretta AL390/PM, PHIM, PHMOD & TT.681 tubes) mirror that of Joe Hunter and many others in that it is basically a spreader load as >30 yards, it blooms out into uselessness.

Guys that are wingshot challenged might benefit from that, as long as they stay within the 30 yard effective range parameters.

Yuchi I forgot, how many ducks have you killed with HM again? I can't remember. Me.....every duck I've killed in the last 3 years have been with HM and plenty have been beyond 30 yards. But paper beats real world all the time, or is it paper beats scissors, hell that can't be right. Seriously though, you say your PAPER results mirror Joe Hunter's and MANY others. Mine mirror many many more who are killing ducks and geese and are more than satisfied (that's why we keep shooting it) with it.


Really? :rolleyes:

I chose not to shoot birds with it after the patterning sessions as beyond 30 yards, it was evident the crap quickly became a crippler.

Q. Are you a Pro Staffer for EMI?
Sent from my Sumerian tablets

Does the number of bands claimed simply mean you have an Ebay account?

FSH Pro Staffer

High Potentate, NSSB (no spinning shotcup brotherhood)
Yuchi1
hunter
 
Posts: 1608
Joined: Wed Jan 17, 2007 9:15 pm
Location: Creek Nation of Oklahoma

Re: New Hevi steel

Postby On the X » Mon Jul 28, 2014 3:24 pm

Yuchi1 wrote:
On the X wrote:
Yuchi1 wrote:My patterning results with HM (Beretta AL390/PM, PHIM, PHMOD & TT.681 tubes) mirror that of Joe Hunter and many others in that it is basically a spreader load as >30 yards, it blooms out into uselessness.

Guys that are wingshot challenged might benefit from that, as long as they stay within the 30 yard effective range parameters.

Yuchi I forgot, how many ducks have you killed with HM again? I can't remember. Me.....every duck I've killed in the last 3 years have been with HM and plenty have been beyond 30 yards. But paper beats real world all the time, or is it paper beats scissors, hell that can't be right. Seriously though, you say your PAPER results mirror Joe Hunter's and MANY others. Mine mirror many many more who are killing ducks and geese and are more than satisfied (that's why we keep shooting it) with it.


Really? :rolleyes:

I chose not to shoot birds with it after the patterning sessions as beyond 30 yards, it was evident the crap quickly became a crippler.

Q. Are you a Pro Staffer for EMI?

Really? :rolleyes:

I choose TO shoot it because it hasn't been a crippler beyond 30 yards.

Are you a prostaffer for anyone other than EMI? I ask because obviously if someone uses a product and argues in its behalh, these days, you've got to be a prostaffer.
On the X
hunter
 
Posts: 276
Joined: Mon Jan 27, 2014 7:34 pm

Re: New Hevi steel

Postby Yuchi1 » Mon Jul 28, 2014 4:56 pm

On the X wrote:
Yuchi1 wrote:
On the X wrote:
Yuchi1 wrote:My patterning results with HM (Beretta AL390/PM, PHIM, PHMOD & TT.681 tubes) mirror that of Joe Hunter and many others in that it is basically a spreader load as >30 yards, it blooms out into uselessness.

Guys that are wingshot challenged might benefit from that, as long as they stay within the 30 yard effective range parameters.

Yuchi I forgot, how many ducks have you killed with HM again? I can't remember. Me.....every duck I've killed in the last 3 years have been with HM and plenty have been beyond 30 yards. But paper beats real world all the time, or is it paper beats scissors, hell that can't be right. Seriously though, you say your PAPER results mirror Joe Hunter's and MANY others. Mine mirror many many more who are killing ducks and geese and are more than satisfied (that's why we keep shooting it) with it.


Really? :rolleyes:

I chose not to shoot birds with it after the patterning sessions as beyond 30 yards, it was evident the crap quickly became a crippler.

Q. Are you a Pro Staffer for EMI?

Really? :rolleyes:

I choose TO shoot it because it hasn't been a crippler beyond 30 yards.

Are you a prostaffer for anyone other than EMI? I ask because obviously if someone uses a product and argues in its behalh, these days, you've got to be a prostaffer.


Simple question...a yes or no will suffice.
Sent from my Sumerian tablets

Does the number of bands claimed simply mean you have an Ebay account?

FSH Pro Staffer

High Potentate, NSSB (no spinning shotcup brotherhood)
Yuchi1
hunter
 
Posts: 1608
Joined: Wed Jan 17, 2007 9:15 pm
Location: Creek Nation of Oklahoma

Re: New Hevi steel

Postby On the X » Mon Jul 28, 2014 6:34 pm

Yuchi, your acceptance that others could actually use a product you disagree in and have satisfactory results would suffice as well. As for your redundant question, a question asked by you and a few others here (always insisting an answer, as if you're owed one by the way) everytime the subject arises.....no I'm not a prostaffer. What I am is a satisfied customer and user of HM. You and the few others act as though EMI stole your wife or kicked your dog. If you don't like or use the product, AND don't have any REAL experience pass on by threads like this. UNLESS, you and your few have made it your lifes mission to destroy EMI or something, which your failing at obviously as their products keep selling. So Yuchi, maybe I answered your question maybe I didn't, I don't really care as it was really none of your business in the 1st place.
On the X
hunter
 
Posts: 276
Joined: Mon Jan 27, 2014 7:34 pm

Re: New Hevi steel

Postby lostknife4 » Tue Jul 29, 2014 8:21 pm

I have never, nor do I intend to ever, use EMI products. I do believe that any spherical pellets have superior ballistic properties than non-spherical pellets and further the very high mass density pellets are far superior ballistically than the lighter mass density pellets.
That said I believe there are several very good factory loaded higher than Steel and some even higher mass density than Lead SPHERICAL pellet loadings that have greater than 50 yard pattern densities than anything that EMI have ever made and will ever make. The Chronographed and pattern testing done by long term reloaders on this and other forums clearly shows that EMI and Winchester cubic pellet loadings are great at less than 40 yards, but so is spherical relatively low mass density Steel, and at a far more economical cost.
I am also adamantly against deceptive and misleading advertising (propaganda), whats wrong with telling the truth, do the lies sound better and sell more product and wound more game?
I handload everything I shoot, and have in both metallics and shotshell, with the exception of 22 Rim Fire ammunition and have been doing so for over 50 years, that's a lot of targets and patterns and game too, so for anyone to question our, those of us who have been at this game for a long while, observations and conclusions, well they better have some books full of patterns and data because we already have and can back up our recommendations with proven facts and statistics. No I don't have any data on EMI's irregular shaped and questionable mass density pellets but I do have years of experience , theory and data from reputable ballisticians and reloaders, like Yuchi, BT and others, that prove that spherical pellets are the optimum shape for external ballistic performance proven over two centuries ago, hell at 30 yards anything with any shape will kill birds if you can hold the patterns together.....
I am clearly stating too that I have absolutely no affiliation with any reloading component manufacturer, factory ammo manufacturer or reloading equipment manufacturer. I call it as it is every time, not like some outdoor writers, and "factory representatives", who seem to favour those products that are being provided "gifts" for favourable reports in the "Brook and Bush Magazines" and web chat rooms. I use Steel shot from Bucks Run and BPI and TSS from Hawglips. Lead target shot I get from Hummason here in Canada.
Lost
"It's not the game but the chase ~ not the trophy but the race !" from my Dad, many years ago.
User avatar
lostknife4
hunter
 
Posts: 4358
Joined: Sat Apr 03, 2010 4:32 pm
Location: Eastern Canada

Re: New Hevi steel

Postby Yuchi1 » Tue Jul 29, 2014 11:28 pm

On the X wrote:Yuchi, your acceptance that others could actually use a product you disagree in and have satisfosactory results would suffice as well. As for your redundant question, a question asked by you and a few others here (always insisting an answer, as if you're owed one by the way) everytime the subject arises.....no I'm not a prostaffer. What I am is a satisfied customer and user of HM. You and the few others act as though EMI stole your wife or kicked your dog. If you don't like or use the product, AND don't have any REAL experience pass on by threads like this. UNLESS, you and your few have made it your lifes mission to destroy EMI or something, which your failing at obviously as their products keep selling. So Yuchi, maybe I answered your question maybe I didn't, I don't really care as it was really none of your business in the 1st place.


Well...you answered the question, then you retracted the answer in a rather ambigous fashion...so, you can keep the wife but don't kick my dog anymore.

BTW, I have real experience with HM and (performancewise) it was inferior to regular steel and being overpriced, to boot, was nowhere near a value.
Sent from my Sumerian tablets

Does the number of bands claimed simply mean you have an Ebay account?

FSH Pro Staffer

High Potentate, NSSB (no spinning shotcup brotherhood)
Yuchi1
hunter
 
Posts: 1608
Joined: Wed Jan 17, 2007 9:15 pm
Location: Creek Nation of Oklahoma

Re: New Hevi steel

Postby Quacker-Wacker » Wed Jul 30, 2014 8:02 am

Yuchi1 wrote:
On the X wrote:Yuchi, your acceptance that others could actually use a product you disagree in and have satisfosactory results would suffice as well. As for your redundant question, a question asked by you and a few others here (always insisting an answer, as if you're owed one by the way) everytime the subject arises.....no I'm not a prostaffer. What I am is a satisfied customer and user of HM. You and the few others act as though EMI stole your wife or kicked your dog. If you don't like or use the product, AND don't have any REAL experience pass on by threads like this. UNLESS, you and your few have made it your lifes mission to destroy EMI or something, which your failing at obviously as their products keep selling. So Yuchi, maybe I answered your question maybe I didn't, I don't really care as it was really none of your business in the 1st place.


Well...you answered the question, then you retracted the answer in a rather ambigous fashion...so, you can keep the wife but don't kick my dog anymore.

BTW, I have real experience with HM and (performancewise) it was inferior to regular steel and being overpriced, to boot, was nowhere near a value.

Apparently having REAL experience means shooting at waterfowl regardless of weather it patterns well or not! :no:
User avatar
Quacker-Wacker
hunter
 
Posts: 147
Joined: Thu Dec 19, 2013 11:24 am
Location: Between Buffalo and Niagara Falls NY

PreviousNext

Return to Shotshell, Reloading, Ballistics, & Chokes

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: sanddude and 4 guests