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I'll get back to you guys when I get off the beach and xplain to you Ricky. . . right now I'm having some off time.

GREATLY NEEDED and Well deserved. . . and BM, I still got your back when your pup is too much to handle - shame it don't go both ways.

I'm not finished with the topic!
 

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Maybe the truth about the development of the peak is in between both theories. I had always thought they were developed by some hunt club guys but were used by Market hunters to retreive their fowl.

Mac:

Right now the beast is in what I call his "40 minutes of hell" where right before he sacks out for the night he gives both the lab and the bird dog a good dose of chasing and puppy teeth! if he has the same persistance on crippled ducks he will be one fun bay dog to hunt with. Have a few cold ones for me Mac, wish I was on the beach.
 

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I just ordered the caroll Island book from amazon, hopefully I will be confused on a different level about the origin and be entertained with some good hunt stories. This is one advantage the Labrapoo has on the peake, they surely know who started that breed of dog, (not really an advantage).
 

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buckmeister said:
You mean my peak did not come from drunken winch chasing market hunters but from a bunch of drunken winch chasing monied hunt clubbers?
The "drunken" part of the Chesapeake's background has, in fact, been well documented by the captain who rescued the ship-wrecked crew that had Sailor and Canton. He wrote in a letter that has been preserved that the English captain and crew was, indeed, drunk when they came upon their wreck. The drunk captain told his rescuer that the ship's owner had commissioned him to purchase the two best available and unrelated St. John's dog pups in Newfoundland for his kennel in England. And then sold the pups to his rescuer for what sounded to me like a very small sum - perhaps beer money?

So alcohol may well have played the pivotal role in Chesapeake Bay Retriever history. Without it, Sailor and Canton may have been Labrador foundation stock.
 

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buckmeister said:
Maybe the truth about the development of the peak is in between both theories.
That would be my guess.

I had always thought they were developed by some hunt club guys but were used by Market hunters to retreive their fowl.
I don't think the argument is so much over whether some club bred dogs found their way into market hunting as what the market hunter's dogs contributed to the bloodlines that became "Chesapeake Bay retrievers," per se, when registry was instituted.
 

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Rick Hall said:
buckmeister said:
You mean my peak did not come from drunken winch chasing market hunters but from a bunch of drunken winch chasing monied hunt clubbers?
The "drunken" part of the Chesapeake's background has, in fact, been well documented by the captain who rescued the ship-wrecked crew that had Sailor and Canton. He wrote in a letter that has been preserved that the English captain and crew was, indeed, drunk when they came upon their wreck. The drunk captain told his rescuer that the ship's owner had commissioned him to purchase the two best available and unrelated St. John's dog pups in Newfoundland for his kennel in England. And then sold the pups to his rescuer for what sounded to me like a very small sum - perhaps beer money?

So alcohol may well have played the pivotal role in Chesapeake Bay Retriever history. Without it, Sailor and Canton may have been Labrador foundation stock.
Found a copy of the actual account:

George Law who rescued the pups wrote this account in 1845 which appears on the website of the American Chesapeake Bay Retriever Club:

In the fall of 1807 I was on board of the ship Canton, belonging to my uncle, the late-Hugh Thompson, of Baltimore, when we fell in, at sea, near the termination of a very heavy equinoctial gale, with an English brig in a sinking condition, and took off the crew. The brig was loaded with codfish, and was bound to Pole, in England, from Newfoundland. I boarded her, in command of a boat from the Canton, which was sent to take off the English crew, the brig's own boats having been all swept away, and her crew in a state of intoxication. I found onboard of her two Newfoundland pups, male and female, which I saved, and subsequently, on our landing the English crew at Norfolk, our own destination being Baltimore, I purchased these two pups of the English captain for a guinea apiece. Being bound again to sea, I gave the dog pup, which was called Sailor, to Mr. John Mercer, of West River; and the slut pup, which was called Canton, to Doctor James Stewart, of Sparrow's Point. The history which the English captain gave me of these pups was, that the owner of his brig was extensively engaged in the Newfoundland trade, and had directed his correspondent to select and send him a pair of pups of the most approved Newfoundland breed, but of different families, and that the pair I purchased of him were selected under this order, The dog was of a dingy red colour; and the slut black. They were not large; their hair was short, but very thick-coated; they had dew claws. Both attained great reputation as water-dogs. They were most sagacious in every thing; particularly so in all duties connected with duck-shooting. Governor Lloyd exchanged a Merino ram for the dog, at the time of the Merino fever, when such rams were selling for many hundred dollars, and took him over to his estate on the eastern shore of Maryland, where his progeny were well known for many years after; and may still be known there, and on the western shore, as the Sailor breed. The slut remained at Sparrows Point till her death, and her progeny were and are still well known, through Patapsco Neck, on the Gunpowder, and up the bay, amongst the duck-shooters, as unsurpassed for their purposes. I have heard both Doctor Stewart and Mr. Mercer relate most extraordinary instances of the sagacity and performance of both dog and slut, and would refer you to their friends for such particulars as I am unable, at this distance of time, to recollect with sufficient accuracy to repeat.
 

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"Captain", "Doctor", and "Governor" all seem to weigh heavily in the tale...and seem to have a greater role in pup survival & recruitment :lol:

Just saying....

A couple of other comments about, "Chesapeake Bay Retrievers, Decoys & Long Guns: Tales of Carroll's Island Ducking Club ",

The photos of the old dogs were worth the purchase price (to my mind).

The book was the first time I became acquainted with the term, "gyp"...

The section on the big bore guns (4, 6 gauge, etc.) gave the phrase "sky blasting" new meaning.
 

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Posted by Rick.
"George Law who rescued the pups wrote this account in 1845 which appears on the website of the American Chesapeake Bay Retriever Club:

In the fall of 1807 I was on board of the ship Canton, belonging to my uncle, the late-Hugh Thompson, of Baltimore, when we fell in, at sea, near the termination of a very heavy equinoctial gale, with an English brig in a sinking condition, and took off the crew. The brig was loaded with codfish, and was bound to Pole, in England, from Newfoundland. I boarded her, in command of a boat from the Canton, which was sent to take off the English crew, the brig's own boats having been all swept away, and her crew in a state of intoxication. I found onboard of her two Newfoundland pups, male and female, which I saved, and subsequently, on our landing the English crew at Norfolk, our own destination being Baltimore, I purchased these two pups of the English captain for a guinea apiece. Being bound again to sea, I gave the dog pup, which was called Sailor, to Mr. John Mercer, of West River; and the slut pup, which was called Canton, to Doctor James Stewart, of Sparrow's Point. The history which the English captain gave me of these pups was, that the owner of his brig was extensively engaged in the Newfoundland trade, and had directed his correspondent to select and send him a pair of pups of the most approved Newfoundland breed, but of different families, and that the pair I purchased of him were selected under this order, The dog was of a dingy red colour; and the slut black. They were not large; their hair was short, but very thick-coated; they had dew claws. Both attained great reputation as water-dogs. They were most sagacious in every thing; particularly so in all duties connected with duck-shooting. Governor Lloyd exchanged a Merino ram for the dog, at the time of the Merino fever, when such rams were selling for many hundred dollars, and took him over to his estate on the eastern shore of Maryland, where his progeny were well known for many years after; and may still be known there, and on the western shore, as the Sailor breed. The slut remained at Sparrows Point till her death, and her progeny were and are still well known, through Patapsco Neck, on the Gunpowder, and up the bay, amongst the duck-shooters, as unsurpassed for their purposes. I have heard both Doctor Stewart and Mr. Mercer relate most extraordinary instances of the sagacity and performance of both dog and slut, and would refer you to their friends for such particulars as I am unable, at this distance of time, to recollect with sufficient accuracy to repeat."

Like I need a reason to post a picture but here you go. A couple pictures of some of th eplaces mentioned.
Thor retrieveing on Carroll Island. Carroll Island is now owned by the military. Aberdeen Proving Ground. APG. APG ownes most of the Gunpowder and Bush River. There is only 10 private blinds on the Gunpoweder river and I have 8 of them.
Thor on Carroll Island.


Rosie marking some Cans on Sparrows points.

Thor and I on a Eastern Shore Goose hunt on Wye Island. huntign over old tire decoys.

Thor running a blind on the Gunpowder River about 1000 yards upriver from the Carroll Island Gund Club.

Thor going after a Bluebill on the Potapsco River. Right outside of Baltimore and Ft Mchenry.


Thor retrieving on sparrow points.

I am so gald we have a Canvasback season this year.
 

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Rick Hall said:
None of my Chessie have worn an e-collar. Or been FFed, for that matter. But if I had one of those stubborn, hard to train Labs, I'd probably have greater interest in such topics.
....Rick, you've got nothing but respect from me,..you know that :yes: Anyone that can motivate one or a few of these hardheads such as you have without the above mentioned methods has my vote. When I say hardheads, I mean no disrespect to the breed itself, but truthfully, they really are hardheaded sometimes, however. I think Chessies' are great dogs. Some folks argue that labs win more competitions,..that's because there are 1.5 "trillion" more labs that enter competition vs. Chessies, and that's why there are more. And you know I hated to have to admit that :lol3:
 

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Ny experience suggests that the people dealing with them are far more apt to be hard-headed than the Chesapeakes. When one of mine has seemed "stubborn" about something, it's invariably because I've been too bone-headed to present what I want in a manner the dog understands.
 

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WOW....what an education I got from reading all these post! All I tried to do is give someone a heads-up on a dog! I wont post on here again! :bow:
 

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superxgooseslayer said:
WOW....what an education I got from reading all these post! All I tried to do is give someone a heads-up on a dog! I wont post on here again! :bow:
Hey man, we get like that on the board - especially when we talk about Chessies - I think Rick said; "the owners are often more hardheaded". . . Enjoy the banter and don't let it keep you from posting!!
 

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superxgooseslayer said:
WOW....what an education I got from reading all these post! All I tried to do is give someone a heads-up on a dog! I wont post on here again! :bow:
Post or not as you see fit. But, based on my experience, there's ample reason for chessie love. I got my first one almost ten years ago. I got her becaouse I was ready to own a dog again and because my cousin's two chessie brothers were the most driven, independent thinking, tolerant of a child's prodding and pulling, and protective dogs I had ever seen. That life-loving, bird-hating, instinctively-gifted, bull-headed bitch I picked up on 1/16/00 has changed my life forever. She instantly took ownership of our hearts and home with her zest for life and love for me, my wife, and our circle of family and friends (with the exception of my bs-ing bro-in-law, who she continues to light up even after he's been in the house for hours. She's an excellent judge of character). She got me into hunt skill dog training because the hunting/retrieving instincts she showed in her first few months struck me as being too good to go undeveloped to their max. She got me into hunting for the first time at the age of 51 because of how well she responded to all facets of hunt training. Again, I felt I couldn't responsibly let her talent go unused. My wife's friend tells her friends and family that Bear, not my wife, babysits for her 4-year-old son because the dog lovingly follows that kid from the time he comes in the door 'til he leaves. She won't let an adult beside his mom, my wife or I near Justin. She has adopted him at our house and takes her maternal duties very seriously. To a slightly lesser degree, she is the same way with my granddaughter when she and my daughter come into town. The two chessies that my wife and I have subsequently been owned by have shown many of the same instincts and traits. I will never own another breed of hunting dog. Our lives have changed direction and been made infinitely richer because of our fascination with this breed. I don't see how you could casually own a chessie. They are so driven and demandingly engaging and loving that they will change the course of your life. You really have no choice in the matter.
 

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shesmybabybear said:
superxgooseslayer said:
WOW....what an education I got from reading all these post! All I tried to do is give someone a heads-up on a dog! I wont post on here again! :bow:
Post or not as you see fit. But, based on my experience, there's ample reason for chessie love. I got my first one almost ten years ago. I got her becaouse I was ready to own a dog again and because my cousin's two chessie brothers were the most driven, independent thinking, tolerant of a child's prodding and pulling, and protective dogs I had ever seen. That life-loving, bird-hating, instinctively-gifted, bull-headed bitch I picked up on 1/16/00 has changed my life forever. She instantly took ownership of our hearts and home with her zest for life and love for me, my wife, and our circle of family and friends (with the exception of my bs-ing bro-in-law, who she continues to light up even after he's been in the house for hours. She's an excellent judge of character). She got me into hunt skill dog training because the hunting/retrieving instincts she showed in her first few months struck me as being too good to go undeveloped to their max. She got me into hunting for the first time at the age of 51 because of how well she responded to all facets of hunt training. Again, I felt I couldn't responsibly let her talent go unused. My wife's friend tells her friends and family that Bear, not my wife, babysits for her 4-year-old son because the dog lovingly follows that kid from the time he comes in the door 'til he leaves. She won't let an adult beside his mom, my wife or I near Justin. She has adopted him at our house and takes her maternal duties very seriously. To a slightly lesser degree, she is the same way with my granddaughter when she and my daughter come into town. The two chessies that my wife and I have subsequently been owned by have shown many of the same instincts and traits. I will never own another breed of hunting dog. Our lives have changed direction and been made infinitely richer because of our fascination with this breed. I don't see how you could casually own a chessie. They are so driven and demandingly engaging and loving that they will change the course of your life. You really have no choice in the matter.
Great synopsis of your ownership of chessies. My stories, while not similar, are just a life changing in result. I've written a couple of these stories on the board here and anybody that knows me on DHC knows the association I have with Brown dogs. I too am devoted to the breed and don't desire to have anything else.

Thank you for sharing friend!!! Post pics up sometime - we'd love to see them.
 
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