Odd Duck ID Need Help

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Odd Duck ID Need Help

Postby owlman33 » Sun Dec 02, 2012 7:30 am

Out hunting the other day I shot a very odd looking duck, think it may be a cross between a mallard and a gadwall. Since we never get any gadwall out my way I'm not sure, its so gray looking and smaller than a mallard which you can see in one of the pictures the hen mallard right next to it. Would love to hear what others may think of this hybrid duck.

OddDuck1.JPG
This is the duck next to a hen mallard
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OddDuck2.JPG
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OddDuck3.JPG
OddDuck3.JPG (115.25 KiB) Viewed 1419 times

OddDuck4.JPG
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OddDuck5.JPG
OddDuck5.JPG (130.44 KiB) Viewed 1419 times
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Re: Odd Duck ID Need Help

Postby SafetyAlwaysOff » Sun Dec 02, 2012 11:59 am

Think that's just a young drake not fully plummed
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Re: Odd Duck ID Need Help

Postby goldfish » Sun Dec 02, 2012 12:01 pm

You shot a baby!

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Re: Odd Duck ID Need Help

Postby The Duck Hammer » Sun Dec 02, 2012 12:56 pm

juvenile drake
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Indaswamp wrote:easy...just manipulate the ruler to make the inch shorter so that 28" reads 30"..... :thumbsup:

That's how I got a 13" pecker.
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Re: Odd Duck ID Need Help

Postby STEVE IN SOCAL » Sun Dec 02, 2012 1:12 pm

So THAT'S where all the ducks are...they haven't hatched yet.
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Re: Odd Duck ID Need Help

Postby Pete-pec » Sun Dec 02, 2012 3:06 pm

I'm thinking it's a bit of a cross with a mallard and black duck. The bill says drake, and the olive color says black. Combine that with the head that resembles a hen or a black, and I still think more about the black duck mix. The very small tail curl looks like what you see with a black/mallard mix, and pay attention to the speculum. Even a juvenile will have white band above and below the color that is much more defined. This bird's wing resembles a black more than a mallard in this aspect. If I was to take it further, I'd guess it was a second generation duck. Such as a cross duck that bread back to a mallard, and this was the offspring. Add to it that it's an east coast duck full of mallard/black duck mutts, and I would be pretty sure there was some of both species in this bird. Whether or not it's a juvie, I don't know, but young bird or eclipse this time of year seems like a stretch?
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Re: Odd Duck ID Need Help

Postby HuntsCTRiver » Sun Dec 02, 2012 4:36 pm

yeah, I agree with pete, I haven't seen a drake in eclipse plumage in quite some time. I do like the theory of it being a second generation bred back to a mallard
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Re: Odd Duck ID Need Help

Postby rebelp74 » Sun Dec 02, 2012 4:39 pm

It does have a white band above and below the speculum look at the first pic. Its a juvie mallard drake.
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jaysweet3 wrote:Looks a little small.

Dat's what She said....


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Re: Odd Duck ID Need Help

Postby Pete-pec » Sun Dec 02, 2012 4:47 pm

Defined white line above and below? No. It's trailing edge is that of a black duck. remember, it's a mutt, not a full black nor a full mallard. Furthermore your duck identification is a bit off if you think (juvie or not) that this wing is a pure mallard's wing.
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mallard duck wing.jpg
black duck wing.jpg
Last edited by Pete-pec on Sun Dec 02, 2012 4:49 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Odd Duck ID Need Help

Postby rebelp74 » Sun Dec 02, 2012 4:49 pm

The hen with has the same white lines
http://www.bing.com/images/search?q=juv ... 6B&first=1
Last edited by rebelp74 on Sun Dec 02, 2012 4:54 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Indaswamp wrote:
jaysweet3 wrote:Looks a little small.

Dat's what She said....


Underradar wrote:We, the unsigned members of the HH, are not allowed to address such questions. But thank you for asking.
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Re: Odd Duck ID Need Help

Postby Pete-pec » Sun Dec 02, 2012 4:53 pm

Then our eyes work differently? A defined white line like the two photos I posted. I'm not going to argue about what you and I both feel is the right answer. You think your right, and I know I am, that's the difference. :yes:

And who really cares. I was just trying to educate, but if you can't listen to reasoning, the argument is pointless.

Good luck!

This duck was shot on the east coast (cold climate). Eclipse? Come on man? And your example helps my opinion even more if you pay attention to the head and wing. The wing will not change because it's in eclipse or it's a juvie. A mallard wing is a mallard wing, and there is zero green in the example in the original post.
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Re: Odd Duck ID Need Help

Postby reel_time » Sun Dec 02, 2012 5:56 pm

A couple years ago, we killed a mallard absent of feather pigment and it still had the purple band on the wing. I vote it's a juvenile mallard, bit who cares. A uniquely colored duck nonetheless. Good bird either way. Tough call.

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Re: Odd Duck ID Need Help

Postby rebelp74 » Sun Dec 02, 2012 6:00 pm

Pete-pec wrote:Then our eyes work differently? A defined white line like the two photos I posted. I'm not going to argue about what you and I both feel is the right answer. You think your right, and I know I am, that's the difference. :yes:

And who really cares. I was just trying to educate, but if you can't listen to reasoning, the argument is pointless.

Good luck!

This duck was shot on the east coast (cold climate). Eclipse? Come on man? And your example helps my opinion even more if you pay attention to the head and wing. The wing will not change because it's in eclipse or it's a juvie. A mallard wing is a mallard wing, and there is zero green in the example in the original post.

Dude I wasn't trying to argue, just stating my opinion and what I see. I agree who cares, it's not a big deal at all. Everyone on here is just trying to help the guy i.d. his duck in their own opinion. Sorry that I made you feel that way. To each their own. Good luck hunting this year.
Did the duck have many pin feathers on it, if so more than likely a juvie?
Indaswamp wrote:
jaysweet3 wrote:Looks a little small.

Dat's what She said....


Underradar wrote:We, the unsigned members of the HH, are not allowed to address such questions. But thank you for asking.
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Re: Odd Duck ID Need Help

Postby Pete-pec » Sun Dec 02, 2012 7:03 pm

Just because I'm OCD, I have to show two links that show wing identification from the USGS website. I just think the wings here in these links, and the bird in question will show anyone with eyes (that see) that this bird is not pure mallard. I could certainly buy color mutation, but I've shot so many mutt mallard/black ducks in so many variations that I feel this is just another example. I also want to add that the black duck is in trouble, along with the Florida Mottled, the Hawaiian Mallard, the Mexican mallard and the gulf coast mottled. The common mallard is interbreeding with all these sub species, and mixing the gene pool. Now which duck came first, is still a huge debate. They all have mallard characteristics, and all may have originated from the mallard, but there are numerous mutts across the country. Speaking from experience, I have shot several mutts here in Wisconsin, as well as the East coast. This duck may be a first year bird or juvenile as so many people are saying, but without a doubt, it is not pure mallard. When you mix two birds, you get a combination of the two. Now if you add to the mix that these mutts will breed with other mutts or pure black, or pure mallard, you will get several variations. Normally speaking a pure mallard crossed with a pure black duck will normally have a very dark chestnut colored breast, a slightly curled tail feather, and a slightly green head that has been confused for an eclipse bird in way too many forums to count. This is in reference to an adult mix in full plumage. Now if this bird is a young bird, the colors will not be as prominent, and add to it that it may be an offspring of a mutt who may or may not have bred back to one of the original breeds, you will certainly have different variations.

http://www.npwrc.usgs.gov/resource/bird ... allard.htm

http://www.npwrc.usgs.gov/resource/bird ... mblack.htm
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Re: Odd Duck ID Need Help

Postby rebelp74 » Sun Dec 02, 2012 7:08 pm

I'm not saying your wrong. Not every duck looks perfectly identical even in the same species espicailly when younger. As far as mallards cross breeding, they also cross breed with pintails. I have one that I got mounted.
Indaswamp wrote:
jaysweet3 wrote:Looks a little small.

Dat's what She said....


Underradar wrote:We, the unsigned members of the HH, are not allowed to address such questions. But thank you for asking.
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Re: Odd Duck ID Need Help

Postby Pete-pec » Sun Dec 02, 2012 7:42 pm

I'm just not a fan of the mallard X black duck. Probably because it's the most common cross breed, and it's played havoc with the purity of the two separate species. I wouldn't consider it a trophy even if in awesome plumage, and not a bird I would mount, but I think mounted by a professional, they look nice, and to each his own. I do have a black duck mounted with a blonde (leucistic) hen mallard I did for myself. The two were shot from my blind on the same day here in Wisconsin, and I thought it fitting to mount them both to show off their contrasting colors, and I call the piece Ebony and Ivory. The black duck has the slightest tinge of green in its head (almost unnoticeable), but it's a long distant mutt that no one would ever notice but me, but it indeed has some mallard in its distant gene pool. There was a study being done several years back trying to find out if there are any "PURE" black ducks left? Not sure what came of it, but it was being done on the East coast, and I believe New York?

Now that mallard pintail cross you have is far less common. I would love to have one in my collection. I'd like to see a picture of yours, as I'm a hobbyist bird taxidermist, and can appreciate a nice mount.

Between the wood duck and mallard, those two birds are pretty horny, and would nail a crow if it would sit still long enough, so I'm very aware of how prolific the mallard can be.
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Re: Odd Duck ID Need Help

Postby mngreenheadkilla » Sun Dec 02, 2012 7:51 pm

I agree w/ pete, there is so much interbreeding its really hard to say. At first glance it looks like a juvie drake, but that would have be like a 5th hatch haha. And you have to look at the speculum too...Anyways...... More amazing is shooting a black and blonde in the same day in WI!! Thats amazing, I wouldve mounted them as well!! Also i have seen pics of mallard/pintails and would give about anything for a full plume drake. Lets see a pic of those!
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Re: Odd Duck ID Need Help

Postby rebelp74 » Sun Dec 02, 2012 7:53 pm

I'm not sure how to upload pics on these threads but I have uploaded it on the web before. Shoot me a pm of your email and I will send you a pic of it.
Indaswamp wrote:
jaysweet3 wrote:Looks a little small.

Dat's what She said....


Underradar wrote:We, the unsigned members of the HH, are not allowed to address such questions. But thank you for asking.
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Re: Odd Duck ID Need Help

Postby Pete-pec » Sun Dec 02, 2012 8:07 pm

So easy to upload, I'll will walk you through it. Click on upload attachment (blue box below when you add to a thread). Then choose file from you computer, and click add file, and it will be there. You can place in line.
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Re: Odd Duck ID Need Help

Postby rebelp74 » Sun Dec 02, 2012 8:38 pm

These are some of what I had on my phone, I'm at work right now and will post more when I can get a chance if ya'll want. I've got alot of birds and other animals mounted.
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mandarin duck.jpg
This is a mandarin duck I shot in Thailand. Thought ya'll may like it too.
mandarin duck.jpg (27.48 KiB) Viewed 1181 times
mallardpintail dec 27 2009.jpg
This is the mallard/pintail mix
Indaswamp wrote:
jaysweet3 wrote:Looks a little small.

Dat's what She said....


Underradar wrote:We, the unsigned members of the HH, are not allowed to address such questions. But thank you for asking.
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Re: Odd Duck ID Need Help

Postby rebelp74 » Sun Dec 02, 2012 8:41 pm

Pete-pec wrote:So easy to upload, I'll will walk you through it. Click on upload attachment (blue box below when you add to a thread). Then choose file from you computer, and click add file, and it will be there. You can place in line.

I feel dumb not seeing that, I thought it was some kind of code you had put in or something like on one of those social sites. thanks for helping with that.
Indaswamp wrote:
jaysweet3 wrote:Looks a little small.

Dat's what She said....


Underradar wrote:We, the unsigned members of the HH, are not allowed to address such questions. But thank you for asking.
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Re: Odd Duck ID Need Help

Postby Pete-pec » Sun Dec 02, 2012 8:43 pm

Are you serious about the Mandarin? That would be fantastic to shoot a non native species like a mandarin in its native habitat.

The pintail/mallard is gorgeous!
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Re: Odd Duck ID Need Help

Postby rebelp74 » Sun Dec 02, 2012 8:46 pm

Thanks. Yea my wife is from Thailand the northwestern part of the Song province, her dad took me it was awesome.
Indaswamp wrote:
jaysweet3 wrote:Looks a little small.

Dat's what She said....


Underradar wrote:We, the unsigned members of the HH, are not allowed to address such questions. But thank you for asking.
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