Well done dudejcb. Very well put and good too see everyone is keeping a cool and sensible head. I do have many questions about the existense of God and I do actually find the bible very difficult to believe. I would be greatful if 870 could please post up the arguments for
870 wrote: For years our greatest minds in theology have taken their science and math and proved then wrong to the point where they will not even debate our theologians because they make then look foolish.
I have obviously been listening to the wrong debates. I was brought up in a very fudamentalist religion but have broken free. I was taught that science and reason was bad and that faith (belief without question or science) is a virtue. Any question I had regarding the bible was always meet with God will show you in time or that its not for you to know. I found the actions of the God of the old testament to be particularly repulsive.
Deuteronomy 7:1-2 When the Lord your God brings you into the land you are entering to possess and drives out before you many nations . . . then you must destroy them totally. Make no treaty with them, and show them no mercy.
20:10-17 When you march up to attack a city, make its people an offer of peace. If they accept and open their gates, all the people in it shall be subject to forced labor and shall work for you. If they refuse to make peace and they engage you in battle, lay siege to that city. When the Lord your God delivers it into your hand, put to the sword all the men in it. As for the women, the children, the livestock and everything else in the city, you may take these as plunder for yourselves. . . . This is how you are to treat all the cities that are at a distance from you and do not belong to the nations nearby.
However, in the cities of the nations the Lord your God is giving you as an inheritance, do not leave alive anything that breathes. Completely destroy them—the Hittites, Amorites, Canaanites, Perizzites, Hivites and Jebusites—as the Lord your God has commanded you.
If anyone curses his father or mother, he must be put to death.
20:10 If a man commits adultery with another man’s wife—with the wife of his neighbor—both the adulterer and the adulteress must be put to death.
20:13 If a man lies with a man as one lies with a woman, both of them have done what is detestable. They must be put to death.
Deuteronomy 22:20-1 If, however, the charge is true and no proof of the girl’s virginity can be found, she shall be brought to the door of her father’s house and there the men of her town shall stone her to death. She has done a disgraceful thing in Israel by being promiscuous while still in her father’s house.
For six days, work is to be done, but the seventh day shall be your holy day, a Sabbath of rest to the LORD. Whoever does any work on it must be put to death
Do you maybe understand my concerns? I think that with todays morality, most decent people would be shocked. Why do we believe in a God who orders rape, paedophilia, incest, genocide, murder, slavery ect? I do also have many contridictions on hand as well as scientific impossibilities from the bible for anyone interested. As for evolution/creation please show me evidence for creationism. I will not pretend to believe in God so I wont go to hell because if a omni-present, omni-scient God truly does exist then he will know that deep down in me I dont believe. So I'll be damned to hell anyway. I am willing to throw away any of my religious disbeliefs, so debating with me is not in vain. This isn't meant to be antagonistic but these are the questions I sincerly have.