SWITCHING RETREIVEING FROM DUMMY BIRDS TO DEAD BIRDS

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SWITCHING RETREIVEING FROM DUMMY BIRDS TO DEAD BIRDS

Postby kbbgood » Tue Nov 03, 2020 6:15 pm

After a few years of retreiver training dummy birds how do I switch them over to picking up dead birds only and not the decoys?
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Re: SWITCHING RETREIVEING FROM DUMMY BIRDS TO DEAD BIRDS

Postby HNTFSH » Wed Nov 04, 2020 4:22 am

kbbgood wrote:After a few years of retreiver training dummy birds how do I switch them over to picking up dead birds only and not the decoys?


How many years has the dog never seen a real bird and why?
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Re: SWITCHING RETREIVEING FROM DUMMY BIRDS TO DEAD BIRDS

Postby Dakota Creek » Wed Nov 04, 2020 5:00 am

By "dummy birds" I assume you mean Dokken-like bumpers that the dog has been retrieving and not actual decoys?

We introduce decoys to training when we are doing yard work ...... they are scattered in the yard so the dog does their obedience walking and short retrieves throughout the decoys on the ground so they learn to ignore them.

You don't say what retriever training you have done - hold, force fetch, delivery to hand, etc. These are skills that can / should be taught to the dog before introducing birds as to not introduce bad mouthing issues on real birds. As to ducks, they can be introduced in your yard training sessions re-enforcing fetch, hold, and here, in a controlled situation and not while you are out hunting. When training, most use dummies for yard training and real birds for field training.

When introduced to both decoys and birds in a controlled situation, they quickly learn the difference!
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Re: SWITCHING RETREIVEING FROM DUMMY BIRDS TO DEAD BIRDS

Postby kbbgood » Wed Nov 04, 2020 5:31 pm

I've always used the ez bird hinged training birds and took him to the river and he does a good job at a year or so old. But it is time to start hunting soon and I don't have anyone with other dogs to hunt him with so what is nex? He will come heal and stay.
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Re: SWITCHING RETREIVEING FROM DUMMY BIRDS TO DEAD BIRDS

Postby RShockley » Wed Nov 04, 2020 7:41 pm

As it is hard to tell what training may have or not have been done up to this point, giving an exact answer isn't very realistic. I would highly recommend finding a retriever club near you or some other form of training group to join. Having others with more experience be able to watch you and your dog work on a training day will be way more beneficial than a few of us throwing out ideas with never seen your dog.
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Re: SWITCHING RETREIVEING FROM DUMMY BIRDS TO DEAD BIRDS

Postby kbbgood » Thu Nov 05, 2020 7:12 pm

I have my own lake behind the house and a 410. Shoot and throw the dummy and heal and then send him to retreive it thru the decoys. But will he get just dead birds next?
Last edited by kbbgood on Thu Nov 05, 2020 8:36 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: SWITCHING RETREIVEING FROM DUMMY BIRDS TO DEAD BIRDS

Postby RShockley » Thu Nov 05, 2020 8:00 pm

kbbgood wrote:I have my own lake behind the house and a 410. Shot and throw the dummy and heal and then send him to retreive it thru the decoys. But will he get just dead birds next?


They will never only get dead birds. We train with live birds, dead birds, and different types of bumpers/dokkens all throughout training. If you are asking about how to keep them from picking up decoys just run marks through decoys in training. When they go after one give them a strong no. I’m hesitant to give any further suggestions past that. They typically figure it out pretty quickly. Definitely best to do this in training and not during a hunt. They really need to be accustomed to running marks through and in a decoy spread before going hunting.
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Re: SWITCHING RETREIVEING FROM DUMMY BIRDS TO DEAD BIRDS

Postby kbbgood » Thu Nov 05, 2020 8:37 pm

Dead or alive, I mean real birds.
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Re: SWITCHING RETREIVEING FROM DUMMY BIRDS TO DEAD BIRDS

Postby Rick Hall » Fri Nov 06, 2020 4:36 am

If you don't know how he'll act with birds, finding out would sure seem a good start. Chances are he'll be fine with them, but if not, try setting him up and sending him for a dummy, then repeating that same procedure with the bird.
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Re: SWITCHING RETREIVEING FROM DUMMY BIRDS TO DEAD BIRDS

Postby Dakota Creek » Fri Nov 06, 2020 3:29 pm

RShockley wrote:They will never only get dead birds. We train with live birds, dead birds, and different types of bumpers/dokkens all throughout training. If you are asking about how to keep them from picking up decoys just run marks through decoys in training. When they go after one give them a strong no. I’m hesitant to give any further suggestions past that. They typically figure it out pretty quickly. Definitely best to do this in training and not during a hunt. They really need to be accustomed to running marks through and in a decoy spread before going hunting.


Agree with RShockley .... as I posted above -
"We introduce decoys to training when we are doing yard work ...... they are scattered in the yard so the dog does their obedience walking and short retrieves throughout the decoys on the ground so they learn to ignore them.

As to ducks, they can be introduced in your yard training sessions, in a controlled situation and not while you are out hunting. When training, most use dummies (bumpers) for yard training and real birds for field training.

When introduced to both decoys and birds in a controlled situation, they quickly learn the difference!"
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Re: SWITCHING RETREIVEING FROM DUMMY BIRDS TO DEAD BIRDS

Postby HNTFSH » Fri Nov 06, 2020 5:29 pm

Don't attempt e-collar or Force Fetch.
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Re: SWITCHING RETREIVEING FROM DUMMY BIRDS TO DEAD BIRDS

Postby CatFan » Wed Dec 09, 2020 9:11 am

If he's been retrieving dummies through decoys already, chances are that he'll do OK once you shoot a duck. But no one here can tell you for sure. Ideally, real birds would have already been a part of his training. It would be a very, very good idea to get your hands on at least one dead duck to do some training with before hand. A real duck will be a new experience and it would be good to let him experience that in a controlled environment, not on an actual hunt. Even something like a dead pheasant from a local hunting preserve (if you have those in your area) would be better if you can't get your hands on an actual duck.
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Re: SWITCHING RETREIVEING FROM DUMMY BIRDS TO DEAD BIRDS

Postby Dakota Creek » Wed Dec 09, 2020 11:30 am

CatFan wrote:It would be a very, very good idea to get your hands on at least one dead duck to do some training with before hand. A real duck will be a new experience and it would be good to let him experience that in a controlled environment, not on an actual hunt. Even something like a dead pheasant from a local hunting preserve (if you have those in your area) would be better if you can't get your hands on an actual duck.


If you are going to be hunting different birds - ducks, geese, pheasants, doves - if you can, give your dog the opportunity to "experience" the bird(s) you will be hunting. Just because they have wings and fly, doesn't mean your dog will immediately pick up and retrieve a different species if it is not used to it .... classic example - dogs is familiar with retrieving ducks and initially does not want to have anything to do in retrieving a goose. It usually does not take long to adjust but some dogs may need more exposure to the new bird than others. Pre-hunt bird exposure can also help to avoid mouthing problems (particularly if the dog has not been FF) - dog is fine on geese, tries to "eat" a duck, etc.
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Re: SWITCHING RETREIVEING FROM DUMMY BIRDS TO DEAD BIRDS

Postby HNTFSH » Wed Dec 09, 2020 12:44 pm

Dakota Creek wrote:
CatFan wrote:It would be a very, very good idea to get your hands on at least one dead duck to do some training with before hand. A real duck will be a new experience and it would be good to let him experience that in a controlled environment, not on an actual hunt. Even something like a dead pheasant from a local hunting preserve (if you have those in your area) would be better if you can't get your hands on an actual duck.


If you are going to be hunting different birds - ducks, geese, pheasants, doves - if you can, give your dog the opportunity to "experience" the bird(s) you will be hunting. Just because they have wings and fly, doesn't mean your dog will immediately pick up and retrieve a different species if it is not used to it .... classic example - dogs is familiar with retrieving ducks and initially does not want to have anything to do in retrieving a goose. It usually does not take long to adjust but some dogs may need more exposure to the new bird than others. Pre-hunt bird exposure can also help to avoid mouthing problems (particularly if the dog has not been FF) - dog is fine on geese, tries to "eat" a duck, etc.

X2! :thumbsup:
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Re: SWITCHING RETREIVEING FROM DUMMY BIRDS TO DEAD BIRDS

Postby Bluesky2012 » Thu Dec 10, 2020 8:26 pm

Dakota Creek wrote:Just because they have wings and fly, doesn't mean your dog will immediately pick up and retrieve a different species if it is not used to it


Idk. I’m not sure mine wouldn’t try to retrieve an ostrich in it did it right into the decoys.


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Re: SWITCHING RETREIVEING FROM DUMMY BIRDS TO DEAD BIRDS

Postby Dakota Creek » Fri Dec 11, 2020 5:06 am

Bluesky2012 wrote:
Dakota Creek wrote:Just because they have wings and fly, doesn't mean your dog will immediately pick up and retrieve a different species if it is not used to it


Idk. I’m not sure mine wouldn’t try to retrieve an ostrich in it did it right into the decoys.


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