Including Lost Game In Limit

Main forum for general non waterfowl discussions as well as general duck hunting information about travel, rules and regulations, and other duck hunting info along with the general topics.

Moderators: Tealer, Indaswamp, Dep6, La. Hunter, steve-o, #1wingnut, lostpup, Preacher1011

Re: Including Lost Game In Limit

Postby quack-attack » Thu Sep 26, 2013 12:00 pm

No I do not...I always think it is pretty funny and/or arrogant when i hear hunters talk about lost game as though it is "wasted." I guarantee you the critter/s that end up eating it dont think it is wasted.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I537 using Tapatalk 2
“A thing is right when it tends to preserve the integrity, stability and beauty of the biotic community. It is wrong when it tends otherwise.” Aldo Leopold
User avatar
quack-attack
hunter
 
Posts: 1187
Joined: Fri Aug 15, 2008 12:20 pm
Location: chico


Re: Including Lost Game In Limit

Postby Lreynolds » Thu Sep 26, 2013 12:04 pm

assateague wrote:Define "established".


Estimated from a number of studies and used in population models that include hunting mortality as a specific term.
Lreynolds
hunter
 
Posts: 295
Joined: Sun Aug 22, 2010 5:27 pm

Re: Including Lost Game In Limit

Postby possumfoot » Thu Sep 26, 2013 12:06 pm

mauserfan wrote:I think all would agree that it would be great to have that 25% for additional brood stock the next spring. Just think of what that would do to our overall duck numbers. And honestly, from what I have witnessed, I would guess that the loss rate is a bit higher than the 25% mentioned.....mauser



little to no impact..

for the life of me i can not think of the term used though..


________ mortality
WTN10 wrote:He was funny like a Pomeranian getting kicked over a fence.


pgquackstacker wrote:I actually started bringing a gun with me on dates, so I bring the girl's father out to my car and tell him if he tries to cock-block me I'll kill him.
User avatar
possumfoot
hunter
 
Posts: 5782
Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2005 5:13 pm
Location: making sesbania my bitch

Re: Including Lost Game In Limit

Postby possumfoot » Thu Sep 26, 2013 12:10 pm

sampsonhuntin wrote:
possumfoot wrote:
sampsonhuntin wrote:
possumfoot wrote:
sampsonhuntin wrote:If we could use lead there would be far less cripples and wasted ducks would decrease.



no it wouldn't.

Would too.



stop being obtuse!!

i can explain if need be though i'm betting alot of people could

I'm listening intently.



lead will not help ya.. if you think lead will reduce more birds to bag, then you are shooting outside your effective range.. shooting lead will not help that. 3 in #3's at 20 yards and you will not lose many at all.. does not matter if it is lead or steel..

old steel was weak.. i can remember shooting canadas at close range and if you shot body, they would fly a good ways.. the shot was not to blame. it was the powder and wad for the most part..
WTN10 wrote:He was funny like a Pomeranian getting kicked over a fence.


pgquackstacker wrote:I actually started bringing a gun with me on dates, so I bring the girl's father out to my car and tell him if he tries to cock-block me I'll kill him.
User avatar
possumfoot
hunter
 
Posts: 5782
Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2005 5:13 pm
Location: making sesbania my bitch

Re: Including Lost Game In Limit

Postby aunt betty » Thu Sep 26, 2013 12:22 pm

Depending on how you hunt and where, you will lose more or less ducks. I hunted (past tense) with some guys who liked to shoot ducks but not retrieve them until later because they were worried about losing shot opportunities. That's not legal and you lose voo-coo ducks that way.

I've shot a lot of ducks and lost very few. Why? one word..."dog".

The guys I quit hunting with were afraid of dogs, didn't like dogs, didn't want dogs, and I resented that because I bought a Yellow Lab to hunt with them at the club WE WERE FORMING. I quit before it even got off the ground because of a guy *****ing about dogs at the first club meeting. Mine was still a puppy and they decided they had to have a rule that says, "if we want to we can and will make you take your dog and go". Eff that!

My first retriever named Blackie never, ever lost a duck. That dog would swim underwater and get them. It was amazing to watch him work. The second dog named Buddy...not so good but if a duck crashed on land...he would find it. He just didn't like water. :wink:

Milo has lost a duck or maybe two and for sure he's lost a speck we shot, maybe two. Point is if you are THAT concerned about including ducks in your bag...maybe getting a dog would put more in that bag.

If you look hard and the dog can't find it...it's gone and no need to count it in your bag because...if a trained retriever can't find a duck...chances are 50/50 (lol) the gw won't find it as well.
INTERNET CREDIBILITY is...an OXYMORON. :moon:
User avatar
aunt betty
memberhip was not approved
 
Posts: 11696
Joined: Fri Nov 19, 2010 8:09 pm
Location: Go HOGS!

Re: Including Lost Game In Limit

Postby mauserfan » Thu Sep 26, 2013 12:26 pm

Possumfoot, I don't agree.
1) Mortality is defined as "the number of deaths in a given period". We, as sportsmen, can assist in the control of these numbers. i.e.- losing fewer birds.
2)More breeding pairs = more ducklings.... if we have the habitat.....mauser
The greatest duck call known to mankind?....A fresh cup of coffee from the Thermos.
User avatar
mauserfan
hunter
 
Posts: 346
Joined: Wed Oct 17, 2012 9:37 am
Location: Northern Minnesota

Re: Including Lost Game In Limit

Postby possumfoot » Thu Sep 26, 2013 12:28 pm

aunt betty wrote:Depending on how you hunt and where, you will lose more or less ducks. I hunted (past tense) with some guys who liked to shoot ducks but not retrieve them until later because they were worried about losing shot opportunities. That's not legal and you lose voo-coo ducks that way.

I've shot a lot of ducks and lost very few. Why? one word..."dog".

The guys I quit hunting with were afraid of dogs, didn't like dogs, didn't want dogs, and I resented that because I bought a Yellow Lab to hunt with them at the club WE WERE FORMING. I quit before it even got off the ground because of a guy *****ing about dogs at the first club meeting. Mine was still a puppy and they decided they had to have a rule that says, "if we want to we can and will make you take your dog and go". Eff that!

My first retriever named Blackie never, ever lost a duck. That dog would swim underwater and get them. It was amazing to watch him work. The second dog named Buddy...not so good but if a duck crashed on land...he would find it. He just didn't like water. :wink:

Milo has lost a duck or maybe two and for sure he's lost a speck we shot, maybe two. Point is if you are THAT concerned about including ducks in your bag...maybe getting a dog would put more in that bag.

If you look hard and the dog can't find it...it's gone and no need to count it in your bag because...if a trained retriever can't find a duck...chances are 50/50 (lol) the gw won't find it as well.




i don't hunt with a dog much, and i lose very few.. and in standing corn...
WTN10 wrote:He was funny like a Pomeranian getting kicked over a fence.


pgquackstacker wrote:I actually started bringing a gun with me on dates, so I bring the girl's father out to my car and tell him if he tries to cock-block me I'll kill him.
User avatar
possumfoot
hunter
 
Posts: 5782
Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2005 5:13 pm
Location: making sesbania my bitch

Re: Including Lost Game In Limit

Postby possumfoot » Thu Sep 26, 2013 12:31 pm

mauserfan wrote:Possumfoot, I don't agree.
1) Mortality is defined as "the number of deaths in a given period". We, as sportsmen, can assist in the control of these numbers. i.e.- losing fewer birds.
2)More breeding pairs = more ducklings.... if we have the habitat.....mauser



the blank is what im drawing.. there is a word that goes there..

hunting within season and limits has been shown to have little to no impact on overall duck (breeding) populations.
WTN10 wrote:He was funny like a Pomeranian getting kicked over a fence.


pgquackstacker wrote:I actually started bringing a gun with me on dates, so I bring the girl's father out to my car and tell him if he tries to cock-block me I'll kill him.
User avatar
possumfoot
hunter
 
Posts: 5782
Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2005 5:13 pm
Location: making sesbania my bitch

Re: Including Lost Game In Limit

Postby Indaswamp » Thu Sep 26, 2013 12:35 pm

Rule of Capture...
The ducks are not "your's" to reduce to your personal possession until you have them in your hand. You are not bound by law to count them in your personal possession limit.
The Cajun 7 Course Meal; 1 lb. of boudin and a six pack of Abita beer.

Save the Marsh, Eat a Nutria!

Never fart in your waders, it'll give you WORTS.
User avatar
Indaswamp
Forum Moderator
 
Posts: 58136
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2008 8:40 pm
Location: South Louisiana

Re: Including Lost Game In Limit

Postby Bill Herian » Thu Sep 26, 2013 12:37 pm

possumfoot wrote:for the life of me i can not think of the term used though..


________ mortality


Compensatory.
User avatar
Bill Herian
hunter
 
Posts: 4594
Joined: Mon Sep 14, 2009 9:09 am
Location: breakin' hearts and blastin' farts in WI

Re: Including Lost Game In Limit

Postby Indaswamp » Thu Sep 26, 2013 12:41 pm

aunt betty wrote:Depending on how you hunt and where, you will lose more or less ducks. I hunted (past tense) with some guys who liked to shoot ducks but not retrieve them until later because they were worried about losing shot opportunities. That's not legal and you lose voo-coo ducks that way.

I've shot a lot of ducks and lost very few. Why? one word..."dog".

The guys I quit hunting with were afraid of dogs, didn't like dogs, didn't want dogs, and I resented that because I bought a Yellow Lab to hunt with them at the club WE WERE FORMING. I quit before it even got off the ground because of a guy *****ing about dogs at the first club meeting. Mine was still a puppy and they decided they had to have a rule that says, "if we want to we can and will make you take your dog and go". Eff that!

My first retriever named Blackie never, ever lost a duck. That dog would swim underwater and get them. It was amazing to watch him work. The second dog named Buddy...not so good but if a duck crashed on land...he would find it. He just didn't like water. :wink:

Milo has lost a duck or maybe two and for sure he's lost a speck we shot, maybe two. Point is if you are THAT concerned about including ducks in your bag...maybe getting a dog would put more in that bag.

If you look hard and the dog can't find it...it's gone and no need to count it in your bag because...if a trained retriever can't find a duck...chances are 50/50 (lol) the gw won't find it as well.

tangent topic, but there are some marshes that having a dog may not help your cripple retrieval ratio. Floatant marsh being one of them. If a duck finds a nutria hole in the middle of a floatant island and dives-chances are sllim to none that you find that bird.
The Cajun 7 Course Meal; 1 lb. of boudin and a six pack of Abita beer.

Save the Marsh, Eat a Nutria!

Never fart in your waders, it'll give you WORTS.
User avatar
Indaswamp
Forum Moderator
 
Posts: 58136
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2008 8:40 pm
Location: South Louisiana

Re: Including Lost Game In Limit

Postby Bill Herian » Thu Sep 26, 2013 12:42 pm

mauserfan wrote:2)More breeding pairs = more ducklings.... if we have the habitat.....mauser


Stahp!!! :crying:



Please do some reading on density dependent and density independent recruitment in wildlife.
User avatar
Bill Herian
hunter
 
Posts: 4594
Joined: Mon Sep 14, 2009 9:09 am
Location: breakin' hearts and blastin' farts in WI

Re: Including Lost Game In Limit

Postby Bill Herian » Thu Sep 26, 2013 12:43 pm

Indaswamp wrote:tangent topic, but there are some marshes that having a dog may not help your cripple retrieval ratio. Floatant marsh being one of them. If a duck finds a nutria hole in the middle of a floatant island and dives-chances are sllim to none that you find that bird.


And having the dog in that situation hurts your chances in what way?

Sounds exactly like the kind of place having a dog would increase your odds.
User avatar
Bill Herian
hunter
 
Posts: 4594
Joined: Mon Sep 14, 2009 9:09 am
Location: breakin' hearts and blastin' farts in WI

Re: Including Lost Game In Limit

Postby possumfoot » Thu Sep 26, 2013 12:44 pm

Bill Herian wrote:
possumfoot wrote:for the life of me i can not think of the term used though..


________ mortality


Compensatory.



thank you!!! that was starting to really bug me..
WTN10 wrote:He was funny like a Pomeranian getting kicked over a fence.


pgquackstacker wrote:I actually started bringing a gun with me on dates, so I bring the girl's father out to my car and tell him if he tries to cock-block me I'll kill him.
User avatar
possumfoot
hunter
 
Posts: 5782
Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2005 5:13 pm
Location: making sesbania my bitch

Re: Including Lost Game In Limit

Postby Indaswamp » Thu Sep 26, 2013 12:44 pm

Bill Herian wrote:
mauserfan wrote:2)More breeding pairs = more ducklings.... if we have the habitat.....mauser


Stahp!!! :crying:



Please do some reading on density dependent and density independent recruitment in wildlife.

Yep!
Might as well throw out that shooting hens does not impact the breeding stock either, only makes the strap prettier....
The Cajun 7 Course Meal; 1 lb. of boudin and a six pack of Abita beer.

Save the Marsh, Eat a Nutria!

Never fart in your waders, it'll give you WORTS.
User avatar
Indaswamp
Forum Moderator
 
Posts: 58136
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2008 8:40 pm
Location: South Louisiana

Re: Including Lost Game In Limit

Postby mauserfan » Thu Sep 26, 2013 12:48 pm

Indaswamp. I agree. I have hunted with a dog for every year since I was 16, with the exception of the last three. As you are aware, you have to "hunt" for the dog when afield. Meaning, you pick your shots, even with a dog. In a perfect world, it would be a marked bird for the dog. I have used a dog for all types of hunting and , aside from dry field hunting, this holds pretty much true no matter where you set up. As far as this topic goes, I think that the subject needs to be broached and talked about. Thanks again....mauser. :thumbsup:
The greatest duck call known to mankind?....A fresh cup of coffee from the Thermos.
User avatar
mauserfan
hunter
 
Posts: 346
Joined: Wed Oct 17, 2012 9:37 am
Location: Northern Minnesota

Re: Including Lost Game In Limit

Postby aunt betty » Thu Sep 26, 2013 12:49 pm

Mankind designed several canine breeds specifically for retrieving waterfowl. Mankind also invented semi-automatic firearms and chest waders along with a lot of other fine tools for hunting waterfowl. Calling yourself a waterfowler and only having half a toolset is a great way to lose ducks.

Get all of the tools
Follow all of the weird rules
shootem, fetchem, done


Haikued y'all again. :yes:
Last edited by aunt betty on Thu Sep 26, 2013 12:51 pm, edited 1 time in total.
INTERNET CREDIBILITY is...an OXYMORON. :moon:
User avatar
aunt betty
memberhip was not approved
 
Posts: 11696
Joined: Fri Nov 19, 2010 8:09 pm
Location: Go HOGS!

Re: Including Lost Game In Limit

Postby Indaswamp » Thu Sep 26, 2013 12:51 pm

Bill Herian wrote:
Indaswamp wrote:tangent topic, but there are some marshes that having a dog may not help your cripple retrieval ratio. Floatant marsh being one of them. If a duck finds a nutria hole in the middle of a floatant island and dives-chances are sllim to none that you find that bird.


And having the dog in that situation hurts your chances in what way?

Sounds exactly like the kind of place having a dog would increase your odds.

Dog can walk on it and you can't-not with out extreme effort and exertion anyways. Having a dog is a plus, definitely...but you are still going to loose a large number of cripples that dive in holes on the floating islands. There are some sections of floatant marsh where it is the density of quicksand at certain times of year (depending on rainfall and water level) and if your dog tries to "dig that bird out" he's going to create a hole and likely punch through. there is no footing for the dog to pull himself out and the suction from the muck is working against him.....
The Cajun 7 Course Meal; 1 lb. of boudin and a six pack of Abita beer.

Save the Marsh, Eat a Nutria!

Never fart in your waders, it'll give you WORTS.
User avatar
Indaswamp
Forum Moderator
 
Posts: 58136
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2008 8:40 pm
Location: South Louisiana

Re: Including Lost Game In Limit

Postby Indaswamp » Thu Sep 26, 2013 12:52 pm

mauserfan wrote:Indaswamp. I agree. I have hunted with a dog for every year since I was 16, with the exception of the last three. As you are aware, you have to "hunt" for the dog when afield. Meaning, you pick your shots, even with a dog. In a perfect world, it would be a marked bird for the dog. I have used a dog for all types of hunting and , aside from dry field hunting, this holds pretty much true no matter where you set up. As far as this topic goes, I think that the subject needs to be broached and talked about. Thanks again....mauser. :thumbsup:

Do a search on the dog forum, it has been discussed at length.
The Cajun 7 Course Meal; 1 lb. of boudin and a six pack of Abita beer.

Save the Marsh, Eat a Nutria!

Never fart in your waders, it'll give you WORTS.
User avatar
Indaswamp
Forum Moderator
 
Posts: 58136
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2008 8:40 pm
Location: South Louisiana

Re: Including Lost Game In Limit

Postby aunt betty » Thu Sep 26, 2013 12:55 pm

Indaswamp wrote:
Bill Herian wrote:
Indaswamp wrote:tangent topic, but there are some marshes that having a dog may not help your cripple retrieval ratio. Floatant marsh being one of them. If a duck finds a nutria hole in the middle of a floatant island and dives-chances are sllim to none that you find that bird.


And having the dog in that situation hurts your chances in what way?

Sounds exactly like the kind of place having a dog would increase your odds.

Dog can walk on it and you can't-not with out extreme effort and exertion anyways. Having a dog is a plus, definitely...but you are still going to loose a large number of cripples that dive in holes on the floating islands. There are some sections of floatant marsh where it is the density of quicksand at certain times of year (depending on rainfall and water level) and if your dog tries to "dig that bird out" he's going to create a hole and likely punch through. there is no footing for the dog to pull himself out and the suction from the muck is working against him.....
I wouldn't send MY dog out into that floatant. Never never, NOOOO.
Swamp, the worst hazard I deal with while hunting is/are...ice, tangles in sticks n logs, and SNAKES.
I can't even imagine dealing with tides, quicksand, and floatant. I agree with whatever you say. :thumbsup:
In my situation a dog is a must have. It just makes life in a duck blind or pit SO much easier.
INTERNET CREDIBILITY is...an OXYMORON. :moon:
User avatar
aunt betty
memberhip was not approved
 
Posts: 11696
Joined: Fri Nov 19, 2010 8:09 pm
Location: Go HOGS!

Re: Including Lost Game In Limit

Postby greenster » Thu Sep 26, 2013 1:13 pm

LOT of "skybustin tree toppers around here"
"Thomas Jefferson said I had a God-given right to pursue happiness. What makes me happy is to take a mallard's head smooth off at about 20 feet.

Lanyard: KM Custom Cut (hand),KM Cut red label Black Monster #1,RNT Timber hog,DS mondo,6n1 whistle
User avatar
greenster
Forum & State Moderator
 
Posts: 4507
Joined: Thu Jul 07, 2005 9:11 pm
Location: arkansas Green Timber

Re: Including Lost Game In Limit

Postby Indaswamp » Thu Sep 26, 2013 1:13 pm

Bill Herian wrote:
Indaswamp wrote:tangent topic, but there are some marshes that having a dog may not help your cripple retrieval ratio. Floatant marsh being one of them. If a duck finds a nutria hole in the middle of a floatant island and dives-chances are sllim to none that you find that bird.


And having the dog in that situation hurts your chances in what way?

Sounds exactly like the kind of place having a dog would increase your odds.

Here ya go....
http://www.duckhuntingchat.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=182102

and that is a "tight" floatant marsh, there's a lot looser stuff out there and certain grasses roots systems are a royal PITA to try to negotiate for either you or your dog.
The Cajun 7 Course Meal; 1 lb. of boudin and a six pack of Abita beer.

Save the Marsh, Eat a Nutria!

Never fart in your waders, it'll give you WORTS.
User avatar
Indaswamp
Forum Moderator
 
Posts: 58136
Joined: Thu Aug 07, 2008 8:40 pm
Location: South Louisiana

Re: Including Lost Game In Limit

Postby boney fingers » Thu Sep 26, 2013 2:28 pm

I assume that when the duck limits are set, they are done with a certain amount of loss calculated in.
boney fingers
hunter
 
Posts: 863
Joined: Sat Feb 18, 2012 6:30 pm

Re: Including Lost Game In Limit

Postby assateague » Thu Sep 26, 2013 2:35 pm

Lreynolds wrote:
assateague wrote:Define "established".


Estimated from a number of studies and used in population models that include hunting mortality as a specific term.



Based off of conversations with hunters? I really don't understand how this is anything but a wildass guess. The formulas may be scientific, the studies may be scientifically designed, but I see no way to gather accurate data for such a subject.
WOLVERINES

Give a man a fish and he eats for a day. Let a man vote to give himself a fish and he eats until society collapses.
User avatar
assateague
Emu hunter extraordinaire
 
Posts: 21277
Joined: Tue Oct 06, 2009 12:25 pm
Location: Eastern Shore, People's Republic of Maryland

Re: Including Lost Game In Limit

Postby mauserfan » Fri Sep 27, 2013 6:08 am

Here's where I was going with this when I opened the thread....This type of a conservative philosophy is simply a matter of ethics and conservation. It is not a legal or rights issue. It was interesting where the conversation went. There are a number of hunters that are in the wings and think like I do and I just wanted to bring it out to open it up. If we all hunted this way our hunting would be better. It still would not prevent the guy from setting up too close but would limit an amount of skybusting. Food for thought. Signing off now to go to the camp. Be safe.....mauser :wink:
The greatest duck call known to mankind?....A fresh cup of coffee from the Thermos.
User avatar
mauserfan
hunter
 
Posts: 346
Joined: Wed Oct 17, 2012 9:37 am
Location: Northern Minnesota

PreviousNext

Return to The Honey Hole

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Cujo1, Duck Slayer424, Fowlobsession, Jcochran88, PTROOFER FTFOWLER and 53 guests