Thoughts on Sitka Water fowl gear

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Re: Thoughts on Sitka Water fowl gear

Postby Idaho Mike » Sat Dec 07, 2013 5:07 pm

Your welcome Rod & Merry Christmas to you too! :beer:
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Re: Thoughts on Sitka Water fowl gear

Postby CurlyChessie » Sat Dec 07, 2013 7:52 pm

Thoughts on any Sitka gear, over priced and over rated!
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Re: Thoughts on Sitka Water fowl gear

Postby sim559 » Sat Dec 07, 2013 8:59 pm

Man I biting my tongue
Hope your hunt is good and warm
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Re: Thoughts on Sitka Water fowl gear

Postby Idaho Mike » Sun Dec 08, 2013 12:19 am

CurlyChessie wrote:Thoughts on any Sitka gear, over priced and over rated!


If you've never used it you have NO CLUE what your talking about :no:
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Re: Thoughts on Sitka Water fowl gear

Postby Yuchi1 » Sun Dec 08, 2013 12:29 pm

I shoot nice shotguns and HS/TI ammo and really like being warm & dry.

I also like stuff that has stood the test of time as well as the test of common sense.

Wool and waxed cotton are among those type of items.

I have yet to see anything of Chinese manufacture that isn't designed to be cheap (in both, quality and price) as their hallmark is low labor costs, over all else making their products fit the throw-away mentality so endemic today.

My Cabela's and Columbia stuff are chinese manufacture and work well within their limitations as remember, all Gore-Tex products can/will fail to keep you dry, at some point. Lean up against a tree in greentimber and your Gore-Tex will suck moisture back to your skin at each and every point of contact. Get some mud/debris on it and the same will occur at those contact points as well.

Waxed cotton or rubber coatings on garments are the only items that truly stop moisture from getting through to the wearer.

The products referenced in the OP may be superior to my Cabela's/Columbia apparell however, the test of time (for their waterfowl gear) seems to be in it's infancy and as such, I suspect the promoters may be using a lot of lipstick at this stage of the game?
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Re: Thoughts on Sitka Water fowl gear

Postby sim559 » Sun Dec 08, 2013 1:03 pm

I am also a chain saw dealer for 2 top brands. Been that way for more than 40 years.
I also sell Gun accessories. Been to a few shows and have talked to Manufactures. The problem With Chinese goods is how they are directed by the US designers. If the designer tells them which materials to use and how to make the item they will make it that way.
As a result you get a large variation in quality. Some is pure junk and others are the best possible. I see this with aftermarket cylinder kits, Sun Optics and Sitka Gear. There are some cylinder kits that will last a very short time and others that are as good as OEM. Sun Optics can stand up to anything you can throw at them.
I have yet to get wet in a rain wearing my coldfront items. I have not fell a sleep while leaning on a wet tree so the next time I find a wet tree, I will give it a try
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Re: Thoughts on Sitka Water fowl gear

Postby Yuchi1 » Sun Dec 08, 2013 6:00 pm

sim559 wrote:I am also a chain saw dealer for 2 top brands. Been that way for more than 40 years.
I also sell Gun accessories. Been to a few shows and have talked to Manufactures. The problem With Chinese goods is how they are directed by the US designers. If the designer tells them which materials to use and how to make the item they will make it that way.
As a result you get a large variation in quality. Some is pure junk and others are the best possible. I see this with aftermarket cylinder kits, Sun Optics and Sitka Gear. There are some cylinder kits that will last a very short time and others that are as good as OEM. Sun Optics can stand up to anything you can throw at them.
I have yet to get wet in a rain wearing my coldfront items. I have not fell a sleep while leaning on a wet tree so the next time I find a wet tree, I will give it a try


You won't have to fall asleep as it takes only a couple minutes for the moisture to wick backwards.

Breathable membrane fabrics are designed to be breathable so anything that compromises that facet, so compromises the fabric's function.

IMO, chinese manufacturing is very similar to the south-of-the-border textile industry QC track record in that they're willing to take a high level of low QC because of the corresponding low labor costs. A lot of american companies are now going back to US based manufacture (i.e., ferrous metals) because on the pizz-poor QC of the chinese stuff. No matter how it is spun, you simply cannot pick up a turd by the clean end.

Let's face the facts...when chinese mothers will not buy domestically made baby formula because it's poison, that speaks volumes.

BTW, I don't buy chinese toothpaste either as anti-freeze belongs in the radiator, not my mouth.
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Re: Thoughts on Sitka Water fowl gear

Postby Copper mushroom » Sun Dec 08, 2013 8:23 pm

A little late to this thread but will offer my nickles worth. I do not own any Sitka waterfowl gear but I do use 100% Sitka on my DIY backcountry elk bowhunts. As others have said it is very expensive, however so is my SBE II and my dog Sturm; - being 15 miles from the nearest road with everything for 9 days on my back I feel that the quality warrants me saving for a year to buy it. Do I use this stuff on my whitetail hunts that take place on my farm? No way. You can buy warm and quiet gear to suffice in these conditions for 1/3 the price. But when climbing 5000 vertical feet before dawn and doing the reverse at night I feel the Sitka moisture (sweat) management properties are top notch.

Not in the market for any new waterfowl gear but to the OP - I would gladly give you a field report should you send me an outfit. 6'2" 200lbs.........
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Re: Thoughts on Sitka Water fowl gear

Postby sim559 » Sun Dec 08, 2013 8:28 pm

I think it is time for Sitka Gear to step in and give their thoughts.
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Re: Thoughts on Sitka Water fowl gear

Postby Tim Terrell » Mon Dec 09, 2013 3:49 pm

Yuchi1 wrote:
sim559 wrote:I am also a chain saw dealer for 2 top brands. Been that way for more than 40 years.
I also sell Gun accessories. Been to a few shows and have talked to Manufactures. The problem With Chinese goods is how they are directed by the US designers. If the designer tells them which materials to use and how to make the item they will make it that way.
As a result you get a large variation in quality. Some is pure junk and others are the best possible. I see this with aftermarket cylinder kits, Sun Optics and Sitka Gear. There are some cylinder kits that will last a very short time and others that are as good as OEM. Sun Optics can stand up to anything you can throw at them.
I have yet to get wet in a rain wearing my coldfront items. I have not fell a sleep while leaning on a wet tree so the next time I find a wet tree, I will give it a try


You won't have to fall asleep as it takes only a couple minutes for the moisture to wick backwards.

Breathable membrane fabrics are designed to be breathable so anything that compromises that facet, so compromises the fabric's function.

IMO, chinese manufacturing is very similar to the south-of-the-border textile industry QC track record in that they're willing to take a high level of low QC because of the corresponding low labor costs. A lot of american companies are now going back to US based manufacture (i.e., ferrous metals) because on the pizz-poor QC of the chinese stuff. No matter how it is spun, you simply cannot pick up a turd by the clean end.

Let's face the facts...when chinese mothers will not buy domestically made baby formula because it's poison, that speaks volumes.

BTW, I don't buy chinese toothpaste either as anti-freeze belongs in the radiator, not my mouth.



... says the 'expert' wearing waxed freakin' cotton.
TOO funny.
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Re: Thoughts on Sitka Water fowl gear

Postby sim559 » Mon Dec 09, 2013 4:40 pm

I would think a wax coating would make it very damp on the inside. Kind of like the old yellow rain coat we had as kids. Might be able to grow mushrooms in there.
Gore tex has 9 billions pours per square inch and they are directional in size small enough to let water vapor out and not let water in.
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Re: Thoughts on Sitka Water fowl gear

Postby Frylock » Mon Dec 09, 2013 6:23 pm

Yuchi1 wrote:I shoot nice shotguns and HS/TI ammo and really like being warm & dry.

I also like stuff that has stood the test of time as well as the test of common sense.

Wool and waxed cotton are among those type of items.

I have yet to see anything of Chinese manufacture that isn't designed to be cheap (in both, quality and price) as their hallmark is low labor costs, over all else making their products fit the throw-away mentality so endemic today.

My Cabela's and Columbia stuff are chinese manufacture and work well within their limitations as remember, all Gore-Tex products can/will fail to keep you dry, at some point. Lean up against a tree in greentimber and your Gore-Tex will suck moisture back to your skin at each and every point of contact. Get some mud/debris on it and the same will occur at those contact points as well.

Waxed cotton or rubber coatings on garments are the only items that truly stop moisture from getting through to the wearer.

The products referenced in the OP may be superior to my Cabela's/Columbia apparell however, the test of time (for their waterfowl gear) seems to be in it's infancy and as such, I suspect the promoters may be using a lot of lipstick at this stage of the game?

You have no clue what you're talking about! Funny how when I sit down while wearing my gore tex waders my rear end never gets wet, the only thing compromised is your brain.
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Re: Thoughts on Sitka Water fowl gear

Postby Yuchi1 » Mon Dec 09, 2013 10:13 pm

sim559 wrote:I would think a wax coating would make it very damp on the inside. Kind of like the old yellow rain coat we had as kids. Might be able to grow mushrooms in there.
Gore tex has 9 billions pours per square inch and they are directional in size small enough to let water vapor out and not let water in.


That's where the wool comes in as it provides a barrier plus, it will keep you warm even when wet something the Scots found out centuries ago. Many of the synthetics won't function that way so hopefully, you're wearing a bright orange PFD...makes it much easier to locate the body.
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Re: Thoughts on Sitka Water fowl gear

Postby Yuchi1 » Mon Dec 09, 2013 10:44 pm

Frylock wrote:
Yuchi1 wrote:I shoot nice shotguns and HS/TI ammo and really like being warm & dry.

I also like stuff that has stood the test of time as well as the test of common sense.

Wool and waxed cotton are among those type of items.

I have yet to see anything of Chinese manufacture that isn't designed to be cheap (in both, quality and price) as their hallmark is low labor costs, over all else making their products fit the throw-away mentality so endemic today.

My Cabela's and Columbia stuff are chinese manufacture and work well within their limitations as remember, all Gore-Tex products can/will fail to keep you dry, at some point. Lean up against a tree in greentimber and your Gore-Tex will suck moisture back to your skin at each and every point of contact. Get some mud/debris on it and the same will occur at those contact points as well.

Waxed cotton or rubber coatings on garments are the only items that truly stop moisture from getting through to the wearer.

The products referenced in the OP may be superior to my Cabela's/Columbia apparell however, the test of time (for their waterfowl gear) seems to be in it's infancy and as such, I suspect the promoters may be using a lot of lipstick at this stage of the game?

You have no clue what you're talking about! Funny how when I sit down while wearing my gore tex waders my rear end never gets wet, the only thing compromised is your brain.


WOW! Judging from the tenor and tone of your comments along with the Avatar, I reckon the Anger Management sessions aren't going well?

Also, given that your rear end appears to be as large as Texas, I don't doubt that you cannot feel wetness as it probably takes days/weeks for moisture to make such a journey.

I have/had three (3) pair of Rocky boots and one pair of Cabela's hikers all with Gore-Tex brand waterproof systems. Every pair leaked/leaks especially when mud gets on them.

Take a look at the Gore-Tex website and you'll see their water test is with water being sprayed onto the fabric, and it not being coated with wet mud, etc.

I have several Gore-Tex garments and use them on a regular basis.

I am also keenly aware of their limitations with such an opinion based upon 46 seasons of real world field experiences, not Madison Ave. marketing mantra.
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Re: Thoughts on Sitka Water fowl gear

Postby sim559 » Mon Dec 09, 2013 11:23 pm

May I ask a few question on waxed items?
how much does a jacket weigh?
Does it bind?
Does it fit snug around the waist?
What happens when it gets to 27f like does it get stiff ?
Does it conduct the heat out faster than fleece materiel?
I know the cowboys in the 1800s used wax clothing but none of them are left to give their opnion
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Re: Thoughts on Sitka Water fowl gear

Postby JRZDUCKSTER » Tue Dec 10, 2013 6:19 am

Ok... you mentioned that Sitka only uses the highest quality materials on the market today. Waterproof is waterproof, windproof liner is windproof. Ripstop saves on tears and a quality fit is a quality fit.

I have been employed in some retail sporting goods stores earlier in life and can say what annoys me the most is the
" MARK UP" price!!!!! I can bet my bottom dollar, it doesn't cost Sitka $400 to make the jacket or parka. Maybe $150-175. Then, you( Sitka) contracts with the retailer as a Sitka dealer to guarantee that they will not sell below the MSRP. Just like all the other companies. I see the same thing in the flyfishing industry. The rod costs us $225 and has to be sold for $499 or you lose your dealership contract. Same with bows. Ask anyone who sells Mathews, Hoyt or Bowtech. The manufacturer rapes the public plain and simple. I never deny that a manufacturer isn't entitled to make money or a profit, that's what business is about, but a mark up thats 150% or greater is rediculous.

The average hunter/fisherman is a working guy who looks for the best quality his or her money can buy without breaking his budget. There are multiple companies out there who make a darn good product that does everything Sitka does for half the price. Dirty Bird, Columbia, Drake, Avery just to mention a few. If you're trying to attract the doctor, lawyer, wall street investor client who has money to burn, sure, sell a $400-500 parka, $400 bibs, $75 hat, etc... but as far as I'm concerned, Sitka is way over priced for the average waterfowler, working man, father of 3, you get my point!
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Re: Thoughts on Sitka Water fowl gear

Postby Frylock » Tue Dec 10, 2013 8:46 am

sim559 wrote:May I ask a few question on waxed items?
how much does a jacket weigh?
Does it bind?
Does it fit snug around the waist?
What happens when it gets to 27f like does it get stiff ?
Does it conduct the heat out faster than fleece materiel?
I know the cowboys in the 1800s used wax clothing but none of them are left to give their opnion

Rubber and canvas are suitable for tarps, not clothes.
Whether or not Sitka is the best (or a good value) I cannot say because it's priced outside of my means, but to argue that breathable membrane fabrics are a marketing conspiracy flies in the face of millions of satisfied users. But clearly their gear is priced beyond the reach of many hunters. I'd bet that if Sitka dropped their prices twenty to twenty five percent they'd snatch up a huge piece of the market. What I'd really like to see is a company like Sitka develop a full line of women's hunting apparel, most of the current offerings out there are pretty sad.
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Re: Thoughts on Sitka Water fowl gear

Postby Frylock » Tue Dec 10, 2013 9:03 am

Yuchi1 wrote:I have/had three (3) pair of Rocky boots and one pair of Cabela's hikers all with Gore-Tex brand waterproof systems. Every pair leaked/leaks especially when mud gets on them.

To base part of your argument on the merits of Gore Tex quality buy using examples from subpar brands is a little disingenuous, of course if you buy lesser quality brands you'll have problems. But more importantly you claimed that Gore Tex will allow water in when it becomes dirty, yet I am 100% positive that the Gore Tex lining in your boots is on the inside of the leather, not the other way around. So to insinuate that when the leather gets muddy it somehow compromises the Gore Tex liner has me a bit confused. I completely agree with you that not all textiles are appropriate for all situations but to entirely dismiss the Sitka line based on the short comings of others brands is short sighted.
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Re: Thoughts on Sitka Water fowl gear

Postby aclumpkin » Tue Dec 10, 2013 9:29 am

JRZDUCKSTER wrote:There are multiple companies out there who make a darn good product...

Couldn't agree more!

JRZDUCKSTER wrote:...that does everything Sitka does for half the price.

I disagree... but everyone is entitled to their own opinion. :thumbsup:
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Re: Thoughts on Sitka Water fowl gear

Postby handyandy » Tue Dec 10, 2013 9:59 am

I will never buy sitka as I refuse to pay that much for china labor. I'm not saying it isn't good couldn't really comment on that as I don't own any and probably never will. But if your going to charge American made prices on something at least employ Americans. Filson is much the same now too. They still charge outrageous amounts for their stuff but have moved most their labor over seas. Someone is making a killing from the labor savings and laying tons of American workers. That I don't agree with and won't support. Do I have imported stuff yes who doesn't it's impossible not to, but I the imported stuff I have has usually been a really good deal for something that seems to be pretty good.
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Re: Thoughts on Sitka Water fowl gear

Postby xrated » Tue Dec 10, 2013 10:54 am

Never even tried on sitka so take it for what you want.

It is my understanding that any product using any Gore material must meet standards in quality and construction before they are allowed to use the Gore material. SO Sitka must be of some quality. But so should Cabelas gore products. Both companies are required to meet Gore standards and to stand behind their product.

Outside of duck hunting one of my hobbies is snowmobiling. If possible out west in the mountains. That is an area where you want good quality waterproof gear. It can be a matter of life or death. With that said their is one sled gear company using Gore. Klim and they charge an absolute premium for the gear. Many people willingly pay it after a cheaper options leave them wet and cold. Me I'm a cheap guy with a low budget. So what did I do, I went and bought Cabelas bibs in the bargain cave 8 years ago....my butt is still dry when I wear the 160 dollar bibs same as if I bought the Klim high priced ones. Reason, Gore-tex. In fact I loved the bibs so much I went and bought the Cabelas parka shell on closeout. Kept me as dry this past winter riding sled in rain, snow, sleet and ice as my buds wearing Klim. Reason being Gore-tex.

So what I'm saying is on pure function I doubt there is much noticeable difference from Cabelas duck gear to Sitkas. However Sitka might have better cuts or thoughtful design that could make the price difference acceptable.

Guess I will find out how the cut and function of the cabelas is next year as I am getting the 4-1 for Christmas and plan on putting it through the paces...starting with standing in a cold shower to see how dry i stay.
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Re: Thoughts on Sitka Water fowl gear

Postby Yuchi1 » Tue Dec 10, 2013 12:16 pm

sim559 wrote:May I ask a few question on waxed items?
how much does a jacket weigh? Never noticed the weight as an issue so, I haven't weighed either the Filson or McAlister coats
Does it bind? No
Does it fit snug around the waist? No problem there either and with waders on, it's a moot point
What happens when it gets to 27f like does it get stiff ? Coldest I've used one is 9 degrees and there were no issues associated with stiffness
Does it conduct the heat out faster than fleece materiel? They hold heat in...to the point that at 30+ degrees, they're often too warm, whereas my fleece garments stop the wind on a par with a screen door and/or a 4-strand barbed wire fence
I know the cowboys in the 1800s used wax clothing but none of them are left to give their opnion


My Gore-Tex jackets outer fabric soak up water like a sponge thus making the weight increase significantly when out in the rain. I guess that's a trade-off for the breathable aspect.
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Re: Thoughts on Sitka Water fowl gear

Postby Yuchi1 » Tue Dec 10, 2013 12:20 pm

Frylock wrote:
Yuchi1 wrote:I have/had three (3) pair of Rocky boots and one pair of Cabela's hikers all with Gore-Tex brand waterproof systems. Every pair leaked/leaks especially when mud gets on them.

To base part of your argument on the merits of Gore Tex quality buy using examples from subpar brands is a little disingenuous, of course if you buy lesser quality brands you'll have problems. But more importantly you claimed that Gore Tex will allow water in when it becomes dirty, yet I am 100% positive that the Gore Tex lining in your boots is on the inside of the leather, not the other way around. So to insinuate that when the leather gets muddy it somehow compromises the Gore Tex liner has me a bit confused. I completely agree with you that not all textiles are appropriate for all situations but to entirely dismiss the Sitka line based on the short comings of others brands is short sighted.


The Rocky boots are/were all Cordura (outer layer) and the Cabela's hikers are leather and leak at the creases w/o any mud being on them.

IMO, they are not "sub-par" brands but then again, they probably aren't over-priced either.
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Re: Thoughts on Sitka Water fowl gear

Postby Yuchi1 » Tue Dec 10, 2013 12:37 pm

BTW, I have no bias for or against Sitka apparel.

However, for a garment to be manufactured in a country long known for "sub-par" craftsmanship and yet be advertised as "premium" quality seems to be somewhat of an oxymoron.
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Re: Thoughts on Sitka Water fowl gear

Postby xrated » Tue Dec 10, 2013 12:55 pm

Yuchi1 wrote:
sim559 wrote:May I ask a few question on waxed items?
how much does a jacket weigh? Never noticed the weight as an issue so, I haven't weighed either the Filson or McAlister coats
Does it bind? No
Does it fit snug around the waist? No problem there either and with waders on, it's a moot point
What happens when it gets to 27f like does it get stiff ? Coldest I've used one is 9 degrees and there were no issues associated with stiffness
Does it conduct the heat out faster than fleece materiel? They hold heat in...to the point that at 30+ degrees, they're often too warm, whereas my fleece garments stop the wind on a par with a screen door and/or a 4-strand barbed wire fence
I know the cowboys in the 1800s used wax clothing but none of them are left to give their opnion


My Gore-Tex jackets outer fabric soak up water like a sponge thus making the weight increase significantly when out in the rain. I guess that's a trade-off for the breathable aspect.



Might be time to reapply the DWR
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