Lets put it to a vote! I'm fired up!

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Ban hunting rights to blinds on public land?

Poll ended at Mon Oct 12, 2009 4:42 pm

Heck Yea!!
10
63%
Heck No!!
4
25%
Don't are either way.
2
13%
 
Total votes : 16

Lets put it to a vote! I'm fired up!

Postby patrick.carrington » Tue Sep 22, 2009 4:42 pm

Haven't seen me post alot. This topic fires me up bad.PLEASE READ....................................... Problem, you go out and scout and do your homework and you find ducks and someone has build a blind ON PUBLIC LAND and now you can't hunt there, even though you did the work and put in the hours and did the scouting, someone else is going to shoot ducks. :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: :mad: If you want to beat me to the swamp to hunt my spot that I did the work for, you win, hands down. JUST BECAUSE YOU CLAME A BLIND DOES NOT MAKE IT RIGHT!!!!! Here's another thing and I want everyone to read this very carefully. There is a 1000 square foot area of public swamp to hunt. I come in and build a blind right in the middle of it so now, if I am there, instead of three groups of hunters letting birds work in a large area, I and legally I, would be the only one allowed to hunt due to hunter to hunter distance infractions that would result in tickets if you pushed the issue. Mind you this is PUBLIC LAND. It needs to stay that way!! This in one law I would love to get rid of!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Dont take this the wrong way, I am fine with blinds, but they need to be on an "early bird gets the worm" program. I am really tired of seeing that person that gets there early to have fun and sees a blind in his old spot and cant hunt there anymore.

Please let that person say this " Well should have build a blind". Read the law carefully, if I set up right in front of your blind and you show up late, there is nothing you can do about it other than get mad. I went to court a few years ago for an old man that got me started on this issue. Hunted this area for 15 years, never build a blind. Heck, he is part of the reason I am so big into waterfowl today. A few years ago he come out to hunt and there is a blind where he has always set up so he set up right in front of it. The blind owners get there and tell him to leave. "well this is public land" he says and they call the warden and ooh they got what was comming to them. See DNR isnt dumb so if you call, make sure it is for a good reason. He issued 6 tickets for hunter harrassment and the whole time I am thinking how the problem would have been solved if you couldn't lay claim to a blind.

WEW that felt good. Only my option though!! :beer:
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Re: Lets put it to a vote! I'm fired up!

Postby ajmorell » Tue Sep 22, 2009 4:50 pm

I agree with you, and that is what I eluded to in my last post of the other topic. I think it's ridiculous that you can build a blind on public land then basically stake that spot as your own, especially when what you mentioned happens, and you/they end up monopolizing an area, especially if it is a small area that holds a lot of birds.
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Re: Lets put it to a vote! I'm fired up!

Postby patrick.carrington » Tue Sep 22, 2009 6:23 pm

So 3 people so far have voted heck no. I would like to here you reasons behind it. I am very open to reasoning but I will say this, first bashing I see, I'm locking the post.
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Re: Lets put it to a vote! I'm fired up!

Postby waterfowlhunter » Tue Sep 22, 2009 6:30 pm

Do you feel the same way about deer hunters on public land? What about Ice fishing shantys? we set up deer blinds with our name on them (no longer can bait) but spend a lot time scouting the "perfect spot" then set up a ground blind or a ladder stand and I have NEVER had another deer hunter try to use my blind and once a hunter knows the blind is there they avoid using the general area to walk in or out of the woods as a courtasy to the fellow hunters. Why should duck hunting be any different? it is still public land.

And when Ice fishing, We lock our door on the shack when we leave. And that is a form of a blind on public land too correct :eek:

If you have an issue with a blind placement, Have a pleasent conversation with the builder, express your concerns and if neither is not an idiot a compromise could be reached.

I used to hunt a hole across the foot bridge off the fireing line (fish point hunters know where i am talking about) there were about 3 groups (we did not even know the other guys) that hunted that hole and it was only a couple of acres of open water in the middle of the marsh. We put in a LOT of effort to build platforms there to hunt off and no one ever bothered us one time or tried to take them over. We all set up on in a "J" around one side of the hole and used common sense for safety and everyone knew not to shoot ducks outside their decoys and we all let the ducks work. kind of a teamwork effort with other hunters that we never even knew but hunted with every year since the 70's until it all dried up.

if they tried to ban blinds on public land there will be a LOT of uspet hunters for sure. both large and small game hunters use blinds.
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Re: Lets put it to a vote! I'm fired up!

Postby Boom » Tue Sep 22, 2009 6:43 pm

waterfowlhunter wrote:Do you feel the same way about deer hunters on public land? What about Ice fishing shantys? we set up deer blinds with our name on them (no longer can bait) but spend a lot time scouting the "perfect spot" then set up a ground blind or a ladder stand and I have NEVER had another deer hunter try to use my blind and once a hunter knows the blind is there they avoid using the general area to walk in or out of the woods as a courtasy to the fellow hunters. Why should duck hunting be any different? it is still public land.

And when Ice fishing, We lock our door on the shack when we leave. And that is a form of a blind on public land too correct :eek:

If you have an issue with a blind placement, Have a pleasent conversation with the builder, express your concerns and if neither is not an idiot a compromise could be reached.

I used to hunt a hole across the foot bridge off the fireing line (fish point hunters know where i am talking about) there were about 3 groups (we did not even know the other guys) that hunted that hole and it was only a couple of acres of open water in the middle of the marsh. We put in a LOT of effort to build platforms there to hunt off and no one ever bothered us one time or tried to take them over. We all set up on in a "J" around one side of the hole and used common sense for safety and everyone knew not to shoot ducks outside their decoys and we all let the ducks work. kind of a teamwork effort with other hunters that we never even knew but hunted with every year since the 70's until it all dried up.

if they tried to ban blinds on public land there will be a LOT of uspet hunters for sure. both large and small game hunters use blinds.


Well said.
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Re: Lets put it to a vote! I'm fired up!

Postby ajmorell » Tue Sep 22, 2009 6:57 pm

I guess I'm a little torn between the two sides. Waterfowlhunter you make some really good points, especially when you bring deer hunting and ice fishing into the picture...it's certainly something I hadn't considered before. However, I don't like the idea of being able to stake public domain as your own, kind of defeats the purpose in my opinion. I understand people can put just as much time into scouting public land as private but there's a chance that you aren't the only one with a desire to hunt that land. You mentioned compromising between the parties, but unfortunately it doesn't always work that way. I don't know what the solution is to all of this, or if there is a cut and dry one, but I don't know that the system in its current form is exactly ideal either.
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Re: Lets put it to a vote! I'm fired up!

Postby patrick.carrington » Tue Sep 22, 2009 7:17 pm

waterfowlhunter wrote: Why should duck hunting be any different? it is still public land.

And when Ice fishing, We lock our door on the shack when we leave. And that is a form of a blind on public land too correct :eek:

I.


To answer the first question in my option, its not. I think there is a clear line between packing in a blind and building one. Just like boat blinds. Still a blind but you take it with you when you leave.

To the second question, yes fishing, deer hunting, turkey hunting, ducks, doesn't matter. A fixed blind is a fixed blind. You cant tell me you wouldn't be pissed if you looked at a tree to put a stand in the day before the season or even a week and you go out opening day and there is someone in that tree. I think public land should be just that, PUBLIC to everyone with the same rights and rules for all. Not special right's to the man with the blind and the man without.
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Re: Lets put it to a vote! I'm fired up!

Postby waterfowlhunter » Tue Sep 22, 2009 7:23 pm

I know I keep drifting slightly off the main point but blind issues occur on private land too. We have a guy behind us and one to the east that built tree stands ON the fence line overlooking our food plots. of course it is an idiots thing to do but they did it and we can not say a thing about it. And for goose season I've had guys just standing in the fence line where the geese fly over to land in our bean field full of decoys. they did not set out one decoy but basically hunted over ours but on their property. screwed us up but they did great. :mad:
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Re: Lets put it to a vote! I'm fired up!

Postby patrick.carrington » Tue Sep 22, 2009 7:32 pm

I would have called the DNR on that one. I have had the same thing happen to us and yes they where issued ticket's for hunter harassment. The DNR love to issue tickets, if you have no deks set up and your pass shooting at close range, the warden will do something about it and if he cant, at least you tried to educate someone stupid.

As to you ice fishing, I have to say that would be way different. Ice fishing unlike hunting, there are no regulations to distance for one ice fisherman to another. Yes there is a code of ethics that most of us follow but if I wanted to, i put put a hole down right next to you if I wanted. I would have to put shanties on a different playing field. The only thing be shot from a shanty is beer cans. :yes:
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Re: Lets put it to a vote! I'm fired up!

Postby waterfowlhunter » Tue Sep 22, 2009 7:38 pm

patrick.carrington wrote: Still a blind but you take it with you when you leave.

:huh:
when I build a ground blind It is there for the season.

patrick.carrington wrote:To the second question, yes fishing, deer hunting, turkey hunting, ducks, doesn't matter. A fixed blind is a fixed blind. You cant tell me you wouldn't be pissed if you looked at a tree to put a stand in the day before the season or even a week and you go out opening day and there is someone in that tree.


Happened many times, I just go on to spot 2 or 3 etc. that is If I am not hunting a permanant or deadfall constructed blind. I am generally not happy if someone beats me to a spot but it is public land and they have as much right to it as I do IMO.
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Re: Lets put it to a vote! I'm fired up!

Postby waterfowlhunter » Tue Sep 22, 2009 7:42 pm

:yes:
patrick.carrington wrote:The only thing be shot from a shanty is beer cans.
:yes:

I like that :thumbsup:



but I know guys that there shanty is their deer blind too. they just move it to the proper location when needed.
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Re: Lets put it to a vote! I'm fired up!

Postby roughshot » Tue Sep 22, 2009 7:44 pm

Ban them all on public land! for the price of building a good blind you can put a nice blind on a boat and hunt anywhere you wish. Blinds on public land in the case of ducks is great for the first week of the season. after that the birds know where the boom comes from. If your building a blind to stake your "claim" your also setting yourself up for conflict and going to the blind with the thought in mind that someone could be in my blind today. If you put a blind on a boat your locations are endless. didn't really want to bit on this topic that is going on in three forums... this is a dead topic to me. Can we talk about hunting now? The law is what it is. If you want to hunt someones blind, go ahead, First come First Served. Have fun talking with the CO and a steaming blind builder at the launch. I'll be in my boat shooting the ducks your flaring while your yelling at eachother. :clapping:
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Re: Lets put it to a vote! I'm fired up!

Postby Boom » Tue Sep 22, 2009 7:47 pm

How about the ones that put them up to make it easier on the older guys or the handicap? Or maybe they shouldn't be aloud to hunt? I know of 4 blinds that were put up for both reasons not including one me and my buddy put up so his handicap brother could go with us.
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Re: Lets put it to a vote! I'm fired up!

Postby Boom » Tue Sep 22, 2009 7:50 pm

roughshot wrote:Ban them all on public land! for the price of building a good blind you can put a nice blind on a boat and hunt anywhere you wish. Blinds on public land in the case of ducks is great for the first week of the season. after that the birds know where the boom comes from. If your building a blind to stake your "claim" your also setting yourself up for conflict and going to the blind with the thought in mind that someone could be in my blind today. If you put a blind on a boat your locations are endless. didn't really want to bit on this topic that is going on in three forums... this is a dead topic to me. Can we talk about hunting now? The law is what it is. If you want to hunt someones blind, go ahead, First come First Served. Have fun talking with the CO and a steaming blind builder at the launch. I'll be in my boat shooting the ducks your flaring while your yelling at eachother. :clapping:


You just want to hunt the east end of a certain lake don't ya? :wink:
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Re: Lets put it to a vote! I'm fired up!

Postby waterfowlhunter » Tue Sep 22, 2009 7:58 pm

Boom wrote:How about the ones that put them up to make it easier on the older guys or the handicap? Or maybe they shouldn't be aloud to hunt? I know of 4 blinds that were put up for both reasons not including one me and my buddy put up so his handicap brother could go with us.



Great Point :beer:
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Re: Lets put it to a vote! I'm fired up!

Postby shoot-n-goose » Tue Sep 22, 2009 8:10 pm

I'll be honest, I HATE it when guys build blinds in the areas I hunt. Not because I think i have the right to the spot, but they are an eyesore and are very rarely used. It seems like guys love to build these giant monsters they call blinds standing 5 ft tall and 10 ft long in knee high grass 50 yards from the tree line and leave them un-camoed with black paint on everything.

I'm almost positive one of the blinds was used for the morning of opening day and left untouched up to this point.

From the 2009 Waterfowl Guide
DECOYS, BLINDS, RAISED PLATFORMS
• You may not erect or use a hunting blind on any public waters
without permanently affixing to the exterior, in waterproof
letters not less than three inches high, the name and address
of the person who placed it there. Any unoccupied blind on
the Great Lakes or Lake St. Clair may be used by the first
person to occupy it each day.
• You may not leave any hunting blind or part thereof anchored
or affixed to the bottomlands of any public waters within the
state of Michigan prior to Aug. 15 or later than Jan. 16.
• You may not use or occupy a blind on the waters of the
state that does not comply with marking and placement
requiremets.

Since the guy(s) that built it didn't follow the regs with the address part (and leaving it out all summer), no one can even use the blind legally. This weekend I may have to bring a drill on my scouting trip
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Re: Lets put it to a vote! I'm fired up!

Postby waterfowlhunter » Tue Sep 22, 2009 8:21 pm

roughshot wrote:Can we talk about hunting now?


I'm ready to roll, small boat on top of the truck, boat / trailer on the back and oct 3rd opener. now all we need is a couple good frost to kill off some of the damn skeeters.
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Re: Lets put it to a vote! I'm fired up!

Postby roughshot » Tue Sep 22, 2009 8:36 pm

I'm out of projects at this point. I've cleaned up the dekes, painted a few all loaded in the boat, waders sitting next to a cleaned gun. Ammo box full. 10 days to go. I'm out every morning now, glassing the water just after sunrise watching the birds. Some cool weather would be nice and may be here soon enough.
As for those special situations noted by Boom, he makes a good point that I didn't think about. They are approved by law within regulation. As for the certain east part of a lake I want to hunt, most of that portion is private land and those blinds are on private waters. As long as blinds are allowed, I'll just stay away from them. the ducks are everywhere if you just look and scout you'll find a better spot, I'm sure of it. Eitherway, we're all bord and good luck to those going to the UP this weekend. Shoot those birds south for us. :beer:
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Re: Lets put it to a vote! I'm fired up!

Postby ajmorell » Tue Sep 22, 2009 9:45 pm

I'm ready to go to. Maybe that is why I haven't been able to concentrate on anything regarding school this weel :eek: . Last Sat. I rewired the boat trailer and took the boat out for a little spin. Did a little scouting for a spot maybe later in the season. I got all of my scouting in for opener a while ago...guarantee no one will be in my spot :yes:
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Re: Lets put it to a vote! I'm fired up!

Postby patrick.carrington » Tue Sep 22, 2009 10:02 pm

waterfowlhunter wrote:when I build a ground blind It is there for the season.


I am generally not happy if someone beats me to a spot but it is public land and they have as much right to it as I do IMO.


Yes but when you build a blind, you don't give anyone else the freedom to that spot whenever they want. You might as well call it private land at that point. I don't mind the idea of fixed blinds, just not the right to claim them as " MY HUNTING SPOT" because when you do that, you defeat the purpose of public land which means open to everyone when in reality, it not public all when a blind is up.

Your second statement makes no since. "I am not happy when someone beats me to a spot but it is public land so I go to spot #2 or #3". As of right know, you don't have a choice in spot #1 at all if there is a blind there. They took every right to that spot away from you when they put up a blind and if their are ducks there and you got there first, I would be really angry that i couldn't hunt the area just because some jo-smo puts up a territory flag (the blind) that lays claim to the area. PUBLIC LAND form the way I hear it is in reality PRIVATE LAND if I put up a blind.

Answer me this, that area where you set up in the J with the other hunters. How would you feel if I where to put up a couple of blinds and claim them and told you and your friends to pack up because those are mine and because it is small, you would have to go and would have the option of another place and for the most part, ruin your morning. To tell me that you would just happly leave is BS. Anyone hear that enjoys hunting ducks would be really mad at that situation and buy all intents and purposes, could become a reality for you in the future if building a blind is all it take to kick everyone else out of the area.

The handy-cap thing. Of course we need to help them out anyway possible and just like most rules, there are exceptions.

I think if this is not tak'n care of, public land will be a myth and unless you know someone with a blind or build one, you up a creek without a paddle. Why do you think most state don't allow fixed blinds on public land?
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Re: Lets put it to a vote! I'm fired up!

Postby waterfowlhunter » Wed Sep 23, 2009 4:21 am

in the little pond, if someone was to put up a couple of blinds we would still hunt our platforms if it was safe to do so or we would make sure we were on our platforms before they were in their blinds. like I said there were 3 groups on it and our platforms could have been considered blinds I guess. The reason for purchasing an 18' boat was because this hole dried up. Now we no longer hunt the marsh we just set up in the open water on the edge of the marsh.

It is still public land if I build a blind on it until I start paying taxes on it. And I am the public that is hunting that spot. Been that way for as long as I can remember and I have never had any issues at all with it. It soulds to me that you may have had a conflict at some point and now you have an issue with blinds on public land. there is plenty enough public land around for hunters to set up on anyway

And I have had more people get "my spot" in a boat than I ever have with a permanant blind. It can be frustration motoring out and finding someone set up in the perfect area you have been watching. so you just move a 1/4 mile away and set up in spot 2 or 3. i do not see why this is such an issue. :huh:
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Re: Lets put it to a vote! I'm fired up!

Postby carsonr2 » Wed Sep 23, 2009 7:02 am

Blinds are fine on public land, because they are public blinds. First come first serve, end of story...that is the law...anyone can whine all they want, but that is it.

If they are left up past the deadline, and you have an issue with that blind. I would contact a CO, and if the name is on the blind give them the location and the name to the CO. If a name is absent from the blind, I would ask the CO if I could lawfully remove the blind from the water body.
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Re: Lets put it to a vote! I'm fired up!

Postby g_maxson » Wed Sep 23, 2009 8:48 am

carsonr2 wrote:Blinds are fine on public land, because they are public blinds. First come first serve, end of story...that is the law...anyone can whine all they want, but that is it.

If they are left up past the deadline, and you have an issue with that blind. I would contact a CO, and if the name is on the blind give them the location and the name to the CO. If a name is absent from the blind, I would ask the CO if I could lawfully remove the blind from the water body.


True, BUT does anyone feel right about going into a blind you did not build? Just feels wrong.

IMO, you should just not be able to put blinds up on public land. In essence the owner feels as though they have not claimed that spot and any normal hunter would not want to hunt out of it because it almost feels like stealing and your just waiting for a confrontation with the owner the whole time you are out.

Anyone have any experience how Fish Point Lodge handles it? I'm sure they have to deal with it all the time.

You guys could not handle hunting in states like NC where once you put up a permanent blind and at least maintain it minimally every year you have sole rights to that spot and no once can setup within something like 400yds of it, even if you are not hunting it.
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Re: Lets put it to a vote! I'm fired up!

Postby ajmorell » Wed Sep 23, 2009 9:30 am

g_maxson wrote:You guys could not handle hunting in states like NC where once you put up a permanent blind and at least maintain it minimally every year you have sole rights to that spot and no once can setup within something like 400yds of it, even if you are not hunting it.


I think it needs to be all or nothing. I don't like the idea of people staking public land as their own but I don't like the way the present system either. The law either needs to be if you built it its your spot or no blinds on public land. I'm sure either would irritate people and I have a feeling that if the law was changed so that once you build a blind the spot is yours we'd be dealing with a lot more people who are building blinds on top of each other and it would lead to more confrontation then we have now.
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Re: Lets put it to a vote! I'm fired up!

Postby carsonr2 » Wed Sep 23, 2009 9:41 am

g_maxson wrote:
carsonr2 wrote:Blinds are fine on public land, because they are public blinds. First come first serve, end of story...that is the law...anyone can whine all they want, but that is it.

If they are left up past the deadline, and you have an issue with that blind. I would contact a CO, and if the name is on the blind give them the location and the name to the CO. If a name is absent from the blind, I would ask the CO if I could lawfully remove the blind from the water body.


True, BUT does anyone feel right about going into a blind you did not build? Just feels wrong.

IMO, you should just not be able to put blinds up on public land. In essence the owner feels as though they have not claimed that spot and any normal hunter would not want to hunt out of it because it almost feels like stealing and your just waiting for a confrontation with the owner the whole time you are out.

Anyone have any experience how Fish Point Lodge handles it? I'm sure they have to deal with it all the time.

You guys could not handle hunting in states like NC where once you put up a permanent blind and at least maintain it minimally every year you have sole rights to that spot and no once can setup within something like 400yds of it, even if you are not hunting it.


I agree with you 100%, they should not be allowed period. I was just going with the current law and my opinion on how it could be handled.

I live in NC now after hunting in MI for close to 20 years, and believe me Michiganders don't want the laws that some coastal counties have set up down here. This is a copy of what I posted in the similar thread in this sub-forum on North Carolina laws.

The current law in MI is great in regards to blinds on public property, waters. I'll start off by saying that yes there should be an air of respect for someones blind opening weekend. If someone took the time to scout a location and then took the extra effort to build a blind, they should be entitled to hunt it out of mutual respect for their efforts on opening weekend. To say that they should be able to have exclusive use of the blind for the season is wrong.

Here in North Carolina this is what has occurred in some of the coastal counties (Counties down here can make specific local regulations regarding hunting.) Certain counties have dictated that the builder of a blind (or a person with their permission) is the only one that can legally hunt that blind....they even went so far as to add a provision that it is illegal to build a blind or even hunt within 500 yards of an existing permanent blind (this means no boat blinds or standing in the marsh grass).

What did this do? Well many of the coastal locals in these certain counties build blinds every 500 yards along the entire length of the coastal marshes. By definition a constructed blind can be as little as two 4x4 posts with a 2x4 affixed horizontally between them. This has pretty much made it impossible, for any other residents of NC that don't live along the coast, to hunt out in these coastal areas. In a way they have turned public waterways into private hunting grounds that only certain groups of people can hunt.

Can you imagine if this could occur in areas in MI such as Saginaw Bay or Lake St. Clair?

Value the law that MI has, because taking a stance such as your stating...lets just say...be careful what you wish for.


The certain NC coastal county laws have myself, and so many natives down here upset. Some of the best hunting grounds in public navigable waterways are completely off limits. Absolutely ridiculous. (One note about NC navigable waterways law, it is legal to hunt any navigable waterway regardless of who owns the property along the shoreline (lakes and rivers)....that is one saving grace for NC.)
Vegetarian = Old Indian Saying "Not Good Hunter"
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