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Since Bigterp laughed at my quote, here is an image from an autopsy on a vaccinated individual that died from the vaccine.
Why are there not more autopsies being done?
And I'll laugh yet again. This appears to be from the White Coat Summit and the AFDL. A group that includes Dr. Stella Immanuel "who alleges that alien DNA is being used in medical treatments and that researchers are working on a vaccine to prevent people from becoming religious. She also believes in a conspiracy by the “Illuminati” to destroy the world with abortion, gay marriage, and of all things, children’s toys. As far as gynecological diseases go, they can be caused by having sex with witches and demons that appear in dreams."

The above are the type of people you're really using to form your medical opinions on? Seriously?

The same group that was championing hydroxychloroquine around this time last year even when the data showed it was ineffective. They are doing the same with Ivermectin now as well. I guess they moved on to the new "flavor of the week" so to say.

I've said it before and I'll say it again. You guys keep presenting ****ty "evidence" and "data" to align with your bias. It's laughable at this point.
 

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Where is the MASSIVE increase in the death rate? The trend has been going up consistently for 10 years.
YearDeath RateGrowth Rate
20218.9771.090%
20208.8801.120%
20198.7821.120%
20188.6851.220%
20178.5801.240%
20168.4751.270%
20158.3691.270%
20148.2641.290%
20138.1590.090%
20128.1520.090%
20118.1450.090%
20108.1380.090%
20098.1310.090%
20088.124-0.960%


U.S. Death Rate 1950-2021
You're killing it with your data!!! From the very top of the link in bold with a big red box to draw your attention it says......NOTE: All 2020 and later data are UN projections and DO NOT include any impacts of the COVID-19 virus.

You add the Covid deaths and you get the following.....During January–December 2020, the estimated 2020 age-adjusted death rate increased for the first time since 2017, with an increase of 15.9% compared with 2019, from 715.2 to 828.7 deaths per 100,000 population.

Not only are you wrong, yet again, you're using data that you KNOW is incorrect, yet again. Again, laughable!!!
 

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Nope. Because that claim of died with versus of is bull****.
So you are ACTUALLY claiming that a homicide/suicide is due to dying FROM Covid. You can't be that dense.

Falling off a roof WITH Covid is not a covid death.
Vehicle trauma death WITH Covid is not a covid death.

Yet they have been counted as such. Coroners in Colorodo have backed out about half the Covid deaths that are not directly FROM Covid. The Government has been gaming the numbers....intentionally. The data has likely been manipulated in every state.
 

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A group that includes Dr. Stella Immanuel "who alleges that alien DNA is being used in medical treatments and that researchers are working on a vaccine to prevent people from becoming religious. She also believes in a conspiracy by the “Illuminati” to destroy the world with abortion, gay marriage, and of all things, children’s toys. As far as gynecological diseases go, they can be caused by having sex with witches and demons that appear in dreams."
I am not familiar with Dr. Stella.

So you are going to use the guilty by association argument eh? I guess all white people in the south really are bigots [email protected]
 

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From the very top of the link in bold with a big red box to draw your attention it says......NOTE: All 2020 and later data are UN projections and DO NOT include any impacts of the COVID-19 virus.

You add the Covid deaths and you get the following.....During January–December 2020, the estimated 2020 age-adjusted death rate increased for the first time since 2017, with an increase of 15.9% compared with 2019, from 715.2 to 828.7 deaths per 100,000 population.
Noted. I missed that....
 

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Discussion Starter · #907 ·
So you are ACTUALLY claiming that a homicide/suicide is due to dying FROM Covid. You can't be that dense.

Falling off a roof WITH Covid is not a covid death.
Vehicle trauma death WITH Covid is not a covid death.

Yet they have been counted as such. Coroners in Colorodo have backed out about half the Covid deaths that are not directly FROM Covid. The Government has been gaming the numbers....intentionally. The data has likely been manipulated in every state.
Those errors, manipulations, all of that are a miniscule fraction of the deaths.

If you simply take the year over year growth in deaths that was a constant steady growth because the population is growing and aging and project that into 2020 and 2021, you see a huge increase in deaths over the simple increase associated with American having a little bigger population that is a little bit older on average.

That huge increase is not people falling off of roofs and being reported as Covid. It's not that there was a few hundred thousand extra vehicle deaths that all got reported as Covid.

All those things may well have happened, but it doesn't change the fact that there are a huge number of excess deaths in 2020 and 2021 that resulted from something. If not Covid, then what killed all these people? They just made up hundreds of thousands of death certificates for people that never existed, is that it?

We can count our dead accurately. Certainly with in 1,000 or less in any given year. Every coroner in every state would have to be in on the conspiracy and one that could easily be exposed. Or if they changed the numbers after that, again, easily exposed.

Yes, cause of death may be wrong. But the diagnosis of death is not.
 

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all of that are a miniscule fraction of the deaths
Nope. About half of covid deaths according to Coroners and doctors in Colorodo.

Yes, cause of death may be wrong. But the diagnosis of death is not.
What's your point? You are assuming, on very bad data, that all those deaths are from Covid. How many deaths occurred during the lockdowns from lack of treatment for other medical issues? How many more suicides? Drug overdoses? Etc..... The lockdowns caused a whole lot of deaths that were not due from Covid. That's Fact.
 

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We can count our dead accurately. Certainly with in 1,000 or less in any given year. Every coroner in every state would have to be in on the conspiracy and one that could easily be exposed. Or if they changed the numbers after that, again, easily exposed.
The coroners submitted the reports accurately, the changes were made above them without them knowing about it.....
 

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Discussion Starter · #910 ·
Nope. About half of covid deaths according to Coroners and doctors in Colorodo.



What's your point? You are assuming, on very bad data, that all those deaths are from Covid. How many deaths occurred during the lockdowns from lack of treatment for other medical issues? How many more suicides? Drug overdoses? Etc..... The lockdowns caused a whole lot of deaths that were not due from Covid. That's Fact.
We have VERY GOOD DATA on the number of deaths. The increase in total number of deaths above the year over year increase from a slightly larger and slightly older population is in line with the total estimated number of deaths from Covid.

If it is not Covid that killed 600,000 additional people, then what did?

Maybe they really are that bad. There are still 600,000 more deaths than there should have been if there was not some large change in what is killing people. What is it?

Again, I don't think the doctors and coroners are saying the over stated the number of people that died by 50%.

Remember only about 1/3rd of the patients actually die in a hospital.

Also remember we only detect maybe as few as 1/10 cases of Covid.

When someone dies that has known health problems, there is rarely ever an autopsy. 65 and older only about 5% of deaths have an actual autopsy. My mom didn't. My dad didn't. None of my 4 grandparents. My 15 year old cousin that dropped dead while playing with his sister, he had an autopsy.

So with such a huge fraction of Covid cases going undiagnosed and such a large fraction fo them in people with known health conditions, it would be actually quite surprising if they were not assuming these people died of their known health conditions and not an undiagnosed case of Covid.

Just common sense and experience should tell you the misdiagnosis is going to go both ways.

Your searching for a specific answer, so you are skipping over the starting point.

How many people died in 2019? 2.85 million.

How many people died in 2020? 3.43 million (not yet official, but any lagging data is minimal at this point)

What are your sources saying the total numbers of deaths in American in 2019 and 2020 are?

Start there. Unless there is some way to explain this massive overcount, then all the rest is purely noise, which it is.

There are over 500,000 deaths above normal in 2020 and a lot more this year.

That's not misreporting, manipulation, or any of that. It is the most reliable numbers we have. Everything has to be consistent with those numbers or it is wrong. Unless you believe there are 500,000+ fictional deaths reported. Not deaths where the cause of death was wrong, but deaths where nobody actually died of any cause at all. Doctors and coroners did not over report deaths nor did the CDC take their numbers and change them.
 

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Well, according to a whistleblower that worked at one of the VAERS system centers, and testified under penalty of perjury, 45,000 people died within 3 days of taking the first shot of the vaccine. That is a large chunk of those deaths right there if true. How many unreported vaccine deaths at the other 10 centers? Hopefully we will find out during discovery, or another whistleblower comes forward. These deaths have been categorized under a different cause to hide them.

Doctors and coroners did not over report deaths nor did the CDC take their numbers and change them.
I agree that coroners did not over report deaths. They reported the accurate to the best of their knowledge cause of death. I don't know who changed those deaths to Covid, but somebody did according to the coroners themselves that were interviewed. It just codes on a computer, and someone changed them. Did you even read the investigative report I posted?
 

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Discussion Starter · #913 ·
I'm not arguing numbers of deaths! I'm arguing CAUSE. You still have not addressed the whistleblower complaint. If it's legit, Now what?
What other possible cause is there. Most happened well before the first vaccine was administered. So it cannot be the vaccine.

In all seriousness, this is EXACTLY how the catastrophic global warming folks operate. They are certain they are right and therefore cannot accept the overwhelming evidence that their beliefs are not accurate. Big bad oil has to be wrong about everything. Reality is that yes there is warming, but it is not catastrophic. They will never accept that.

In your case, it is the same absolute certainty that the primary cause is something other than the experimental virus from China. Of that you are absolutely certain so just must find the proof. Big bad government has to be wrong about everything. I'm just not going to accept anything else. Reality is it's the virus. Yes there are other problems other causes but vast majority are simply the virus and nothing more.

That's why the warmers believe every crazy irrational statement that supports them. Don't be like that. Retain your skepticism especially if people tell you what you want to hear.
 

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So you are ACTUALLY claiming that a homicide/suicide is due to dying FROM Covid. You can't be that dense.

Falling off a roof WITH Covid is not a covid death.
Vehicle trauma death WITH Covid is not a covid death.

Yet they have been counted as such. Coroners in Colorodo have backed out about half the Covid deaths that are not directly FROM Covid. The Government has been gaming the numbers....intentionally. The data has likely been manipulated in every state.
No, I'm claiming the died "with" versus "of" Covid is a fabrication and excuse that people like yourself use to validate their arguments. I'm not saying there was zero manipulation, errors or whatever of some of the numbers. But, like I've addressed several times, the increase in number of deaths in 2020 alone shows that SOMETHING serious was going on. We're talking over 400,000 extra people dead, than expected based on year to year death number, in 2020. If not Covid, please explain? There are NUMEROUS studies proving this fact. You cannot explain off death certificates as fake or fabricated. It's a unequivocal fact that a large number of people in the US died last year that shouldn't have. Tell me why? I've asked you this question over and over and other than claim it wasn't Covid, or that the numbers are fake, you have no answer.
 

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I am not familiar with Dr. Stella.

So you are going to use the guilty by association argument eh? I guess all white people in the south really are bigots [email protected]
Nope. Just giving you an example of the type of doctors that are a part of the group that you give so much credit to. She's not the only one with wild, conspiracy ridden takes, by the way. I do find it interesting that you are unaware of her, and other members of this groups, insane views and opinions given how much clout you give the AFLD. They are literally a political organization using their medical degrees to promote misinformation, conspiracy theories and pseudoscience. Aren't you constantly complaining about the politicization of Covid?
 

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Well, according to a whistleblower that worked at one of the VAERS system centers, and testified under penalty of perjury, 45,000 people died within 3 days of taking the first shot of the vaccine. That is a large chunk of those deaths right there if true. How many unreported vaccine deaths at the other 10 centers? Hopefully we will find out during discovery, or another whistleblower comes forward. These deaths have been categorized under a different cause to hide them.
Interesting. 45,000 out of 400,000 to over 500,000 deaths in 2020 BEFORE a vaccine was even available. And yes, I understand the claim is after 2020, but you're using it to argue the 500,000 Spinner is referencing from 2020. The "lawsuit" stemming from these 45,000 vaccine deaths is just another conspiracy ridden piece of crap from, you guessed it, America's Frontline Doctors!!!
 

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Approx. 90% of deaths from Covid could have been prevented. But the western world is not interested in stopping the spread of Covid nor saving lives as evident in our medical actions currently with regards to Covid.

Once Upon A Time...

... in a not-so-tiny nation called Spain, a nursing home had a nasty virus get into it.
It was March of 2020. The nasty virus was called Covid-19. And this nursing home, like so many others all over the world, was full of elderly, morbid people. The mean age of residents was 85 and 48% were over 80 years old. It was a killing field, like so many others.....
Within three months 100% of the residents had caught the virus. Not presumed to have -- proved to have.

How do we know this? Because almost every one of them seroconverted. All but three out of 84 of them, to be precise.
Think about that last sentence for a second.
Almost every one of them seroconverted.
How's that possible? Many of them died, right? You can't seroconvert if you're dead.
No. Not only did nearly none die none went to the hospital either because they rapidly figured out how to stop the virus from killing people -- and did exactly that.
You would have thought this would have been all over the news. In point of fact not one mention of it was made. Further, not one write-up was made in medical journals either until January of 2021, which I missed. My bad -- out of the several hundred medical journal pieces, I missed this one. It was brought to my attention on my forum and my jaw immediately hit the floor.
The jab train must continue, you see. So must the ventilator train. So must the money train, the mask train and the rest of the BS we have endured for the last 18+ months.
So must the slaughter for money, the fear, and the lies.
So what did these few nursing homes do that nobody has done since and nobody reported out at the time?
  • 1. Early start of treatment, regardless of the severity of patient symptoms.
    • - Antihistamines every 12 h: dexchlorpheniramine 2 mg, cetirizine 10 mg or loratadine 10 mg.
    • - Azithromycin 500 mg orally every 24 h for 3 days if there is rapid improvement, and for 6 days if the duration of symptoms is prolonged.
    • - If pain or fever, acetaminophen 650 mg/6–8 h.
    • - Nasal washing and gargling with sodium bicarbonate water (half a glass of warm water with half a teaspoon of sodium bicarbonate).
      2. Patients with mild or recent-onset symptoms (cough, fever, general malaise, anosmia, polymyalgia):
    • - Antihistamines + Azithromycin (see mild treatment management)
    • - Levofloxacin 500 mg/12 h, up to 14 days of antibiotic treatment from diagnosis.
    • - Mepifilin solution, 50 mg/8 h as a bronchodilator, until subjective improvement. Patients with previous lung disease (asthma or COPD) used their usual bronchodilators.
    • - If the patient experienced increased breathing difficulty, prednisone 1 mg/kg/day divided into two doses until clinical improvement, and then it was slowly tapered down.
      3. If symptoms of severity (dyspnea, breathing difficulty, mild or moderate chest pain, with SpO2 >80%, heart rate <100 beats per minute at any time of the process):
  • 4. Prophylactic treatment for close contacts, including all asymptomatic residents:
    • - Antihistamines at the same dose as symptomatic patients.
Look at that top line.
Cetrizine is otherwise known as Zyrtec. Loratadine is otherwise known as Claritin. Dexchlorpheniramine is not often-used in the US anymore, but it used to be. The other two core drugs were Azithromycin and Levofloxacin, both common antibiotics with the first being the infamous "Zpak" from the HCQ+Zinc+Zpak combination that a fraudulent study was used to discredit.
Both of the first two antihistamines are available over the counter in most nations including the United States. The dosing they used is twice that on the label. The two antibiotics are both available anywhere for little money.
Before they started treating people three residents died. The entire group of them had the common maladies of old age -- hypertension, diabetes, COPD, cardiovascular disease. Most were using a huge range of existing drugs for their conditions (5 or more.)
As soon as they started treating people the following happened:
All of our patients evolved satisfactorily and were recovered at the beginning of June. No adverse effects were recorded in any patient and no one required hospital admission. At the end of June, 100% of the residents and almost half of the workers had positive serology for COVID-19, most of them with past infection.
Not one adverse event occurred among these residents and staff and no hospitalizations were necessary either.
In pooled data 28% of the residents in similar nursing homes over the same time period died. In these two, once they started treating with cheap drugs, leading with those available over the counter in the US, ZERO -- I repeat -- ZERO had a bad reaction to the protocol, ZERO died and ZERO were admitted to a hospital for treatment.
ZERO.
It was one hundred percent effective.

Yes, it's a small sample. Go do the statistical math on the CI for that size sample and results if you insist.
According to the mechanisms of action described, these drugs would act synergistically in the early stages of the disease, which is why we consider it essential to start the treatment as soon as possible. Once the virus has colonized the respiratory system, the effectiveness is probably more limited, and hence the failure of these treatments in more advanced stages of the disease, when hospital admission is necessary. In our experience, early double antibiotics were effective to control the process in cases with moderate symptoms.
Nobody cared.
Nobody reported on this.
Nobody duplicated it either.
I didn't even realize this study existed; had I known of it guess what I would have added to my protocol when I got Covid-19 the first week of August of this year, since it happens to be in my medicine cabinet already for seasonal allergies? Uh huh. Two 60ct bottles of generic Claritin equivalent costs about $12 at WalMart.
Folks, think about this long and hard: In the worst-case scenario for those who this virus should have killed -- it killed nobody. It should be killing statistically nobody today -- right here, right now. How to prevent it from doing so was discovered in March and April of 2020 and intentionally ignored worldwide.
It is still being ignored today.
With these numbers there is no reason to fear a Covid-19 infection. There is no reason to take a vaccine. There was never a reason to develop a vaccine, especially the ones we have today; infection that does not produce severe disease is sterilizing and thus wildly superior to vaccinated immunity which is now proved to be failing worldwide. There is no reason to wear a mask.
Every single one of these residents seroconverted and became immune with mild or moderate symptoms consistent with seasonal colds and flus and not one of them was put into the hospital or killed. The treatment is so ******ned cheap and available there's no excuse to not use it instantly on suspicion of infection and prophylactically among everyone else in your household at first sign of trouble.

You think the entire load of BS around HCQ and Ivermectin is bad? This is a thousand times worse.
Those who died did not do so due to a "novel coronavirus"; we knew how to treat that infection successfully for pennies in March and April of 2020. Yes, in the first month or two people died because we did not know.
Beyond April of 2020 people died because we let the medical system and governments murder them for profit and they're still doing it today. We, the people, have allowed this. We have failed and refused to rise up and hold accountable, personally, every single hospital, doctor, so-called "hero" nurse and every single politician across the globe. They willfully and intentionally slaughtered millions on a global basis.
The answer to the problem -- to Covid-19 -- was known in March and April of 2020 and yet not published until January of this year, and even then not one single bit of media attention nor a single mention from Fauci, the CDC, the NIH or FDA has been made, all in the interest of Moderna and Pfizer's stock prices and the power-mad jackasses on an international basis -- at the cost of your loved ones' lives.
That wasn't an accident and it still isn't one.
IMO, it is criminal that this has not been widely pursued as a treatment option. Early treatment saves lives. Not this vaccine.
 

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We're talking over 400,000 extra people dead, than expected based on year to year death number, in 2020. If not Covid, please explain? There are NUMEROUS studies proving this fact. You cannot explain off death certificates as fake or fabricated. It's a unequivocal fact that a large number of people in the US died last year that shouldn't have. Tell me why? I've asked you this question over and over and other than claim it wasn't Covid, or that the numbers are fake, you have no answer.
If actually infected with covid, it was medical murder that killed them....through extremely ineffective COVID treatments. A large percentage of those people could have been saved, even the very old with multiple severe comorbidities....and they would now have natural immunity which conveys broad, lasting, sterilizing protection.
Vaccine is worse than Covid
 

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What are the most vaccinated states numbers looking like? Should that tell the tale. Being in the south we’ve had a a bad outbreak and we have the lowest vaccinated numbers.
I’d assume vice versa if vaccines work. Compare positives then hospitalizations and then deaths. Surely there is some way to compare.
 
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