Difficulty with Calling

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Difficulty with Calling

Postby luie b » Thu May 24, 2012 4:14 pm

I'm no expert in goose calling and really don't have much experience because this was my first year of goose hunting but I learned how to call pretty good with my buck gardner canada hammer. Then I decided to get a better call and got a Foiles Meat Grinder and have had a lot of problems calling with it. At first I couldn't even get a cluck out of it but after messin around with it for a while I am starting to be able to get a few clucks out of it but it doesn't sound near as good as my Canada Hammer yet. Are these more expensive calls harder to blow or is it a problem with the call itself because I've messed with the tuning and this is as good as I can get it.
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Re: Difficulty with Calling

Postby berganser » Thu May 24, 2012 4:43 pm

If you have messed w/ the tuning Good Luck! Unless you got hours to play with it, send it back or find somebody that can tune for you. One thing I've learned, don't mess with it! Especially Goose. Good Luck :thumbsup:
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Re: Difficulty with Calling

Postby luie b » Thu May 24, 2012 6:36 pm

Everybody told me here to mess with the tuning and now that I've gone and done it now they're telling me it's messed up. :huh:
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Re: Difficulty with Calling

Postby atr04screw » Thu May 24, 2012 6:38 pm

I would say just keep practicing with it. Like berganser said, if you can have it tuned, then great, but DONT try to do too much yourself. The first goose call I bought was a cheap knight&hale, but it was a little too high pitched, so I tried to tune it myself, bad idea. I couldn't get it back together right, so it was done, luckily it only costed about $15. When I broke that call, I bought a RNT cocobolo goose call, and it sounds great, but one thing about it is it takes alot of air to blow.
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Re: Difficulty with Calling

Postby Rick Hall » Fri May 25, 2012 5:44 am

Please don't take this the wrong way, but do you know what you're doing? Can you take your Canada Hammer apart and retune it correctly?

'Cause if you can't tune a call you know you can run, you've no way of knowing whether the problem with your Foiles call is in your tuning, your air presentation or that particular call is just a really bad fit for you. In any event, while some models will require more skill to operate than others, regardless of cost, "more expensive" certainly doesn't necessarily mean "more difficult to run". If anything, the reverse would seem more likely.

And, in any event, it would behoove anyone serious about becoming a better caller to learn how to tune his own for best fit.
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Re: Difficulty with Calling

Postby A-Bomb » Fri May 25, 2012 6:35 am

Buy Bad Grammar from www.moltgear.com. It will show you how to run a short reed and how to tear down and put back together. Theres also a thread on here somewhere where Wade Walling shows how to tear down and reassemble a short reed along with some other info.

Short reeds, its all about proper tuning, how your putting the air into the call and hands. If any are off your gonna struggle. Length of call, and if the reed is full or shaved will also have an impact on the ease of use. I really would recommend the Bad Grammar. Will get you doing things right.
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Re: Difficulty with Calling

Postby luie b » Fri May 25, 2012 9:46 am

I watched my Bad Grammer DVD again this morning and just renewed my calling instructions and form and now am reaching some progess with the Foiles. Like the guy said in the dvd, an acrylic call is different than a polycarb and until this call I've never called on an acrylic before. From what I remember I was having the same problems when I started using a short reed in the first place when I started using that canada hammer so I think with sufficient practice I'll have this call sounding good.
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Re: Difficulty with Calling

Postby erp10 » Fri May 25, 2012 11:24 am

This was my second year goose hunting and first with an acrylic call. I had the same learning curve you had. The best thing that you can do is try alot of calls if a store stocks them near you. I found that when I started out I could hardly make a sound with a LMC call but the Zink calls I picked up and ran fine. Now I can use both after a year of practice.
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Re: Difficulty with Calling

Postby goosehunter64 » Fri May 25, 2012 3:04 pm

Luie B..I PM'ed you??
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Re: Difficulty with Calling

Postby duckdozer » Fri May 25, 2012 4:23 pm

luie b wrote:I watched my Bad Grammer DVD again this morning and just renewed my calling instructions and form and now am reaching some progess with the Foiles. Like the guy said in the dvd, an acrylic call is different than a polycarb and until this call I've never called on an acrylic before. From what I remember I was having the same problems when I started using a short reed in the first place when I started using that canada hammer so I think with sufficient practice I'll have this call sounding good.


Unless you have a rare unheard of meat grinder you dont have an acrylic call. There is a diffrence in the BG calls and the Foiles calls as far as air presentation goes, just a slight diffrence. While my SMH sounds way more goosey, I can get my grey ghost to move faster and do diffrent things with less effort. the grey gghost is still goosey just the SMH is a little lower and throaty IMO.
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Re: Difficulty with Calling

Postby shootable Goose » Sat May 26, 2012 5:27 pm

duckdozer wrote:
luie b wrote:I watched my Bad Grammer DVD again this morning and just renewed my calling instructions and form and now am reaching some progess with the Foiles. Like the guy said in the dvd, an acrylic call is different than a polycarb and until this call I've never called on an acrylic before. From what I remember I was having the same problems when I started using a short reed in the first place when I started using that canada hammer so I think with sufficient practice I'll have this call sounding good.


Unless you have a rare unheard of meat grinder you dont have an acrylic call.

2nd that
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Re: Difficulty with Calling

Postby luie b » Sat May 26, 2012 9:55 pm

shootable Goose wrote:
duckdozer wrote:
luie b wrote:I watched my Bad Grammer DVD again this morning and just renewed my calling instructions and form and now am reaching some progess with the Foiles. Like the guy said in the dvd, an acrylic call is different than a polycarb and until this call I've never called on an acrylic before. From what I remember I was having the same problems when I started using a short reed in the first place when I started using that canada hammer so I think with sufficient practice I'll have this call sounding good.


Unless you have a rare unheard of meat grinder you dont have an acrylic call.

2nd that

Yea I looked it up and saw it wasn't acrylic but it sure feels like a harder plastic than any of my other poly-carbs. I'm starting to do some better calling with it so I think the problem in this case was "the fool not the tool" as my dad would say.
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Re: Difficulty with Calling

Postby A-Bomb » Sun May 27, 2012 4:02 pm

Usually the case with short reed calls. :clapping: you for admitting it. Thats tough for a lot of people. Its always the call getting hammered it seems.
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Re: Difficulty with Calling

Postby tripleb » Mon May 28, 2012 6:44 am

luie b wrote:Everybody told me here to mess with the tuning and now that I've gone and done it now they're telling me it's messed up. :huh:


Do you have access to a dial caliper? If so, set the reed tip to wedge distance at about .565". That's a good start point ..... not the end point in tuning. The reed tip should be within a few thousandths of the end of the tone channel ..... with just enough clearance to be able to drop in. Make certain you have you have the reed set with the shaved side up (if it is shaved), or if not shaved, squeeze the tips together slightly with your thumb and forefinger several times and see which way the reed bends. The side which bends down in the center should be placed down on the tone board.

Short reed goose call tuning is very easy, though you have to understand the basics of how the call works. If you don't play around with the call, you'll never be able to tune your own call. It's sort of like learning how to take a Browning BPS apart and get it back together. The gun doesn't come with disassembly/reassembly instructions, so you have to work through it yourself. It's a very simple gun, but it took 4 hours of cussing and fuming to get my BPS10 back together the first time I tried. Now it takes about 2 minutes, once I understood how the parts work and fit together. The same is true with respect to a short reed goose call ... and it's even easier, since there are only 5 parts. You'll learn quickly if you have someone show you how to do it. I'd contact Foiles and see if they have any pro staffers in your area who could help you.
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Re: Difficulty with Calling

Postby luie b » Mon May 28, 2012 9:13 am

I'm sure they do have lots of pro-staffers in the area, since Foiles is only a little over an hour away in Pittsfield, IL. I've never been to their store before but been to Pittsfield a lot. If I don't reach any progress with the call I might have someone look at it but I'm starting to sound lots better. And the good thing is each cluck I can do sounds better than a cluck out of other calls I have tried.
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Re: Difficulty with Calling

Postby tripleb » Tue May 29, 2012 7:24 am

luie b wrote:I'm sure they do have lots of pro-staffers in the area, since Foiles is only a little over an hour away in Pittsfield, IL. I've never been to their store before but been to Pittsfield a lot. If I don't reach any progress with the call I might have someone look at it but I'm starting to sound lots better. And the good thing is each cluck I can do sounds better than a cluck out of other calls I have tried.


Glad to read that things are going better with the call. But, I'd still recommend getting the Foiles guys to show you how to tune the call, especially if they're that close. The process is a lot easier if you can watch it being done while it's explained to you. And ...... they may be able to tune it just a bit better for you than you've gotten it thus far. Once it is tuned to your satisfaction, mark the junction of the reed and wedge with a Sharpie pen, so you can get it back to the same setting point if you ever need to do so. If there's a tuning groove on the tone board, note where the wedge sits in relationship to the tuning groove. On the ones I've measured, it seems that the reed tip to wedge distance is about .550" if the wedge is set at the front (mouth end) of the tuning groove .... That will give you a higher pitched call, while if the wedge is at the back of the tuning groove, the reed tip/wedge distance is about .565". That will give you a lower pitched call. Of course, if the reed is shaved, everything changes.
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Re: Difficulty with Calling

Postby Dbishop311 » Tue May 29, 2012 8:33 pm

There is a video on youtube from Foiles showing you how to tune a Foiles SMH, look under how to tune a short reed goose call. :thumbsup:
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