7.5 or 8

Trap, Skeet, Sporting Clays; pistol/rifle target shooting, to plinking cans with a bb gun.

Moderator: waterfowlhunter

7.5 or 8

Postby waterfowlhunter » Sat Mar 02, 2013 12:17 pm

I have been shooting 7.5's for many years but I am now out of 7.5 shot and have 6 bags of #8 to use. SO I loaded some up and was surprised that I can still easily break 40 and even 55 yard (known set distance of a few targets on the "hard" course) targets as easily as I could with 7.5's. I like 1200fps 1-1/8 oz loads for sporting clays and I was just wondering if anyone knows the max distance you can get consistant breaks on clays with #8's. I have been under the opinion that you needed 7.5's for the longer shots but that just does not seem to be the case or did I just get lucky this time.

Browning 725 with LM and IC chokes. I do not change chokes at every station and have found that these work best for the "average" sporting clays course.
"A free people ought to be armed" George Washington 1790

‘For those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither Liberty nor safety.’ —Ben Franklin.”
User avatar
waterfowlhunter
Forum & State Moderator
 
Posts: 3703
Joined: Thu Oct 14, 2004 4:53 am
Location: Linden, MI


Re: 7.5 or 8

Postby 3200 man » Sat Mar 02, 2013 2:13 pm

Well out to 40----45 the odds are in your favor with 8's but , when you say 55 they go down hill from there . It just depends
on the angle of the target on impact , if you have a edge on target you'll see a lot of dust but no chip . This is compounded if
the weather is cold making the targets even harder . I use a rule of inside 35 8's , outside 35 71/2's . I also like a LM choke
for most targets but , anything pass 40 I going with a IM or tighter choke .

3200

OH and as far as speed goes , you get the best patterns with slower loads so ,you're right on the money with what you use !
Just keep in mind to use your chokes accordingly for a denser pattern .
3200 man
hunter
 
Posts: 2540
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2009 10:30 am

Re: 7.5 or 8

Postby Sagebrush » Sat Mar 02, 2013 10:44 pm

I have a different out look on lead pellets than most shooters. I go for field data on what it takes to kill Quail
with .55 ft/lbs of energy...................

A #8 magnun pellet ( not chilled ) at 1090 has a max yardage of 48 yards.
At 1145 fps it will work to 50 yards and at 1200 fps it can reach out to 53 yards.
Hard to beleive but the "HOT" 1oz load at 1290 fps is only good to 55 yards

I have broken clays at the Trap 16 yard line with 1oz 8's at 1180 fps on a Oakley shot, just before the clay hits the ground
60 yards away,just for giggles but the pattern is spread out big time and I would back it up to 50 yards to increase my odds
on consistant hits,if you have had lots of practice and know what you are doing.

Also you need a good choke that patterns well for you with the loads that you are using and the distance shot at.......not even
an ace shot can do well if the patterns in his gun suck................and most shooters are happy to break birds at 40 yards in the clays game,with all the different angles and speeds presented.

I like #8's to the 23 yard line,thats about 45 yards on most shots and after that I switch over to 7 1/2's if windy or the weather is below 48 degrees for more energy, to break the birds. Today I shot 1oz loads of #8 at 1150fps on the 16 yard line and smoked 25 clays straight at 36 to 40 yards away,(16.5grs of RedDot), but this is a better skeet load than a field or clays load due to the
minimum energy but you've got to love the light recoil !!
User avatar
Sagebrush
hunter
 
Posts: 4719
Joined: Mon Oct 03, 2005 10:28 pm
Location: Reno Nev.

Re: 7.5 or 8

Postby War Wagon » Sun Mar 03, 2013 6:53 am

I have shot Trap since 1969, for the longest time I thought that you had to use 7.5's for Caps. Then on year at our State Shoot I ran a 98x100 from the 27yd line with 8's. Put that idea in the trash can .
User avatar
War Wagon
hunter
 
Posts: 962
Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2011 7:23 pm
Location: Green Bay Wisconsin

Re: 7.5 or 8

Postby 3200 man » Sun Mar 03, 2013 7:02 am

That's some good shooting SAGE , knowing what your gun ,choke and load will do at extended range takes experience on the
patterning board . A couple years ago ,I shot with Jon Kruger at Dessert Lakes in Henderson, Nv . I was surprised to see him
shooting 1 oz of 8 1/2's at all the targets on the course ,now he did change chokes at different stations and the results were the
same , Broken targets . Not all were smoke balls but dead birds . After talking to him about his shell load of choice , I got an
answer of ,these shells I'm shooting have hard-shot and at the elevation we are shooting and the targets presentations this course
is showing us , all the targets are giving us a lot of belly or dome exposure .The other targets that are on edge are less than 30
yds so , with his changing chokes at these station to give him a more dense pattern 95 percent of them were smoke balls too !
I had a hard-time disagreeing with him because ,he shot a 99 and I didn't come close to that !

3200
3200 man
hunter
 
Posts: 2540
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2009 10:30 am

Re: 7.5 or 8

Postby waterfowlhunter » Sun Mar 03, 2013 8:37 am

I tried 9's about a month ago for the first time on Sproting clay. Used them in a Skeet choke on some 20-25yd targets. Got to love seeing nothing but dust from a target :biggrin: I had to switch to the 7.5's on the longer birds because the 9's were not getting the job done even @ 1300fps (AA sporting clays factory load). I just loaded up 250 rounds of #8's with green dot @ 1200fps. I will see how these do compared to my 7.5's next weekend. I can not tell the difference in recoil from 1 oz to 1-1/8 loads at all. Shooting 100 rounds a weekend is not much but i have tried 1oz loads and did not notice any difference at all in my O/U's. I can not shoot 1oz in my SBE II's or Legacy reliably but 1-1/8oz has so little recoil I just stick with them.
"A free people ought to be armed" George Washington 1790

‘For those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither Liberty nor safety.’ —Ben Franklin.”
User avatar
waterfowlhunter
Forum & State Moderator
 
Posts: 3703
Joined: Thu Oct 14, 2004 4:53 am
Location: Linden, MI

Re: 7.5 or 8

Postby Sagebrush » Sun Mar 03, 2013 9:45 pm

Warwagon;
I have tried mag 8's in winAA,Rem sts and Federal gold medal hulls with reddot,e3,unique,Universal clays,clays and
even greendot........................from 1165 to 1250 fps with flush full, brieley full ,extended full and a turkey choke.

My auto and O/U will not get better than 94/100 on a calm summer day, I even gave them two tries on 4/7/12 and on
2/19/13 and TF & BF with my Briley chokes got 21/25 and 23/25 at the 27 yard line. I like the idea of added pellets but for some odd reason they don't work for me. Maybe it the new style of clays they have switched to the last two years,because you can see dust come off the birds and they just keep on going.

Good shooting guys.............
User avatar
Sagebrush
hunter
 
Posts: 4719
Joined: Mon Oct 03, 2005 10:28 pm
Location: Reno Nev.

Re: 7.5 or 8

Postby 3200 man » Mon Mar 04, 2013 8:47 am

SAGE , I'm sure you are well aware of the cold target effect that ,small shot has to deal with . A one ounce load at ,beyond ,23
yds on the trap field is a poke an hope load . I grant you they can be very effective on sporting clay targets ,that are not on edge ,
but with shot that is soft , it does make a lot of dust but no chips ! I guess a guy can crank-up the horse power , though ?
3200 man
hunter
 
Posts: 2540
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2009 10:30 am

Re: 7.5 or 8

Postby Sagebrush » Mon Mar 04, 2013 11:08 am

I tried cranking up the 1oz load of #8's to 1310 fps on the sporting clays field and shot a 58/100..........worst score that I ever shot,for some odd reason..... this same load at 1250 fps did 84/100 on a windy Spring day,last year.

As for trap and adding more powder to the 8's........................a 7 1/2 at 1145fps is equal to a #8 at 1200fps, so I just load a 7 1/2 at 1200 for the extra energys and call it a day.

Four days ago I shot a Federal GM hull with a f290a and 20gr of GreenDot that the book list at 1200 fps but it felt more like 1230 fps + to me with the heavier than normal recoil. I will put it across the chrony next chance that I get........... It did do well though, 24/25 at tthe 25 yard line ,after I added some space between the to beads on the barrel. A standard cheak preassure with the "figure 8 stacked bead" did not workout with this load. Could have also been due to the birds coming out of the house,higher than normal too ?

Just for giggles I am going to try 1 1/8oz of 7 1/2's at 1145fps for everything this season,for a while..............(except my trap shoots & skeet ) just to see what happens. God knows,that I have tried everything else !!

later.
User avatar
Sagebrush
hunter
 
Posts: 4719
Joined: Mon Oct 03, 2005 10:28 pm
Location: Reno Nev.

Re: 7.5 or 8

Postby 3200 man » Mon Mar 04, 2013 12:17 pm

There are top guns shooting 2 3/4 gram loads at most all target events and it comes down to ,if you know your gun and chokes
abilities ,a target can't really get away from you . If King George can break targets at 115 yds with a 2 3/4" shell , we shouldn't
worry about not having enough for 60 yd targets ?
Like the old saying goes ,it's not the arrow or the bow ?
3200 man
hunter
 
Posts: 2540
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2009 10:30 am

Re: 7.5 or 8

Postby War Wagon » Mon Mar 04, 2013 9:06 pm

I was shooting Winchester factory 8's in the silver hull. A 3 dram load. I call them "Rockets" Gun I'm using is a Browning Citori Combo. 34" unsingle with a Hastings #11 choke. The gun is shooting at 80/20.
User avatar
War Wagon
hunter
 
Posts: 962
Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2011 7:23 pm
Location: Green Bay Wisconsin

Re: 7.5 or 8

Postby 3200 man » Tue Mar 05, 2013 7:43 am

WW , I'm sure you are a quick shooter , one that goes Pull-Bang , with a 80/20 set-up ? We fellas that shoot Sporting

as well as hunt with our guns , shoot a gun set-up more like 60/40 . We have learned to lead a target in all directions

of it's flite no matter if the wind is blowing or the target is hopping along on the ground . I do understand , what works

best for you , is the way to go ,though !

Those HHA's in 8's are a fine load ,until you get back on the fence in cold weather or have very low targets on edge !
3200 man
hunter
 
Posts: 2540
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2009 10:30 am

Re: 7.5 or 8

Postby Force Fetch » Tue Mar 05, 2013 6:09 pm

Let us not over thing the shot size thing. I can remember the same discussions between 7's and 71/2's then 8's when they became common. I am old enough to remember discussions if plastic hulls were better than paper and visa versa. Unless you are shooting at the upper level of the shotgun sports it will not make a difference.
Choke, sufficient loads, gun fit, and proper form will equalize the difference in shot size at standard clay targets at normal ranges.
Someone in an earlier post mentioned cold targets, and I used to pick my shot size for winter shooting by the temps, and dispelled that rumor a couple of winters ago. -10 at a meat shoot 27yd targets. I thought I grabbed a box of 7 1/2's and shot well and won some meat. When I got home I discovered they were some 81/2's I had loaded 16.9 gr Red Dot Windjammer (blue) wads 209 Win. primers I had loaded for Skeet Spring League. Whooda thunk!
Head Down and Keep Swinging Wayne
Force Fetch
hunter
 
Posts: 548
Joined: Wed Nov 01, 2006 3:39 pm
Location: Great Falls MT

Re: 7.5 or 8

Postby 3200 man » Tue Mar 05, 2013 9:23 pm

Force Fetch ,

With a user name like that and being long in the tooth ( like me ) , we have seen some interesting things going on . So ,I
would like to add a little something to what you have experienced . When we look at a choke patterning chart , we see the
distance chokes are designed to throw a 30" pattern , Right ? So , if a full choke is capable of a 70 to 75 % pattern at 40 yds
but , a back fence target is shot at 52 to 54 yds , normally , things get pretty thin at that distance . What would you say the
chances are of multiple hits or shot close enough that has enough energy to break that target are ? When I said Cold target
effect , I've also shot target at 40 yds and had them go off at bastard angles after being hit with 8's . To each their own ,I
want big high energy shot in my loads for on edge targets .I would rather have the odds in my favor ,if only being hit by 1,2
or 3 pellets .

3200
3200 man
hunter
 
Posts: 2540
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2009 10:30 am

Re: 7.5 or 8

Postby waterfowlhunter » Wed Mar 06, 2013 5:10 am

This is an interesting link I just found. It gives choke recomendation for each target size, type and presentation. under the choke graphic is a bar indicating shot size. http://www.briley.com/sportingclayschart.aspx
"A free people ought to be armed" George Washington 1790

‘For those who would give up essential liberty to purchase a little temporary safety, deserve neither Liberty nor safety.’ —Ben Franklin.”
User avatar
waterfowlhunter
Forum & State Moderator
 
Posts: 3703
Joined: Thu Oct 14, 2004 4:53 am
Location: Linden, MI

Re: 7.5 or 8

Postby 3200 man » Wed Mar 06, 2013 7:58 am

Thanks for the chart ,the Ash's know what the Big Dogs shoot and what the percentages are for choke/shot-size .
Hell if I have a choice of ammo , I shoot 8.5's inside 35 yds and 7.5's beyond depending on target angle too ! As
long as your gun is choked right and the shot is hard ,not soft , it puts the percentage in your favor .
3200 man
hunter
 
Posts: 2540
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2009 10:30 am

Re: 7.5 or 8

Postby Force Fetch » Wed Mar 06, 2013 11:37 am

3200, when I have an opportunity and stay legal within the rules of the game, I try to put the odds in my favor. My favorite long range or bunker load out of my MX8 live bird gun is Winchester International Pigeons 1 1/4 7 1/2's 3 1/4 dram. The gun loves them and I like em. I am glad I bought the last 5 flats I could find and use them only at field trials for Spaniels and a few clay games, they may have to last me till my shooting days are done. I understand they are no longer made.
In my reloads I use Lawrence Mag shot which is hard and don't mess with the softer stuff so I don't probably know the problems people have with soft shot.
Just sayn!
Force Fetch
hunter
 
Posts: 548
Joined: Wed Nov 01, 2006 3:39 pm
Location: Great Falls MT

Re: 7.5 or 8

Postby 3200 man » Wed Mar 06, 2013 2:23 pm

Force Fetch , I shoot a few Super Pigeon loads myself ( 36g of nickel 7's ) Fiocchi's and they do kick the crap out of me , even
though my MX 12 has been fitted to me with a ISIS recoil system . This Fiocchi load is a meat grinder on birds so ,with my upland
bird hunting I load my own recipe of hard lead shot . I also shoot some re-claimed lead shot on birds ( Quail ,Doves,Snipe and Barn
Pigeons ) and it does a fine job .

OH Yea Crow , yes I've known to crow too ! LOL
3200 man
hunter
 
Posts: 2540
Joined: Thu Nov 12, 2009 10:30 am

Re: 7.5 or 8

Postby Force Fetch » Wed Mar 06, 2013 3:23 pm

3200, the Fiocchi 7's are probably what my MX8 was patterened with at the factory, I have the sheets. It seems that the european loads either kick like the bejesus or have soft recoil like the BP's that are popular at Spaniel Trials yet have lots of knock down .
I am sure it has a lot to do with the wad being used. I am too damn cheap to cut one apart to satisfy something I cannot make a difference in so I shoot what works.
Happy Shooting
Wayne
Force Fetch
hunter
 
Posts: 548
Joined: Wed Nov 01, 2006 3:39 pm
Location: Great Falls MT

Re: 7.5 or 8

Postby Sagebrush » Wed Mar 06, 2013 11:24 pm

My reclaimed #8 has a little bit of everything.....9's to 7 and some steel.............but it works great in my 7/8 and 1oz loads out to 35 yards for my skeet and practice loads at the 16 yard line.
Lots of dings and flat sides here and there but it still has a good enough pattern to break birds. Only thing,if I miss a bird,I don't know if it was the shot,pattern or me ! ? :eek:

Finally almost done with my e3 loads......it is clean and good for the 7/8 and 1oz loads but let me down with the 1 1/8oz HDCP loads. RedDot same thing but not as clean. Got to tweek my GreenDot load for the HDCP.......50 straight last outting in the Rem STS hull........... still trying to get the Federal Gold Medal to go 50 at the 27 yard line. Have been using "Stock" components but might have to try a Downrange "Virgin"wad or soft CB's to see if I can get the numbers.

later.
User avatar
Sagebrush
hunter
 
Posts: 4719
Joined: Mon Oct 03, 2005 10:28 pm
Location: Reno Nev.

Re: 7.5 or 8

Postby Sagebrush » Thu Mar 28, 2013 10:42 am

Well I did it............

Broke 25 straight with 8's at the 25 yard line with the DRRF8 wad and 18.2grs of RedDot powder today.........
even in 15mph gust at my back, that had the clays dropping, turning and even a riser now and then.

I might have to change my cheek pressure on a good warm day with no wind, though.
Maybe there is hope ??

Funny how a different powder and wad can shoot different out of your guns.
User avatar
Sagebrush
hunter
 
Posts: 4719
Joined: Mon Oct 03, 2005 10:28 pm
Location: Reno Nev.

Re: 7.5 or 8

Postby CurlyChessie » Sun Nov 24, 2013 8:45 pm

I shoot 9s....combination of 5s and 4s :wink: haha well they wont let you shoot those or 6s sooooo 7 1/2s will have to do for now...
CurlyChessie
hunter
 
Posts: 27
Joined: Sun Nov 24, 2013 8:38 pm


Return to Target Shooting

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest