Shell Limit?

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Shell Limit?

Postby w1!dbill » Fri Oct 07, 2005 6:51 am

O.K., I know you all have been anxiously awaiting today's topic. Here it is. Seriously, if anyone's getting sick of me posing these questions/discussion topics, just PM me and I'll cease and desist post haste.

Shell limits. I've been spending some time on the Arkansas forum, since that's where I'm originally from. Arkansas, like most states has had it's share of problems with skybusting. It got so bad in many areas that they've imposed shell limits in many of the Wildlife Management Areas that tend to hold ducks and draw duck hunters. The theory behind it is that if you've got only a limited number of shots to take, you'll take better (in range) shots. Based on my conversations with my relatives and some of the comments I've seen on the forum, it seems to have been somewhat effective in reducing skybusting and hasn't really had much of a negative effect on the non-skybusters.

What would you think about something like this in Utah? Or, does it already exist, and I just don't know about it because I'm new :smile:

Personally, I don't think I'd have a problem with it. It's not about killing ducks to me, it's about hunting them. Having good quality shot opportunities is what makes it "hunting" versus "killing", in my humble opinion. I'm not the worlds greatest wingshot, but if I went out and had quality shots at decoying ducks and went home empty handed because I had used up my alloted number of shells, I'd blame myself, not the shell limit. I'd also spend some time busting clays before I went out again :thumbsup: . On the other hand, I know there are tons of associated issues with this kind of regulation. Without enforcement, a shell limit does no good and enforcement costs money. That money could probably be better spent elsewhere. Plus, no one likes being "big brothered" more than we have to. Overall though, I'd say I'd be in favor of it.

What do you think?

I'll be out of pocket for a few days...going to meet my ex-wife #2 and pick up my daughter. We'll be hanging at my friends cabin in the Uintah's for the weekend. Bust some ducks while I'm gone. :hammering:

Bill
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Postby Spiraleyes » Fri Oct 07, 2005 2:31 pm

I don't think it would be a bad idea to have a shell limit on some of the heavily used areas, such as Farmington, Public, Salt Creek and Odgen Bay. I would also rather have fewer shots to take than pulling my hair out at stupid sky busters around me.

I think in areas that don't have as much pressure, a shell limit might not be necessary. Enforcement would be harder, and there wouldn't be as much competition between hunters.

Now, the next question would be, "what would the limit of shells be?" I think 15 is a generous amount, just over 2 shots per bird. That way, newer hunters might not be discouraged to go out. But on the other hand, a hunter really should be able to make the kill in one shot.

Does the BRBR still have a 10 shell limit?

Jim
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Postby 98ramtough » Fri Oct 07, 2005 2:33 pm

What is your guys limit on ducks there in Utah?
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Postby Bret » Fri Oct 07, 2005 6:03 pm

7 ducks.

I am not in favor of a shell limit. Not because I like to shoot a lot. I don't care much about shooting at all. finishing them is way more important and even then..... My deal with it is this. I think it would be discouraging to the young guys. My youth party shot well over fifteen shells at finished birds to kill 7 each. There was a time when I was starting out at 12 I could not kill 7 ducks with 15 shells out of the decoys. I practiced a lot more then than I do now, but I would get excited and plain miss. Of course I never do that now. :oops: As much as hate the skybusting, I hate things that I feel can get honest people in trouble more. how many times have you found an extra shell in your hunting coat, or wader pocket whatever. Pluss I have a hard time counting passed seven.lol There is another issue....I think the coot limit is 25 I don't hunt coots, but for sake of debate.......25coots+7ducks+3darks+4lights+2pheasants durring pheasant season=41 shells if you shot perfect. Now I know that is a stretch that you could even possibly do that on a WMA in Utah, but it would be leagal to do so durring pheasant season. I guess maybe I can count higher than I thought.

I do not think a shell limit would acomplish what you are asking it to do anyway. I think the way to fight skybusting is with education not law. Maybe right in the hunter education course that most everyone has to take anyway. The last one I attended did not even touch on waterfowl or shotgun shooting the guy teaching it only cared about big game so that is what he talked about for the entire course.

Skybusting at least where I hunt is not the worse problem it is simply an annoyance. They have been doing it as long as I can remember and probably will do it until you can no longer hunt ducks or I die whatever comes first. Lets spend that money fighting phrag and things like that. If you want to enforce something litter would be another place to start as the 12 packs and beer cans pile up next to the spent shells on the dike.

Just for thought has anyone here never taken a shot that was out of range? I know in my younger days I took some.


Just my trouble making .02


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Postby Spiraleyes » Fri Oct 07, 2005 9:15 pm

Bret, you make a strong case. I think you're right. I would rather see the money that would be spent enforcing a shell limit go elsewhere. Education is probably our best medium for something like this.

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Postby firebird » Sat Oct 08, 2005 2:09 pm

Someone already asked about Bear River Bird Refuge and yes they have very specific shell number restrictions, particularly for swan hunters though. With swan hunters I think it is a great idea. For ducks and geese I would echo Bret. Last night my first shot I knocked down a gadwall then spent 9 more shots finishing off the diving cripple.( I sure miss my old dog!) So overall I am opposed to shotshell restrictions.
There is no help for this kind of insanity. I'm just a duck hunter, and should not be held accountable for all my actions between October 1st and freeze-up. Gordon MacQuarrie
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Postby w1!dbill » Tue Oct 11, 2005 8:44 am

Just as I assumed, an excellent topical discussion without anyone flaming anyone else.

All good points. I never even thought of the youth hunt...I know I would've been a frustrated youngster with a shell limitation. Seems like education is the way to go. My son went through Hunter Education while he was out visiting me this summer. His instructor was an avid duck hunter and spent some serious discussion time on ethical shots, both big game and bird-wise. My son spent the rest of his visit trying to decide if ducks and geese flying over the house were in range by whether or not he could see their legs clearly. I just hope he can stick to it when he's got a shotgun in his hand. If he can't, that's where I step in :hammering:

Yep, I took my share of "questionable" shots when I was younger. Especially during my first few hunts outside the realm of my Dad's immediate supervision. A chase of about 2 miles through knee deep snow after a Canada with a broken wing was what finally cured me. :smile:
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