condor season

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Re: condor season

Postby duckman27 » Fri Apr 06, 2012 12:03 pm

phutch30 wrote:When they find dead condors they perform full range autopsies. The bullets or fragments tend to stay in the crop or gut rather than passing through. We get owls, eagles, hawks swans etc. every year with lead poisoning. It takes a really small dose to incapacitate a bird. Spring is rough on raptors here. Everyone is out shooting ground squirrels and many of those dead squirrels lying around get picked up by birds. The actual lead fragment the bird picks up may not kill it out right, but it makes them so sick that they end up on the ground exposed to the elements, which finish them off.

Scott-actually lead bullets were a significant cause for condor extirpation. Only they didnt ingest them. They got shot. But the main factor was poison.


Me? :huh:
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Re: condor season

Postby phutch30 » Fri Apr 06, 2012 12:40 pm

Not you duckman, I was speaking to GGC
....its like taking x-lax when you have a bad cough. It wont clear up your lungs, but it sure stops you from coughing
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Re: condor season

Postby aunt betty » Fri Apr 06, 2012 2:09 pm

Very interesting thread. I had no idea the condors were dying from eating bullet-laden varmints.
Maybe the lead ban is a good idea. I don't use lead-shot anymore even on small game like rabbits.
I don't shoot a rifle so lead pellets is my concern and I always thought it was just Loons that were eating the lead pellets.
My opinion is NOT VALID because I don't live in California.

Thanks for sharing this issue. We care!
INTERNET CREDIBILITY is...an OXYMORON. :moon:
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Re: condor season

Postby dakotashooter2 » Mon Apr 09, 2012 10:16 am

In the 50s there were a reported 150+ condors left....60 years later we have around 390 only 180 of which are in the wild. I wouldn't exactly call that a recovery. The last info I read indicated that the wild condors were breeding and laying eggs but NO chicks were surviving beyond a couple of weeks if they hatched at all. In many cases the eggs of the wild birds are being replaced with eggs from captive birds and they still are not surviving. This "recovery" really doesn't mean much if they can't successfully breed in the wild. While man may partially to blame, even our influences are part of a process called evolution. Those that can't adapt don't survive. Niche animals are particularly succeptible to evolution. We can give it our best but this birds days are numbered. Whether that number is 20 years or 100 isn't going to make that much difference in overal scheme of things. I'm not saying we shouldn't try but you also have to know when to throw in the towel. We can't save everything.


My biggest objection to the lead ban is that I'm (and neither are the experts) not sure most of the consumed lead is even coming from the targeted bullets (big game). Most big game is recovered while often small game shot with small rifles with lead bullets (which is allowed) is not neccessarily recovered and may be the biggest source of contamination. BUT small rifles (.22s) are exempt because there is not a readily avaiable source of lead free ammo. It's a "feel good" regulation............
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Re: condor season

Postby phutch30 » Mon Apr 09, 2012 12:19 pm

Small lead is a major consideration. However condor key in on larger food sources such as gut piles/large dead animals which retain a fairly high level of lead or the bullet wasn’t working.

It takes very little lead to incapacitate a bird.

The number in the wild is over 200

Some chicks are in fact surviving past fledgling age when they tend to die due to lead poisoning, power lines or several other factors.

Sorry- You conception of evolution is flawed. Human influences happen too rapidly to allow for evolution in most cases. This is directly evidenced by the fact this planet is experiencing the fastest rate of extinctions since the dino's all directly linked to human growth. When you reduce a slow growing/breeding species like the condor from 1 million to 150 individuals in about 100 years at the same time eliminating their food supply you can’t expect them to adapt. Same thing happened to whales, buffalo and many other species.

I fail to see the issue with switching to non lead bullets in an effort to save a species.

In the end everthing on the planet is doomed, our sun doesnt have an infinet lifespan. Someday its guna blink out.
....its like taking x-lax when you have a bad cough. It wont clear up your lungs, but it sure stops you from coughing
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Re: condor season

Postby duckinismyluckin » Tue Apr 10, 2012 6:58 pm

I agree 22's and shot makes sense.
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Re: condor season

Postby SnookMan88 » Mon Oct 22, 2012 6:25 pm

there sure are some ignorant people out there
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