Michael Pearce: Wildlife and Parks Commission needs to repre

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Re: Michael Pearce: Wildlife and Parks Commission needs to r

Postby EcatMagoo » Wed Aug 28, 2013 8:18 pm

John O`Neal wrote:I`m sure I will be corrected if I`m wrong but I understood that after only one year of implementation there occurred a major reversal in position by hunters regarding the Southeast Zone hunting dates . I have read that 65% of the respondents were in favor of the late start, late finish dates. It appears that the commission responded to what hunters in the eastern part of our state were already well aware of . That being; that Eastern Kansas has a later migration pattern than the central or western areas. I do find it hard to understand the resistance to the Southeast Zone by central Kansas hunters not effected by the delayed opening date . I find it highly doubtful that hunters from the central part of the state are perplexed about their inability to hunt early migrants in the Southeast Zone that first two weeks in Nov. . After all central Kansas is noted for their quality of early migrant hunting. With that in mind I don't see how the formation of the SE zone adversely affected that .
The commissioners charged with representing all of us come from different parts of the state and subsequently have their own zones of interest . Commissioner Budd coming from Kansas City Kansas and owning waterfowl property in the SE zone can be expected to represent the interests of hunters in that region . Mr. Budd championed the inception of the SE zone and is a staunch supporter of it`s continued existence. It appears he has incurred the wrath of Mr. Pearce because of his vote supporting Mr. Marshall`s proposed changes . Please remember though It took more than commissioner Budd`s support to pass that change to the Canada season . Don`t get me wrong I personally believe Mr. Marshall was going in the wrong direction for the wrong reasons.
I don`t know commissioner Budd personally but coming from the same city I know of him. I know he is a very successful businessman who loves to hunt ducks just like the rest of us and believes in value of the later start dates for the eastern portion of the state . I can be envious, but I cannot fault him for his business successes or owning his own duck hole . If I hit the lottery tomorrow I would have my very own personal version of Habitat Flats .
So for you guys out there in central Kansas when January arrives and your season closes, come on over to the Southeast Zone and enjoy some late season Mallard shooting with us . Most of the hunters have quit by then so it`s rarely crowded. We`ll keep the light on for you. :hi:


Maybe i'm wrong John but I don't think the point of the article was to oppose the SE late zone. It was criticizing the manner in which commissioner Budd is conducting business on the board.
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Re: Michael Pearce: Wildlife and Parks Commission needs to r

Postby cluckmeister » Wed Aug 28, 2013 8:52 pm

Ecat, you hit the nail on the head. I personally could care less about the dates in the area of the State that Budd has his Rich Boy Honey Hole in. Its his "we can do what ever we want" attitude we don't need, also his thinking that he's an expert in the Duck Hunting World and he knows it all and the rest of the panel should live and die by his ideas is BS, When he gets a degree as a biologist maybe he will then be a bit more accredited then having the credentials of just being and avid outdoorsman that he has now. Also the apparent you scratch my back and Ill scratch yours attitudes of both Marshall and Budd need to be dealt with by Brownback. BTW if Budd is such an expert in the Waterfowl Field, why is the state of Kansas paying a biologist for his or hers apparently ignored input and ideas.
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Re: Michael Pearce: Wildlife and Parks Commission needs to r

Postby WF1 » Wed Aug 28, 2013 9:28 pm

Personally I could care less about the duck season dates. I really like the SE zone. How many people actually shoot good numbers of ducks early in the season on the east half of the state? I hunted that area for 3 years and rarely would go out before tgiving because of the lack of birds (typically). I was always frustrated hunting geese in January and having ducks dive bomb goose spreads.

Marshall's goose season crap he pulled is ridiculous though. There are probably 20% of the geese here in November compare to February. That was as blatant a self serving move as it gets. He can get away with it though since the goose season is quite a bit longer than ducks and it's not as high profile comparatively speaking to the money making duck clubs.
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Re: Michael Pearce: Wildlife and Parks Commission needs to r

Postby EcatMagoo » Wed Aug 28, 2013 9:46 pm

WF1 wrote:Personally I could care less about the duck season dates. I really like the SE zone. How many people actually shoot good numbers of ducks early in the season on the east half of the state? I hunted that area for 3 years and rarely would go out before tgiving because of the lack of birds (typically). I was always frustrated hunting geese in January and having ducks dive bomb goose spreads.

Marshall's goose season crap he pulled is ridiculous though. There are probably 20% of the geese here in November compare to February. That was as blatant a self serving move as it gets. He can get away with it though since the goose season is quite a bit longer than ducks and it's not as high profile comparatively speaking to the money making duck clubs.


I like the SE zone dates also but I have to disagree that there isnt good hunting in November in the Eastern part of the state. I average just as many birds per hunt in November as I do in December. BWT, GWT, Gaddies, Wood Ducks, Widgeon. They are all abundant in Eastern Kansas even for the youth hunt in late October.
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Re: Michael Pearce: Wildlife and Parks Commission needs to r

Postby ks_waterfowler » Thu Aug 29, 2013 3:54 am

We used to pound them in early November in the eastern part of the state. The year before the new regs I was shooting mallards in short sleeves. The flight was from 1430-1530 in the afternoon. I'd have my mallards and be gone before most folks showed up to hunt the evening. Normal year this part of the SE zone locks up tight around Mid December. Birds go to the couple strip pits in the area for a week, then move on down the road. Then we transition to geese. Usually about the last week of the season we thaw out enough to break ice and kill them for the last week. Its almost like clockwork. I know the guys that manage Flint Hills weren't happy about it. One of them said he ignored all the evidence presented about migrations, bird numbers, and hunter satisfaction and did what benefited him. Next year they might as well just ask him what season he wants and not even go through the process of surveying hunters or gathering data.

John, there was a swing in percentages. It went from 77% wanting earlier dates to around 55%. Most of the folks that hunt the northern parts of the SE zone want earlier. Guy further south want later. They need to redraw the line. The SE zone is simply too large. Make the cutoff 54 hwy and I think you could take a lot of the bickering out of it. Now we are getting off topic.

The gist of this article is how commissioners can go against, what biologists, area managers, and the public they represent want. They are arrogant enough to think they are above reproach since they answer only to the governor. They are supposed to represent all of us. Instead they rub it in our face that they will do what benefits them.
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Re: Michael Pearce: Wildlife and Parks Commission needs to r

Postby mudpack » Thu Aug 29, 2013 6:54 am

Man, I'm seeing some really excellent posts from you guys. All of them, including O'Neal's. Too bad the governor and senators don't read Duckhuntingchat.......

It might interest you to know that Commissioner Marshall, who lives in Great Bend, failed to attend Tuesday's public meeting on the upcoming waterfowl season at Cheyenne Bottoms. Can't say I can blame him......

If he was truly interested in finding out what the central Kansas waterfowl hunters want, he would have been there talking to the folks who DID attend.
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Re: Michael Pearce: Wildlife and Parks Commission needs to r

Postby WF1 » Thu Aug 29, 2013 7:02 am

I guess it's the best of both worlds for people in the wichita area-45 min to the SE zone and 1.5 to the early zone so we can essentially hunt 9/7-1/31 this year with only a few little breaks.

In regards to the "80 signatures" they need to get a lot more than that to have much swing, 80 hunters is what, one mornings worth of hunters at MDC? I can think of 20 ppl off the top of my head that would sign something in favor of the SE zone
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Re: Michael Pearce: Wildlife and Parks Commission needs to r

Postby cluckmeister » Thu Aug 29, 2013 10:37 am

WF1 80 signatures on a petition and data from the Wildlife Dept folks beats o names on no petition to my way of thinking. Its pretty apparent Budd only wants to kill mallards and that's sad. There are early season birds that taste just as good, hell Id take Grilled Teal any day over a mallard, but then thinking about it, maybe he isn't a good enough shot to hit those fast little missiles LOL
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Re: Michael Pearce: Wildlife and Parks Commission needs to r

Postby fowlhunter » Thu Aug 29, 2013 10:44 am

The commissioners do not care about anything!! I tried reaching them about guides using public land and that all guides should be licensed. None responded to my call/voice mails. Not a single one! I even tried the ones closest to me multiple times. I talked to the man at Pratt, who is in charge of the public grounds. He told me that I had some good points and that I needed to contact the commissioners. Major dead end.
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Re: Michael Pearce: Wildlife and Parks Commission needs to r

Postby ksgoosekillr » Thu Aug 29, 2013 10:52 am

John O`Neal wrote:I do find it hard to understand the resistance to the Southeast Zone by central Kansas hunters not effected by the delayed opening date . I find it highly doubtful that hunters from the central part of the state are perplexed about their inability to hunt early migrants in the Southeast Zone that first two weeks in Nov. . After all central Kansas is noted for their quality of early migrant hunting. With that in mind I don't see how the formation of the SE zone adversely affected that .


Its pretty simple really, with the SE portion of the state closed to hunting in the early season those folks who could be hunting there travel to the central part of the state and contribute to the overcrowding. 800+ hunters for opening day at Cheyenne bottoms, a quick drive around after our hunt and the number of tags from counties nowhere near Barton was 10:1. That is why im a central Kansas hunter who is resisting these changes because they adversely affect our hunting.
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Re: Michael Pearce: Wildlife and Parks Commission needs to r

Postby cluckmeister » Thu Aug 29, 2013 11:59 am

Goosekiller, putting the Bottoms and Quivira is separate zones also contributes to crowding at the Bottoms, who ever did that needs his decoys sunk, Im sure that somewhere there was money in it for someone with connections to the commission. I almost wish the days of a 3 duck limit with o hen Mallards were with us again. I guarantee you there would be less waterfowl hunters. In Budd and Marshalls case Id bet money in their pockets is the sole motive for their personal agendas.
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Re: Michael Pearce: Wildlife and Parks Commission needs to r

Postby TBS » Thu Aug 29, 2013 1:20 pm

Regardless of the zones and their respective dates, the number 1 problem facing waterfowling in this state is TOO MUCH PRESSURE from TOO MANY HUNTERS.

If you want to pass shoot birds all day, then it doesn't matter much to you whether or not constant gunfire is disturbing birds in the area. If you want to hunt the traditional way and decoy birds to the water, it ruins the experience completely.

The old sayin "nothin a duck hunter hates more than other duck hunters" has pretty much been tatoo'd to my journal the past 4 seasons. I do think the seperate season dates affect the pressure upon certain parts of the state in the early zone and SE zone, but that is a direct product of the overwhelming increase of hunters using KS public wetlands.
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Re: Michael Pearce: Wildlife and Parks Commission needs to r

Postby John O`Neal » Fri Aug 30, 2013 10:58 pm

"
Maybe i'm wrong John but I don't think the point of the article was to oppose the SE late zone. It was criticizing the manner in which commissioner Budd is conducting business on the board.


Ecat ; I got the point of the article clearly. It is evident Mr. Pearce has a variety of personal issues with our present board . But because a sizeable portion of his article was about the Southeast Zone and our commissioner from that area Don Budd I felt there needed to be a dissenting voice before we started egging his house and surrounding his duck hole. Mr. Pearce`s article was not a journalistic review of the commission meeting of Aug. 1st but a carefully crafted highly opinionated piece intended to disparage members of commission . Pearce starts his article by taking an answer Commissioner Budd allegedly made to Marshal`s protocol question out of context ,added the adjective Booming" and effectively spun what may have been a lighter moment in the proceedings to portray commissioner Budd as arrogant and perhaps buffoonish by nature . The die had been cast at that point for many members of this forum as several took a turn ripping a piece out of the commission`s backside . I had read the breifing book on the minutes of the Aug. 1st meeting long before Mr. Pearce`s article was posted here on DHC. The implications and conclusions he drew sent me back to read it several more times . I have yet to find the booming reply Mr. Pearce refers to so I can only conclude it was not deemed worthy of being placed in the breifing book. What I did find was a direct opposite of the of the negative picture Mr. Pearce attempts to paint of Commissioner Budd. I challenge all of the members of the forum to read the actual minutes of the meeting and view the dialogue as it actually occurred .Not as it has been portrayed . I found no evidence whatsoever of the commission`s " self-righteous attitude" , or indications of " politicians living high on the hog." With regard to ruling for the majority it appears that the commission did exactly that in setting the season dates in the Southeast Zone . In the survey submitted by Tom Bidrowski it was shown that of the 33,400 respondents 65.8% favored opening the season with dates similar to last year . A resounding 2/3 of those surveyed . In the ensuing discussion regarding the season dates Bidrowski told Budd at one point " your suggestion is a good one ". Pearce at one point claims that due in effect to Budd`s successes in the business world he must be used to getting his way . Statements of that nature are personal based attacks and have nothing to do with objective journalism . I was disappointed to see members of this forum join in this theme with name calling and veiled threats . Calling out commissioner Budd because he is successful in his lifes work and has chosen to invest his money in a waterfowl property is hypocracy to say the least . It smacks of the tactics used in the last election to divide our country down class lines. I was surprised to see those attitudes on this, of all forums, after all isn`t pursuing opportunity ,hard work and self determination what America stands for ? Who among us if we were financially capable wouldn`t want to own a piece of America and especially if it was a productive waterfowl property . No one gave commissioner Budd anything ,he didn`t start out on third base ,he came from humble blue collar beginnings . He made what fortune he may have on his own initative . We used to recognise and applaud this type of achievement but I guess that was in the world I used to live in and not the one at present . Pearce and commissioner Marshall have obviously fallen out as hunting companions and perhaps that has more to do with this than we will ever know ,but as far as commissioner Budd intimidating his fellow commissioners, I am suspect that his failure to be intimidated by Pearce an the threat of his poision pen play a role here . I hope my remarks offended no one for they were certainly not intended to achieve that end ,but like every pancake this issue also has two sides . I must admit though it`s kind of lonely on this side right now . Have a great day .
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Re: Michael Pearce: Wildlife and Parks Commission needs to r

Postby gooshnr » Sat Aug 31, 2013 8:06 am

I've had a sick computer for awhile so I'm just catching up. Saw the Pearce article and thought it was right on. I've always appreciated him offering an honest opinion in his writing whether I disagreed or not. I wrote letters to Jennison and Brownback after last year's meeting. I didn't care about the SE zone dates but the way bully Budd acted was inexcusable. Brownback forwarded my complaint to Jennison and Jennison called me. It didn't take me long to figure out my words were falling on the deaf ears of a politician. I wasn't at this year's meeting and couldn't watch on the internet because of their techinical issues but it sounds like Budd was being Budd again and now has rubbed off on Marshall. Throw in the decision this commission approved to allow coyote running during firearms deer season and I don't know what more you need to dump the whole bunch. I will probably write another letter to Brownback voicing my displeasure with the actions of these clowns and suggest he make an effort to stomp out bullying on his commission.
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Re: Michael Pearce: Wildlife and Parks Commission needs to r

Postby cluckmeister » Sat Aug 31, 2013 11:22 am

Whether or not Budd , spoke in a loud tone, a normal voice, or whisper, his comment , We can do whatever we want was arrogant in my opinion. John I went one up on you and instead of reading the minutes as you did, I watched the entire video and when Marshall stated the best opportunities for geese was the middle of November I knew the dates he wanted were self serving. Since Ive hunted geese since the days of 1 for a limit and even seeing a flight of geese were rare, Ive kept logs. The biggest number of geese arrive in most years after Thanksgiving and build to max populations to Christmas, especially in his part of the state. Its also evident that according to the state, more hunters participated in the early part of the season than the last portion but Budd didn't seem to care about that, and the young man with the 7 year old daughter hunting in the cold, he's a rarity, I tend to agree with the Teacher, young folks just starting out in Waterfowling need the earlier season dates not the latter.

BTW I've communicated with Peace via email several times since this article came out and he always stressed to me the importance of my voice being heard whether or not I agreed or disagreed with his positions.
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Re: Michael Pearce: Wildlife and Parks Commission needs to r

Postby westksbowhunter » Sun Sep 01, 2013 8:29 am

Unfortunately, only a very small portion of waterfowl hunters will even read Michael's article. Some how this article needs to be published in every newspaper in Kansas. The largest percentage of hunters are really uneducated when it comes to regulations of hunting and how they are determined. We need to find a way to open the eyes to hunters everywhere in this state.
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Re: Michael Pearce: Wildlife and Parks Commission needs to r

Postby mudpack » Sat Sep 07, 2013 12:32 pm

John O`Neal wrote: I challenge all of the members of the forum to read the actual minutes of the meeting and view the dialogue as it actually occurred .Not as it has been portrayed . I found no evidence whatsoever of the commission`s " self-righteous attitude"

I watched the video. Twice. Maybe I'm biased, but I see/hear arrogance.

John O`Neal wrote:With regard to ruling for the majority it appears that the commission did exactly that in setting the season dates in the Southeast Zone . In the survey submitted by Tom Bidrowski it was shown that of the 33,400 respondents 65.8% favored opening the season with dates similar to last year ..

I believe Tom's data indicated that that 65.8% majority "had no opinion" as to changing the dates. That means they don't care when the dates are. The data indicated more hunters wanted an earlier opener than wanted an later opener, i.e. of those who DO care, more want it earlier. I'd have to look at the video a third time to be 100% sure on that, though....

John O`Neal wrote: In the ensuing discussion regarding the season dates Bidrowski told Budd at one point " your suggestion is a good one "...
That doesn't mean Tom thought it to be the BEST one, though..... There's a difference. The commission clearly went against the recommendations of the real experts, who are largely unbiased; the KDWPT Staff.

Bottom line: what I read in Pierce's column is not at odds with what I saw in the commission meeting, and what I've seen in person from Commissioners Budd and Marshall.
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Re: Michael Pearce: Wildlife and Parks Commission needs to r

Postby John O`Neal » Sun Sep 08, 2013 3:08 pm

mudpack wrote:
John O`Neal wrote: I challenge all of the members of the forum to read the actual minutes of the meeting and view the dialogue as it actually occurred .Not as it has been portrayed . I found no evidence whatsoever of the commission`s " self-righteous attitude"

I watched the video. Twice. Maybe I'm biased, but I see/hear arrogance.

John O`Neal wrote:With regard to ruling for the majority it appears that the commission did exactly that in setting the season dates in the Southeast Zone . In the survey submitted by Tom Bidrowski it was shown that of the 33,400 respondents 65.8% favored opening the season with dates similar to last year ..

I believe Tom's data indicated that that 65.8% majority "had no opinion" as to changing the dates. That means they don't care when the dates are. The data indicated more hunters wanted an earlier opener than wanted an later opener, i.e. of those who DO care, more want it earlier. I'd have to look at the video a third time to be 100% sure on that, though....


Arrogant or passionate in your beliefs .That perception ultimately lies with the observer.

For years the voices of eastern Kansas hunters have fallen on the deaf ears of our experts in Pratt. Our pleas for a delayed start to better match the migration pattern in our area of the state is based on the empirical evidence we faced each season. Finally we have a member on the commission who is willing to speak out for the interests of eastern Ks. waterfowlers. As a SE zone hunter I would be remiss in my convictions if I failed to support him.

Being acutely aware that my every word is subject to the scrutiny of our forum members I tried to be as accurate as possible in quoting the numbers I observed .

Bidrowski "As hunters are the ultimate end users a priority is placed on setting season dates that match hunter preferences " Commissioner Budd " On page 19 of the survey. Simple question ; When asked when to start the season in the SE zone 65.8% said they wanted it similar to last years starting date which was Nov. 16 . " Bidrowski " Correct Commissioner Budd ".

The basic issue here is whether SE zone hunters want to trade off those marginal late Oct./early Nov. days for Jan. hunting days . More and more hunters are finding out that Jan. hunting is prime time in the SE zone, and when we do face those infrequent freeze-ups of the shallow public marshes, the field hunting for ducks and geese gets crazy good .

Regardless of whether we are ever able to reach common ground on this issue I wish all the forum members huge success in the coming season .
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Re: Michael Pearce: Wildlife and Parks Commission needs to r

Postby mudpack » Sun Sep 08, 2013 4:46 pm

I reviewed the video, and you are correct, John, the majority of hunters surveyed preferred dates similar to the previous year.
I stand corrected.
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Re: Michael Pearce: Wildlife and Parks Commission needs to r

Postby ks_waterfowler » Wed Oct 23, 2013 1:19 pm

whistlin_wings wrote:I grew up in a neighborhood with only 3 pools and a public golf course. Thug life is all I know.
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Re: Michael Pearce: Wildlife and Parks Commission needs to r

Postby ks_waterfowler » Wed Nov 06, 2013 5:06 pm

I sent a letter to the governor last week. I received a call today from the lady that deals with his appointments. Learned some things and educated her on some others. The commission needs to have x amount of the party in power, then x amount of independants/ other party. She is going to set me up with a phone conversation with Secretary Jennison. She did say if Brownback gets re elected that Commissioner Budd would not get reappointed.
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Re: Michael Pearce: Wildlife and Parks Commission needs to r

Postby cluckmeister » Wed Nov 06, 2013 9:58 pm

kswaterfowler. Thanks for your efforts I emailed a copy of your last post to Michael and he is appreciative of any ones efforts
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Re: Michael Pearce: Wildlife and Parks Commission needs to r

Postby ks_waterfowler » Thu Nov 07, 2013 4:16 am

This is who you need to contact right here

Kim Borchers
Director of Appointments
300 SW 10th Ave
Topeka, KS 66612

kim.borchers@ks.gov

Keep sending letters and emails and hopefully we get something done.
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Re: Michael Pearce: Wildlife and Parks Commission needs to r

Postby cluckmeister » Thu Nov 07, 2013 11:34 am

Thanks for the address
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Re: Michael Pearce: Wildlife and Parks Commission needs to r

Postby happyjack96 » Fri Nov 08, 2013 2:46 pm

Yes, thank you! I just sent Kim a lengthy email. I am disappointed with the dates as well. I made it clear that this chrony capitalistic approach within government needs to go. The good ol boy back scratchers need to hit the road - and if Governor Brownback won't fess up to his crappy appointment - he should hit the road too. I am a big Brownback supporter, but I'm sick and tired of politicians never having to be honest about their shortcomings or poor decisions. How does a guy like Budd get appointed anyway? It's obvious that he's had plenty of negative history within the state...why would our governor appoint him? There is way too much 'back room' chatter taking place I think......the dirty deals that are being negotiated throughout our government need to go. There is no other explanation as to why some of these people get appointed.

I've heard all kinds of migration numbers regarding the east side versus west side of the state, and how much earlier the west migration is. I just looked at Bob Brown's report for the past 3-4 days...they are taking 4.5-5 birds per day per hunter...it sure doesn't sound like migration EAST of us is lagging to me. I will be hunting in MO until the SE opens...what a waste of revenue going across state lines...KEEP FIGHTING THE GOOD FIGHT...
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