Change in the definition of "Bait"

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Change in the definition of "Bait"

Postby Nabs » Sat Mar 01, 2014 11:16 pm

Did this change this year? §257.5. Prohibition Against Taking Resident Game Birds and Mammals by the Aid of Bait. The last part of section b:3
or as a result of manipulation of a crop or other feed on the land where grown for wildlife management purposes: provided that manipulation for wildlife management purposes does not include the distributing or scattering of grain or other feed once it has been removed from or stored on the field where grown.


I take this to read that I can now plant grow and mow Safflower for Dove hunting, as long as I do not harvest, remove and store the grain and then scatter it back later.
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Re: Change in the definition of "Bait"

Postby Butta boom » Sat Mar 01, 2014 11:53 pm

I'm not sure if the fed law changed, but two states have modified theirs as they apply to rice fields after harvest. Arkansas and Lousiana have provided for the flooding and rolling of an "abandoned ratoon crop" to the the list of excluded or waived procedures that used to come under the category of "manipulated crop instead of harvest".

The practice of reflooding a harvested rice paddy to get a second crop of rice that sprouts from the stubble after harvest is common practice in the south. If the second crop known as the ratoon crop does not produce enough rice to pay to harvest it, growers wanted to leave it flooded and roll it down into the water as soon as they could to accommodate their duck leases. In the past this practice was considered baiting, and the rolled fields were dead to hunting for thirty days. These changes were welcomed by the growers and the hunters down there, they might been enabled by a change at the Fed level.
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Re: Change in the definition of "Bait"

Postby jmonte35 » Sun Mar 02, 2014 10:23 am

Nabs wrote:Did this change this year? §257.5. Prohibition Against Taking Resident Game Birds and Mammals by the Aid of Bait. The last part of section b:3
or as a result of manipulation of a crop or other feed on the land where grown for wildlife management purposes: provided that manipulation for wildlife management purposes does not include the distributing or scattering of grain or other feed once it has been removed from or stored on the field where grown.


I take this to read that I can now plant grow and mow Safflower for Dove hunting, as long as I do not harvest, remove and store the grain and then scatter it back later.


No you cannot manipulate the plants. You either harvest it or leave it standing. Nothing in between. If you mow it you are baiting. You can't mow it and leave it otherwise it is "stored" in the field.

We get away with rice because it is harvested. The little that's left over from a bonafide harvest is legal and why we can still hunt cut fields.
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Re: Change in the definition of "Bait"

Postby Nabs » Sun Mar 02, 2014 10:54 am

That is what I am saying, it changed from years passed, that statement is from the current regulations. I am not scattering it after it has been stored, simply mowing it to reduce the risk of fire :smile:
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Re: Change in the definition of "Bait"

Postby bugman » Sun Mar 02, 2014 12:00 pm

NABS - Check with Andy out at GL. They plant feed crops for various birds and it seems like, in years past, they just left them standing. If I find out what is going to be done this year, I'll let you know.

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Re: Change in the definition of "Bait"

Postby DuckFan » Sun Mar 02, 2014 3:30 pm

This may help:

Federal

Dove:

http://www.fws.gov/le/dove-hunting-and-baiting.html



Waterfowl:

http://www.fws.gov/le/waterfowl-hunting-and-baiting.html



As you mentioned, this is the full State Law for Dove:

§257.5. Prohibition Against Taking Resident Game Birds and Mammals by the Aid of Bait.
Except as otherwise provided in these regulations or in the Fish and Game Code, resident game birds and mammals may not be taken within 400 yards of any baited area.

•(a) Definition of Baited Area. As used in this regulation, "baited area" shall mean any area where shelled, shucked or unshucked corn, wheat or other grains, salt, or other feed whatsoever capable of luring, attracting, or enticing such birds or mammals is directly or indirectly placed, exposed, deposited, distributed, or scattered, and such area shall remain a baited area for ten days following complete removal of all such corn, wheat or other grains, salt, or other feed.

•(b) Exceptions:
◦(1) The taking of domestically reared and released game birds on licensed pheasant clubs and other licensed game bird clubs;

◦(2) The taking of resident game birds and mammals on or over standing crops, flooded standing crops (including aquatics), flooded harvested croplands, grain crops properly shocked on the field where grown, or grains found scattered solely as the result of normal agricultural planting or harvesting;

◦(3) The taking of resident game birds and mammals on or over any lands where shelled, shucked or unshucked corn, wheat or other grain, salt, or other feed have been distributed or scattered as the result of bona fide agricultural operations or procedures, or as a result of manipulation of a crop or other feed on the land where grown for wildlife management purposes: provided that manipulation for wildlife management purposes does not include the distributing or scattering of grain or other feed once it has been removed from or stored on the field where grown.


I would sure be talking to the CA enforcement branch and get it in writing... I have found in the past regaredig wildlife laws, is that 1 section of the law will say it one way, but there are other laws that also come into play (ex: FED law). And without knowing all the various sections where the law may be written - and apply - you could be missing a vital part of the equation.


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Re: Change in the definition of "Bait"

Postby spoonysmaker » Wed Mar 05, 2014 7:59 pm

jmonte35 wrote:
Nabs wrote:Did this change this year? §257.5. Prohibition Against Taking Resident Game Birds and Mammals by the Aid of Bait. The last part of section b:3
or as a result of manipulation of a crop or other feed on the land where grown for wildlife management purposes: provided that manipulation for wildlife management purposes does not include the distributing or scattering of grain or other feed once it has been removed from or stored on the field where grown.


I take this to read that I can now plant grow and mow Safflower for Dove hunting, as long as I do not harvest, remove and store the grain and then scatter it back later.


No you cannot manipulate the plants. You either harvest it or leave it standing. Nothing in between. If you mow it you are baiting. You can't mow it and leave it otherwise it is "stored" in the field.

We get away with rice because it is harvested. The little that's left over from a bonafide harvest is legal and why we can still hunt cut fields.



I'm getting the same idea as nabs on this one
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Re: Change in the definition of "Bait"

Postby 3200 man » Thu Mar 06, 2014 12:11 pm

How about Eagle Lake flooded standing corn ? Great Mallard hunting for some ? Baited :huh:
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Re: Change in the definition of "Bait"

Postby jmonte35 » Thu Mar 06, 2014 12:24 pm

3200 man wrote:How about Eagle Lake flooded standing corn ? Great Mallard hunting for some ? Baited :huh:


Flooded standing corn is fine as long as you don't cut it down.
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Re: Change in the definition of "Bait"

Postby Mallards Only » Thu Mar 06, 2014 3:37 pm

jmonte35 wrote:[

No you cannot manipulate the plants. You either harvest it or leave it standing. Nothing in between. If you mow it you are baiting. You can't mow it and leave it otherwise it is "stored" in the field.


This is incorrect.

" Manipulation of Crops and Other Vegetation

Agricultural crops, other feed, and natural vegetation may be manipulated to improve dove hunting. Manipulation means the alteration of natural vegetation or agricultural crops by activities such as mowing, shredding, discing, rolling, chopping, trampling, flattening, burning, or herbicide treatments. Manipulation does not include the distributing or scattering of seeds, grains, or other feed after removal from or storage on the field where grown. You should be aware that although you can hunt doves over manipulated agricultural crops, you cannot hunt waterfowl over manipulated agricultural crops except after the field has been subject to a normal harvest and removal of grain (i.e., post-harvest manipulation). "

This is straight out of the USFWS publication.
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Re: Change in the definition of "Bait"

Postby LeakyW8ers » Thu Mar 06, 2014 4:47 pm

jmonte35 wrote:No you cannot manipulate the plants. You either harvest it or leave it standing. Nothing in between. If you mow it you are baiting. You can't mow it and leave it otherwise it is "stored" in the field.

We get away with rice because it is harvested. The little that's left over from a bonafide harvest is legal and why we can still hunt cut fields.


Better Caltip the managers at Salt Slough and Los Banos wildlife areas. Because they plant and mow safflower every year and hunters are allowed to hunt over it.
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