Sac river water update

Duck hunting in California topics include: California duck hunting trips, the past hunting seasons, and share information about California duck hunting guides.

Moderators: duckman2000, OGblackcloud, spoonysmaker

Re: Sac river water update

Postby marsh-mello » Wed Feb 26, 2014 6:42 pm

Calikev wrote:
Mallards Only wrote:Could it be that even with the subsidies totaling millions, he still has to operate on very thin margins in order to make ends meet? No, that can't be it. All farmers are bazillionairres according to you.


Most farmers aren't abusing the system and I think most folks would agree to the value of keeping those farms going. However, it is naive to think that some farmers aren't abusing the system. Like with any money coming down with the Government, there will always be those who come to depend on it more than they should.

Most folks here don't want to put farmers out of business. However, if farms over the long term can't be sustainable then taxpayers shouldn't have to bail them out year after year. Short term makes sense but some farmers are becoming welfare recipients because of where/what they are trying to farm.

I don't remember the Federal Government bailing out four of my family members when Hershey's moved down to Mexico and they all lost their jobs. They all had to go find jobs elsewhere on their own and the Government didn't give us squat for it. Those farmers who lost out got taken care of though just as they always do. None of my family took one cent of welfare and found jobs at the time in a tough job market.


Good post Kevin I agree...
Charter member of the "I only shoot bar belly geese club". I'm a Bar belly goose purist!
marsh-mello
hunter
 
Posts: 607
Joined: Thu Jan 11, 2007 1:30 pm


Re: Sac river water update

Postby Mallards Only » Wed Feb 26, 2014 6:44 pm

I don't ignore any information. I look at the facts and make informed decisions based on fact. You, on the other hand, just like to argue about stuff you know nothing about. (I didn't quote your lengthy rant which says pretty much nothing but you know I'm talking about you.)
Mallards Only
hunter
 
Posts: 230
Joined: Tue Jan 13, 2009 1:49 pm
Location: Chico, CA

Re: Sac river water update

Postby marsh-mello » Wed Feb 26, 2014 6:50 pm

As long as you added yourself to the list I'm all good.

While you're checking facts try some of these on for size...

http://www.ctj.org/corporatetaxdodgers/ ... Report.pdf

marsh-mello wrote:
Here add yourself to this list of other smart doctors...enjoy the host as well.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=19LUncgG8VA
Last edited by marsh-mello on Wed Feb 26, 2014 10:56 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Charter member of the "I only shoot bar belly geese club". I'm a Bar belly goose purist!
marsh-mello
hunter
 
Posts: 607
Joined: Thu Jan 11, 2007 1:30 pm

Re: Sac river water update

Postby Nabs » Wed Feb 26, 2014 7:00 pm

So when someone needs help because of bad decisions in their life, it is the taxpayers obligation and responsibility to provide food through SNAP, housing through section 8, health services through Medi-cal, and cash assistance through welfare. Got it!

As far as states that provide welfare benefits above teachers salaries, it was in the link I provided, lazy debating socialist does not want to look at any evidence provided, if it does not match your thinking it must not be true I guess.


P.S. Median is not Average
Even Ducktape cannot fix Stupid, but it can muffle the sound!
User avatar
Nabs
hunter
 
Posts: 768
Joined: Wed Sep 09, 2009 5:35 pm

Re: Sac river water update

Postby marsh-mello » Wed Feb 26, 2014 7:16 pm

Nabs wrote:So when someone needs help because of bad decisions in their life, it is the taxpayers obligation and responsibility to provide food through SNAP, housing through section 8, health services through Medi-cal, and cash assistance through welfare. Got it!

As far as states that provide welfare benefits above teachers salaries, it was in the link I provided, lazy debating socialist does not want to look at any evidence provided, if it does not match your thinking it must not be true I guess.


P.S. Median is not Average


You know what sometimes bad things happen to good people too... :huh: Catastrophic medical issues, accidental death of main provider, losing a job, getting divorced and having to still have responsibility for several children...mostly women who stayed at home or worked part time and were raising kids and do not have career incomes, the working poor who might need help while they address their education or retraining to get a hand up, etc....no but you and MO know they all are lazy moochers. :fingerpt: You two really need to find some real facts and not just continued regurgitating some contrived disparaging stereotypical dogma while ignoring the real fleecing of tax payers. If you stop spoon feeding yourself the pablum and dogma of extremist politics you might have come across this gem in the actual study. "Contrary to stereotypes, there is no evidence that people on welfare are lazy or do not wish to work."

BS to your PS....

I posted BOTH average AND median...both over 50 thousand...you made a bold claim and I asked you to back it up by providing specifics and you provided nothing...empty hollow information not included in your link...move on. Name two states where you can make over 56,000 a year average teachers wages as you claim in welfare... you said there were 8? Seems if it was there or you knew you'd be thrashing about yourself to show me "I told you so"... If you can't your just blowing smoke and got called out on it. It's that simple. No one qualifies for every program and gets assistance from all at the same juncture so lumping them all together and fabricating some mythical person who makes 60 thousand on welfare is...fraudulent to say the least. These supplemental programs are designed and means tested to keep people and mostly children housed and fed...no one is taking any Hawaiian vacations on this level of minimal sustenance.
Charter member of the "I only shoot bar belly geese club". I'm a Bar belly goose purist!
marsh-mello
hunter
 
Posts: 607
Joined: Thu Jan 11, 2007 1:30 pm

Re: Sac river water update

Postby Mallards Only » Thu Feb 27, 2014 7:48 am

marsh-mello wrote:
Here add yourself to this list of other smart doctors...enjoy the host as well.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=19LUncgG8VA

I guess there's smart-stupid and then just plain stupid like Maher and you. Maher doesn't have any more proof of his claims than you but, somehow, you all think you know it all when it's clear you know nothing.
Mallards Only
hunter
 
Posts: 230
Joined: Tue Jan 13, 2009 1:49 pm
Location: Chico, CA

Re: Sac river water update

Postby marsh-mello » Thu Feb 27, 2014 7:52 am

Mallards Only wrote:
marsh-mello wrote:
Here add yourself to this list of other smart doctors...enjoy the host as well.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=19LUncgG8VA

I guess there's smart-stupid and then just plain stupid like Maher and you. Maher doesn't have any more proof of his claims than you but, somehow, you all think you know it all when it's clear you know nothing.



Of course your creamy layer of Michelle Bachmen is showing through just a bit, she's famously known just a bit too for making up her own facts and spreading her own form of TEA party drivel in much the same manner as you do...I'm glad you enjoyed the link :thumbsup: :thumbsup:
Charter member of the "I only shoot bar belly geese club". I'm a Bar belly goose purist!
marsh-mello
hunter
 
Posts: 607
Joined: Thu Jan 11, 2007 1:30 pm

Re: Sac river water update

Postby Mallards Only » Thu Feb 27, 2014 9:10 am

You just proved my point.
Mallards Only
hunter
 
Posts: 230
Joined: Tue Jan 13, 2009 1:49 pm
Location: Chico, CA

Re: Sac river water update

Postby Nabs » Thu Feb 27, 2014 11:36 am

The statement is in the link I provided, care to show how the average teacher salary is $56,000? Because it says so in the link you provided? I agree that if you take a pay scale for teacher salaries and do an average of the scale you may come up with 56,000. that does not mean teachers actually make that much.

http://www.payscale.com/research/US/All_K-12_Teachers/Salary#by_Years_Experience

The fact that you want to argue amount of welfare received versus how much someone makes at a job show how absolutely retarded your point of view is. You (and everyone for that matter) are not entitled to anything for nothing.


As far as hard times welfare and food stamps, I call bull crap, typical liberal bullshit, if you cannot afford what you want, ask the government. And to answer your question, No, you are not entitled to anything you do not earn. Need food stamps to eat while watching cable television or talking on your cell phone?

<start sarcasm> If the government spends more than it takes in, it does not have a spending problem it has a revenue problem (means more taxes needed). <end sarcasm>
Even Ducktape cannot fix Stupid, but it can muffle the sound!
User avatar
Nabs
hunter
 
Posts: 768
Joined: Wed Sep 09, 2009 5:35 pm

Re: Sac river water update

Postby duckdoa » Thu Feb 27, 2014 11:47 am

Bam! Pow! Zing! Maybe it would be easier to set up a time and place for a non-celebrity boxing match? I would pay $10 easy to watch! Opening round would be 2 minutes of verbal bashing followed by 2 minutes of duking it out for 3 rounds, if anybody is left standing they take home the money and a small DHC trophy. Winner, winner chicken dinner.
The sky is falling, the sky is falling! Oops that's just ducks and geese...
duckdoa
hunter
 
Posts: 287
Joined: Mon Nov 22, 2010 9:03 pm

Re: Sac river water update

Postby Nabs » Thu Feb 27, 2014 12:01 pm

duckdoa wrote:Bam! Pow! Zing! Maybe it would be easier to set up a time and place for a non-celebrity boxing match? I would pay $10 easy to watch! Opening round would be 2 minutes of verbal bashing followed by 2 minutes of duking it out for 3 rounds, if anybody is left standing they take home the money and a small DHC trophy. Winner, winner chicken dinner.


Oh come on, you know we cannot do that, according to the leftist socialist agenda, everyone must take home an equal amount of the money whether they show up or not, everyone gets a participation ribbon no matter how well or poorly they do.

Oh and in the 2 minute verbal bashing, will edits be allowed?
Even Ducktape cannot fix Stupid, but it can muffle the sound!
User avatar
Nabs
hunter
 
Posts: 768
Joined: Wed Sep 09, 2009 5:35 pm

Re: Sac river water update

Postby Mallards Only » Thu Feb 27, 2014 1:34 pm

If the "duking it out" part was anything like the "intellectual" discussion, it would be a quick fight. My money's on Nabs. Of course, MM would claim that it was unfair because Nabs brought facts and common sense to the fight rather than worthless rhetoric and stupid sarcasm.
Mallards Only
hunter
 
Posts: 230
Joined: Tue Jan 13, 2009 1:49 pm
Location: Chico, CA

Re: Sac river water update

Postby marsh-mello » Thu Feb 27, 2014 8:10 pm

Nabs wrote:The statement is in the link I provided, care to show how the average teacher salary is $56,000? Because it says so in the link you provided? I agree that if you take a pay scale for teacher salaries and do an average of the scale you may come up with 56,000. that does not mean teachers actually make that much. Uhhh...Yeah when you take the actual salaries and average the actual data it does.

http://www.payscale.com/research/US/All_K-12_Teachers/Salary#by_Years_Experience

The fact that you want to argue amount of welfare received versus how much someone makes at a job show how absolutely retarded your point of view is. You (and everyone for that matter) GREAT we agree then subsidies for Agri-business and Corporate America which would be included in EVERYONE are not entitled to anything for nothing.

As far as hard times welfare and food stamps, I call bull crap, typical liberal bullshit, if you cannot afford what you want, ask the government. And to answer your question, No, you are not entitled to anything you do not earn. Need food stamps to eat while watching cable television or talking on your cell phone? If you want to single out abuse then we will probably agree but until then when you rail against the entire system and impune everyone with inaccurate and ridiculous stereotypes it just makes you wrong.

<start sarcasm> If the government spends more than it takes in, it does not have a spending problem it has a revenue problem (means more taxes needed). <end sarcasm>


Let me see I post information from the primary science based educational authority with links to the supporting data and tables for the information they use to provide reports to Congress and anyone else who needs information and FACTS. You post a link from a blog which makes an unsubstantiated "statement" with no background or supporting data to support a creation of some mythological person in which they perform an analysis of a previous study reaping every maximum program benefit ever invented by man to come up with a phony equivalency number? Yeah I can see as can everyone else where you get your "FACTS" which are the sole driving issue for forming your pre-formed opinions. Let's not forget the false stereotype stigma you and MO try to envision, how you can sleep at night full well knowing you are going to get a visit from Jacob Marley and three ghosts around Christmas. :lol3:

Here's lesson 101...to find the US teachers average salary you would add up all the "average" salaries teachers actually make from each state then divide that by the number of states. Perhaps you could write to the NCES and tell them how in your vast plethora of learning you understand math and simple addition and division and statistics better than they do.

Who Is NCES?
The purpose of the National Center for Education Statistics' website is to provide clear, complete information about NCES' mission and activities, and to serve the research, education and other interested communities. The National Center for Education Statistics (NCES) is the primary federal entity for collecting and analyzing data related to education in the U.S. and other nations. NCES is located within the U.S. Department of Education and the Institute of Education Sciences.

Nabs wrote: Wanna know the most disturbing fact I found doing research about welfare?
Number of U.S. States where Welfare pays more than the average salary of a U.S. Teacher 8


Don't be mad at me...I just asked you to back up this outlandish claim. You started down this road, I just clarified it for you once you decided which direction you were headed. Heck I even made it easy on you I only asked you to name two states. I guess when you use the term "research" or "facts" it means different things to you and me? :huh:

Politics, Government support for Corporate America and Welfare...the only thing missing so far if we want to have a real conversation is Religion. :lol3:
Last edited by marsh-mello on Thu Feb 27, 2014 10:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Charter member of the "I only shoot bar belly geese club". I'm a Bar belly goose purist!
marsh-mello
hunter
 
Posts: 607
Joined: Thu Jan 11, 2007 1:30 pm

Re: Sac river water update

Postby Nabs » Thu Feb 27, 2014 9:31 pm

GREAT we agree then subsidies for Agri-business and Corporate America which would be included in EVERYONE are not entitled to anything for nothing.


And there in lies the rub, Agri-business and Corporate America employ hundreds of thousands of people, it is estimatated that every dollar produced by Agribusiness returns 3 dollars directly to the economy.

As far as NCES being the end all final say on teachers salaries, that is like asking City Hall how much of my water and sewer bill is spent to provide that service (their answer will always be, Why all of it of course).

Of course the Department of Education feeds numbers that match their agenda, they are a government agency that depends on taxpayer money to establish budgets, the bigger the salaries, the bigger the budget.

Top 10 Hourly Wage Equivalent Welfare States in U.S.
State Hourly Wage Equivalent
Hawaii $17.50
Alaska $15.48
Massachusetts $14.66
Connecticut $14.23
Washington, D.C. $13.99
New York $13.13
New Jersey $12.55
Rhode Island $12.55
California $11.59
Virginia $11.11

Anyone of the above states is an insult an an affront to every working American in the country.

And you have it wrong when you say I do not recognize, I simply do not care to be forcibly stolen from to put a roof over someone else's head or food in someone else's stomach. I am tired of being robbed (taxed) to pay for someone else's poor decisions,lack of ambition or simple bad luck.
Even Ducktape cannot fix Stupid, but it can muffle the sound!
User avatar
Nabs
hunter
 
Posts: 768
Joined: Wed Sep 09, 2009 5:35 pm

Re: Sac river water update

Postby marsh-mello » Thu Feb 27, 2014 9:39 pm

No agenda just the straight facts. What would even be the hidden agenda there anyway to show they get paid not enough so they could beg for more? Wouldn't that make MORE sense if there was one? Hence the figure might be "lower" if you were right? Come on there isn't a conspiracy under every rock you turn over. Good grief.

Equivalent is the operative word here...means they do not receive those amounts, nothing even close to it, but receive some services like access to medical services, etc. I have little faith in an arbitrary and capricious analysis and figure which has attributed and heaped on benefits of multiple programs all of which no one individual comes close to receiving at one time. The folks who put the stats you cite together have as much of an axe to grind as you do. You should also know those would be the maximum contrived figures as the benefits are means tested so the majority who work do not come even close as they receive reduced benefits and some services like medical are programs provided through employment.
Last edited by marsh-mello on Thu Feb 27, 2014 9:47 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Charter member of the "I only shoot bar belly geese club". I'm a Bar belly goose purist!
marsh-mello
hunter
 
Posts: 607
Joined: Thu Jan 11, 2007 1:30 pm

Re: Sac river water update

Postby Nabs » Thu Feb 27, 2014 9:47 pm

Hell you won't even admit that the SNAP program costs more that all farm subsidies. and you can pull every one of those figures from your own links, I did, farm subsidies equaled 13 to 21% of the SNAP program depending on where I pulled the numbers from Your links.

You and Slow have a couple things in common, biggest one is that neither one are ever wrong in your own mind.

Nice Job brushing the statistics I provided under the rug, they don't suit your agenda, they must be wrong.
Even Ducktape cannot fix Stupid, but it can muffle the sound!
User avatar
Nabs
hunter
 
Posts: 768
Joined: Wed Sep 09, 2009 5:35 pm

Re: Sac river water update

Postby marsh-mello » Thu Feb 27, 2014 9:52 pm

Nabs wrote:Hell you won't even admit that the SNAP program costs more that all farm subsidies. and you can pull every one of those figures from your own links, I did, farm subsidies equaled 13 to 21% of the SNAP program depending on where I pulled the numbers from Your links.

You and Slow have a couple things in common, biggest one is that neither one are ever wrong in your own mind.

Nice Job brushing the statistics I provided under the rug, they don't suit your agenda, they must be wrong.


Agenda? That would be to root out waste at every level. If there is abuse in SNAP by all means identify it and root it out. If there are large Agri-business who in the final analysis could make it without billions in handouts ,which are really only the tip of the iceberg when it comes to corporate subsidies so don't hold them up alone with regard to SNAP, then why shouldn't those corporations who make billions in profit and still pay no taxes be getting a free ride off both our backs? Think about that for a second and if you can accept that FACT then we might have some common ground.

This conversation is really all about that double standard which some have problems understanding...but perhaps a position more easily understood if they benefit personally.
Charter member of the "I only shoot bar belly geese club". I'm a Bar belly goose purist!
marsh-mello
hunter
 
Posts: 607
Joined: Thu Jan 11, 2007 1:30 pm

Re: Sac river water update

Postby Nabs » Thu Feb 27, 2014 10:10 pm

Every think that maybe just maybe those subsidies are the equivalent of seeding a field? In other words the Government and Economy make more money dictating what the farmers plant, which is what subsidies are all about. Another level of control. I do not like them, I do not get them. I also do not receive FoodStamps or welfare.

I guess in your Utopia fields just magically produce crops, and grocery money magically appears on that whatever card that you use at the store.

As far as abuse, ANY money forcibly stolen from me and given to someone who did not earn it is ABUSE.
Even Ducktape cannot fix Stupid, but it can muffle the sound!
User avatar
Nabs
hunter
 
Posts: 768
Joined: Wed Sep 09, 2009 5:35 pm

Re: Sac river water update

Postby marsh-mello » Thu Feb 27, 2014 10:21 pm

Given the attractiveness of subsidies for certain crops I think Farmers plant what they feel they can get the most money from...whether that be from the government or from the free market or BOTH. Don't think for a second these programs are not self contrived and manipulated and set up for their own benefit by anyone other than politicians, lobbyists and their lawyers.

As far as picking both our pockets...and what is ABUSE I think the definition is more than applicable with regard to subsidies. Anyone who is farming and needs the government to buy them the "equivalent" of seed year after year after year...needs to find another job or plant another crop. There is also more to it then just that...with the price guarantees and subsidized insurance etc, etc...

I think we can agree to disagree...
Charter member of the "I only shoot bar belly geese club". I'm a Bar belly goose purist!
marsh-mello
hunter
 
Posts: 607
Joined: Thu Jan 11, 2007 1:30 pm

Previous

Return to California Duck Hunting

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 6 guests