Laser Sights for Carried Pistol

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Laser Sights for Carried Pistol

Postby DanJeffandJack » Tue Apr 05, 2011 8:21 pm

Looking into getting my first pistol. I am interested in eventually getting a CC so I really like the .40 subcompact XD. Anyway, I am very new to pistol shooting and am interested in upgrading my sights when I get one. I was looking at either Trijicon Tritium night sights, Lasermaxx Guide rod lasers or the crimson trace. What would your suggestion be?

Also, if you have any other suggestion for a type of pistol or sight I should look into let me know.
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Re: Laser Sights for Carried Pistol

Postby duckkillerclyde » Tue Apr 05, 2011 9:09 pm

No on laser sight as the area the beam shoots out of will get filled with dirt and debris and block the laser. That is if you carry it all the time.
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Re: Laser Sights for Carried Pistol

Postby DanJeffandJack » Tue Apr 05, 2011 9:44 pm

duckkillerclyde wrote:No on laser sight as the area the beam shoots out of will get filled with dirt and debris and block the laser. That is if you carry it all the time.

Interesting. I never thought about that. Thanks Clyde.
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Re: Laser Sights for Carried Pistol

Postby duckkillerclyde » Tue Apr 05, 2011 9:53 pm

laser is fun for a week.

a good practice would be to get the laser, practice your "draw" and then without looking down the sights see where you are pointing the gun. get comfortable enough to instinctively be able to hit a human torso. I am assuming that is what you are doing with this pistol. with enough practice you will learn muscle memory. I hope you never have to shoot someone, but from what I have heard is that MOST of the time when shooting is required, you will not have enough time to aim and it is rather a point. I live in Oregon and we ave a concealed handgun license. The instructor I took the class from said,(now this could be completely wrong, so correct me if I am) the average "gun fight" is 2 shots and 2 seconds long. being that you are a duck hunter and have been around guns I bet you understand that you don't use a gun to threat, you use it to illuminate a threat. I have never been in a gun fight but television and hollywood has glorified it. If I pull a gun on someone you had better believe there is already one in the chamber and I am going to shoot you not just point it at you.
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Re: Laser Sights for Carried Pistol

Postby Duck Sausage » Wed Apr 06, 2011 10:16 pm

IMHO, night sights are a good happy medium, but they do not excel at anything. In darkness, a laser is better. In light, normal sites are better. They work as a catch all, but I prefer the normal site and laser set up. Personally I have never seen a laser so gunked up it blocks it entirely. I have seen the dot get a little fuzzy. You clean them though regularly just like you would with any carry weapon. CT is the only laser and Trijicon the only NS, I have experience with though.

I do not own an XD, but I have shot several hundred rounds through an XDm full size and XDm compact (2 shooting buddies own them). They are good guns. For another option, I recommend you try the M&P series. The M&P fits my natural point the best and so I am more accurate with those guns by default (that is why I own these instead of Springfields or Glocks).

If possible, before you buy, shoot a couple of magazines through borrowed guns or at a rental range. Which one to buy will automatically come to you. On another note, since you are new to handguns I recommend you at least think about a 9mm (especially in a compact). You will get a lot more "good" practice with a 9 for the same amount of money and time. Don't fall for the kool aid hyperbole...
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Re: Laser Sights for Carried Pistol

Postby DanJeffandJack » Thu Apr 07, 2011 11:11 am

Good ideas Sausage. I appreciate the suggestions. I actually was fortunate enough to try out a bunch of options at a local range. I liked a .357 Sig 226? the best, but it was out of my price range (both the gun and the ammo) so I settled on the XD. As for the .40 caliber, I have looked into the price of ammunition at the local sporting goods store and the .40 caliber winchester white box ammo is at a price I am willing to pay to get an adequate amount of practice in. Although, that certainly is a very good thought. I'm not buying the gun for another week or so, so I will look into a S&W. I actually do remember it fitting my hand quite well. Although, I really like the grip safety on the XD. I know it probably isn't as big of a concern as I think it is, I am just a little paranoid about shooting myself in the thigh without a safety... :lol3:
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Re: Laser Sights for Carried Pistol

Postby Sagebrush » Thu Apr 07, 2011 11:23 am

Most carry guns are small and short with 2-3" barrels max.

Most shootings are inside of ten feet and generally you don't have much time to think or aim, let alone look for where that little light is and hope the BG is not on top of you or have you in a head lock, where the lazer will not help out, any way.
Time yourself from hands out side to total time to get the gun, aim and fire. If a guy is walking towards you and you see your in trouble you have 3-4 sweconds to do something..........................Dead battery ? Fuzz ? Now what ?

I have lazer sights but don't rely on them.................if they work good, if not ?
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Re: Laser Sights for Carried Pistol

Postby TomKat » Thu Apr 07, 2011 11:25 am

Andrew,
Come on out and shoot my .40 Kahr CW40 before you make any buying decisions. Did you know I am an NRA Certified pistol instructor? I have carried many diffrent guns, I like the Kahr better than most.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nLCgpjxlutw&feature=related
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Re: Laser Sights for Carried Pistol

Postby DanJeffandJack » Thu Apr 07, 2011 4:49 pm

TomKat wrote:Andrew,
Come on out and shoot my .40 Kahr CW40 before you make any buying decisions. Did you know I am an NRA Certified pistol instructor? I have carried many diffrent guns, I like the Kahr better than most.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nLCgpjxlutw&feature=related


TK,

An NRA certified Pistol Instructor? What is there you can't do Tomkat? Hmmm, me thinks I need to take advantage of this. I have little to no experience with pistols so learning the correct way off of the bat would probably be beneficial.

I propose a trade. My strong back and weak mind for labor around the ranch in exchange for some lessons and a predator or turkey hunt?
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Re: Laser Sights for Carried Pistol

Postby TomKat » Thu Apr 07, 2011 6:19 pm

Naw, you just come on out and I will hook you up. I have a nice variety of pistols and a good place to shoot them. I am all about safety, I am happy to teach you the RIGHT way to handle firearms.

At one of my Uncles 4th of July shoots we have every year

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You have to remember, when I was your age I had the same drive and curosity you have about the outdoors and guns, etc....I have had more years on earth to pursue it than you have. I am happy to share my knowledge with you, I was lucky enough to have family members teach me.

Next Wed is opening day of turkey season; after I get my cousin a bird, I am going to work on getting one in front of you. I have a place in mind, you may have to give me an entire Saturday to get it done, but I think you would really like turkey hunting.

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Here is one of me with my cousin Mike, he taught me how to call turks. I am hoping to call one in for him on opening day, he is using a 20 gauge model 12 Winchester his Grandfather bought new...

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Re: Laser Sights for Carried Pistol

Postby Preacher1011 » Sat Apr 09, 2011 7:57 am

Sagebrush wrote:Most carry guns are small and short with 2-3" barrels max.

Most shootings are inside of ten feet and generally you don't have much time to think or aim, let alone look for where that little light is and hope the BG is not on top of you or have you in a head lock, where the lazer will not help out, any way.
Time yourself from hands out side to total time to get the gun, aim and fire. If a guy is walking towards you and you see your in trouble you have 3-4 sweconds to do something..........................Dead battery ? Fuzz ? Now what ?

I have lazer sights but don't rely on them.................if they work good, if not ?


Ditto. Plus add in the fact if you're using it in your home there is dust. That means there will be a red beam going right back to your gun and that puts a target on you. Also if in your home, most people don't realize you still need a flashlight. Sure you get a nice red dot on what you're shooting at, but what if it's your kid or wife stumbling around the house? A laser just puts a red dot on something and if you don't use a flashlight, you might very well shoot someone you don't want to.

I'll never have a laser on my gun, I will have night sights though. They don't require batteries and glow for a very long time. I have some on my 2nd gen glock that have been on there since '92 when the gun was made. They're pretty faded when compared with brand new sights, but they still work. There's a reason LEO's are issued night sights and not lasers.

IF you are dead set on a laser the only one I would recommend is the Crimson Trace laser grips. Like Sagebrush said, you don't have time to flip a switch when you get in a confrontation. With the CT grips you just press with your middle finger. Sagebrush was also dead on with his stats on shootings. Theyr'e close and fast. 90% of them are in 5 yards or less and 90% of those are 3 shots or less and over in about 5 seconds. I wouldn't trust my life to something that had to be turned on and wastes time. Just my .02 though.
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Re: Laser Sights for Carried Pistol

Postby DanJeffandJack » Sat Apr 09, 2011 10:11 pm

Guys,

Thanks for all of the help. I purchased the .40 Subcompact XD and installed meprolight night sights. I was wanting to install the Trijicons, but the gun store guy talked me into the Mepros instead. I love it. I bought 200 rounds of and went to town with it.

Thanks Again.
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Re: Laser Sights for Carried Pistol

Postby Duck Sausage » Sun Apr 10, 2011 9:06 pm

Congratulations on the new baby. I'm sure you'll love it and it will work just fine for you...
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Re: Laser Sights for Carried Pistol

Postby apexhunter » Tue Apr 12, 2011 7:22 am

Congrats on your purchase...I'm sure you will have years of excellent service from your XD as have I with mine.

On the topiic of sights- I personally think you did the correct thing with night sights for a carry gun and agree with Sage and Preacher about the necessity for quick presentation and simple & accurate pointing in a SD situation. That said I do like a laser/light combo for home defense where most situations are likely to occur at night and target illumination for identification purposes is critical.

What you will most likely find is that you will eventually purchase more and different handguns once you start throwing lead downrange and find that the XD SC does not fill all niches you'll come across. Above and beyond a "target" gun many people will get a dedicated "house" gun that they and their spouse can safely and efficiently operate...this would be the perfect candidate for a laser, light or combo unit.

From here the best thing one can do is to obtain training. From the basic fundamentals through varying levels of "tactical" or "defensive" situations one can never have enough training or practice enough. It takes several thousand repetitions for a particular action to become engrained as muscle memory which is necessary to overcome the stress and anxiety of a defensive situation.
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Re: Laser Sights for Carried Pistol

Postby swampwise » Tue Apr 12, 2011 8:41 am

Good choice on the gun. The XD is a more modern version of a Glock (the Croatian I.M. Metal, mother of the early XD, was actually successfully sued by Glock because the inner workings were so similar) which I think you'll find is a great shooter, if a little chunky in the hand, and more accurate than you might expect.

Also, good choice on the night sights. Don't teach yourself to rely on a laser to shoot, because Murphy will ensure that the minute you need it, it won't work. Three pieces of steel on the top of your slide can't physically fail, therefore with iron sights, your chances of winning a gunfight go up. Another great benefit of night sights is that when it's on your nightstand, you can always tell exactly where it is and how it's oriented by the sights.

If you become proficient enough with the open sights, and decide you really need to spend (waste) money on a laser, crimson trace is the way to go. The laser guide rods are a neat idea, but they're just not strong enough to stand up to the repeated bashing of the recoil. I watched a guy put a brand new laser rod in a Glock 22 and pull the trigger exactly once and the laser went out. You really want to avoid the rail mounted lasers too, because that tends to limit your holster choices, thereby making concealed carry more difficult.

My thoughts on lasers in a nutshell: Why pay $300 for the ability to shoot where you want to, when the gun already comes with perfectly good sights...
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