slowshooter wrote: Performing better and making that instinctive takes a ton of trigger time.
Also, many guys out there don't understand what is really available to them in terms of shooting disciplines. I can't tell you how many times I've tried to explain the difference between FITASC and skeet or sporting and trap…. And that's to other duck hunters!
I think most folks don't give a crap about what FITASC is ...I know I don't and when people start dropping those bombs around it becomes sort of a slam in the way it's presented and perceived at least for me and from other folks response an elitist issue. If honestly and sincerely it is not intended in that manner and I know it wouldn't from you, just know it comes off that way.
Yeah, it probably comes off that way. Mainly because it's tough to see emotion online. Thanks for the pass - but a lot of guys here don't know me personally so there's that… Talking about stuff like shooting is like word salad to most guys. If some of the shooters here talk about FITASC, COMPAQ, SuperSporting or Flurries then get whipped up about Sporting, fun shoots and Skeet or do loops over a specific speed, shell, gun or doodad? I completely agree that it could be perceived as snobbery...
But, the reality is that no one that I know goes out and shoots 7 days a week and hits every skeet, sporting and trap tournament. Even if I won the super lotto I wouldn't be able to afford the time to do that - as much as I would like to.
Most guys that I know do have to make financial choices around where they are going to spend their ducats because no one has an endless supply of them. Shooting can be wildly expensive but budgeted well it really doesn't have to be - and the learning curve can closely match the guys that throw down big cash for lessons and fancy pants guns.
That goes back to my original comment about small bites. And this may sound elitist but it's just common sense. No one and I mean no one is going to improve their shooting by going out the weekend before dove season to "practice" hitting clays. All it will do is let them remember how to work the gun and knock dust off the barrel. For the guys that already can shoot it's useful but having been out there I can tell you that for many it's a futile effort.
If folks went out once a week to shoot a round of skeet which runs about 7 or 8 bucks - by the end of the summer they would probably increase the hits on the short shots by 30%. Those sporting clay ranges that charge for 100 rounds? If people walked in and said "I have to work on a single presentation - I'm probably only going to shoot about 25 or 30 rounds" that range is just going to treat you exactly like everyone else. They don't give a crap how much you shoot. They know that over time that you'll get better and return to grow skills.
I've done that plenty of times because I know that some days shooting a case of shells isn't going to help me a great deal, especially if I'm struggling with a particular problem. On those days when I have an open mind and need to put another presentation or three into the memory banks? You bet I'll shoot 100 or more just to touch all the corners of my limited game. Those days, and those between them are are great fun for me… And I get something out of all of them, because I go out with a very distinct plan as to what I want to accomplish. Sometimes I even write it down to keep myself on track.
Shooting doesn't have to be a financial drain at all - most of the work I do is in my living room with a mag light wrapped in tape dropped into the barrel so I can practicing my mount and swing, and manage where I'll drop the pattern. That costs me 2 AA batteries. The only thing I have to worry about is my wife coming in and telling me to cut it out because Jeopardy is on.
Hence the high dollar comments and the defensive positions taken by those who delve as deep as you and others have done. I do know just the ammo expense and the range fees are out of this father of four with two kids in college's budget.
I'm totally with you on this one. I'm not Creosus - that's why I do the majority of my practice in little dribs and drabs. It's not just the money - it's whether or not your kids need you around to do stuff like teach them about the Ottoman Empire or quadratic equations. Moms and Dads do have it tough and kids can't eat clays. If there's no extra money in the budget to shoot. You don't. If there is money to buy three cups of coffee at starbucks a week? I'll drink cheap-ass tea instead and go buy a round of skeet. Sometimes choices are easy, sometimes tough and as a parent - sometimes (depending on money or grades) you don't have choices at all.
I do see the benefits of shooting and do not think the result of years of practice shooting will lead to the detriment of cementing bad habits. The subtle psychological, analytical, and dissecting nature of playing clay games at a high level are not the skills which attribute as directly as asserted IMHO.
Maybe for some. Personal experience here was that I had to rewrite everything I thought I knew because some things that were foundation points for me were simply not constructed right. I simply couldn't get better without doing some deconstruction.
While I do not disagree they offer some transcendent benefits what they do most is lead to getting better at the game. Proper gun fit, and keeping ones head down on the stock and learning lead are so fundamental they do not need the immersion in 10000 rounds "FITASC" to learn.
I think that there's a little conflation going on. Because guy shoot clays regularly to better their game doesn't mean those guys shoot lots of clays all the time. Because some guys shoot a local tournament doesn't mean they also go to the US Open, The Nationals, The Gamaliel Cup, the Latin American open or the Dubai Open either. You don't have to spend a 75k a year to learn and people shouldn't be thinking that at all. If you are competitive by nature and want to see how your skills stack up against like shooters though? Tournaments are a great albeit pricey way to find out pretty quick. You don't have to shoot them all or any for that matter. But for the guys that do shoot and talk about it? It's no more elitist then talking about having a backyard barbecue. You do it, it's fun and then because it's fun you do it again later on.
If you want to get better you shoot. If you want to get better faster you take instruction from someone that knows how to explain the fundamentals, and that can tell you how to apply them after they have diagnosed your swing. Then, you start off by trying to shoot everything inside of 30 yards. Spend a little money here, and a little time there, and after a few years suddenly you'll recognize that you aren't going through 3 cases of ungodly expensive "Thunderbomb Long-distance McCrusher" shells a year to bring home a whopping 50 ducks. That day you'll see that you are shooting less than a case a year of regular old duck loads - and have 90 birds on the tally.
Yes, learning will certainly cost some money - but over the long haul whoever makes the effort will recoup some of those costs. Look at it this way, three cases of Hypersonic 3.5s will cost some guy 930 bucks. Not including shipping... That's some seriously expensive crap right there.
What if the same guy buys one case of estates for 100 bucks - then uses some of the money left over to get a lesson, and follows the lesson by shooting 25 rounds every couple of weeks for the 6 months leading up to the season? Someone is going to benefit and it won't be the ammo companies.
Besides there is no guarantee one will receive any additional instruction nor need any if they are participating in clay shooting or shooting on their own. Tons of trigger time will help anyone and every target gives feedback every time even the feathered ones.
There are no guarantees for anything… But if folks ask for advice at a tournament - they'll get it… They just have to make sure they ask someone that can give them answers that are applicable.
I guess I never understood the dominant eye thing either...LMAO!
People shooting too high IMHO is the single detrimental issue facing most in the field...I agree letting them get close is a sign of ones experience and without a doubt produces success.
Yup. It's no secret that shells are marketed to drive folks to shoot ridiculously long. Guys that believe that long shooting is made easy because of additional speed and recoil are just fed into a vicious cycle.
This is the merry-go-round they ride... They buy a shell on the promise it shoots long. Shooting long with the shell lowers the percentage of hits because long shots are dumb. Then by chance they hit one bird out of 10 shots then all the unibrows in the blind with them yell "Yippee!" and then they all go buy more of those expensive shells.
When you add up the variables such as shell specifications, distances and percentage of successful DRT shots, seem like shells such as Hypersonic are crack for the math impaired. That's some real success on the part of the marketeers, convincing people they will do better with something that actually lowers shooting performance. I applaud the ammo company marketing teams on that effort because it's wicked, and I like that.
All this for a bowl of borscht.