[kjm1024]

I went to Cabelas last week and picked up 2 boxes of Winchester Expert Steel, 3 inch BB's for my late season of ducks and goose. I shoot a hen mallard 3 times, reload, hit it a forth time on the water and it swims away!!!! All this is less than 35 yards away. So I go on Cabelas website to look at some reviews about this stuff and everyone complains about bad patterns, bad pellet shape and flight, low quality rounds. I think I believe it, 4 shots on a bird and it doesnt go down, what the heck! At first I thought it was bad shooting on my part but I was killing ducks all season long with Remington Nitro Steel. I think I'm going back to those, only time a bird didnt die was when I completely missed it.

Anyone else have this experience with Winchester Expert????

 

[gcs]

Yep, They are cheap at walmart but we have very sporadic results with them. The last Black Duck I hit with it you could see the impact of the pellets on the side of the breast, (#2's)and last I saw it was still going. I just switched to some Fiocchi's that I got from Rogers at close to Wally's price. It's nice to kill them only once again. :thumbsup:

 

[Ned S]

Pattern them on paper at 40 yds. This is too big of shot to be shooting ducks, it's well documented as to being a crippler. Read the CONSEP report. Ned S the young 81 yr old.

 

[kjm1024]

Pattern them on paper at 40 yds. This is too big of shot to be shooting ducks, it's well documented as to being a crippler. Read the CONSEP report. Ned S the young 81 yr old.

A lot of people up in the northeast switch from 2's or 4's over to 1's and BB's after the second half of the season. The chances of shooting at Canada's becomes equal most days. I've found that I've had more cripples with 2's during the late season than with larger size shot. I definitely don't pretend to know everything, so, what would you recommend as an all around shot size for duck and goose? :huh: If BB's are too big for ducks then its false advertising because there's a picture of a duck all cupped up on the box... :lol3:

 

[shoot-n-goose]

I agree that BB is rather large for ducks.

Its hard to say an ammo is crappy solely because you couldn't kill birds. Sounds like it wasn't throwing the greatest patterns from your gun, so its more user error then the ammo's fault. If you have a good pattern then the ammo shouldnt matter so much inside 35yrds. Its all little pieces of steel going really really fast

 

[Sagebrush]

Winchester had to leave the E off of the name (expert) since they knew what the shell was like.

the x looks like a y, and the letters stand for................................

You People Ever Reload Today !! ??

Thought you knew that................ :lol: :lol:

 

[ALLDRAKES]

Finishing cripples with BB's is tough.............BB's are a crippler on ducks from what I have seen. Pattern density is just too thin.

 

[Ned S]

Pattern them on paper at 40 yds. This is too big of shot to be shooting ducks, it's well documented as to being a crippler. Read the CONSEP report. Ned S the young 81 yr old.

A lot of people up in the northeast switch from 2's or 4's over to 1's and BB's after the second half of the season. The chances of shooting at Canada's becomes equal most days. I've found that I've had more cripples with 2's during the late season than with larger size shot. I definitely don't pretend to know everything, so, what would you recommend as an all around shot size for duck and goose? :huh: If BB's are too big for ducks then its false advertising because there's a picture of a duck all cupped up on the box... :lol3:

Fast steel 1's. Ned S the young 81 yr old, who is going after mallards tomorrow with 1 oz of 3's at 1863 fps. Wow!

 

[cannon]

Pattern them on paper at 40 yds. This is too big of shot to be shooting ducks, it's well documented as to being a crippler. Read the CONSEP report. Ned S the young 81 yr old.

I read the CONSEP report, and that ain't what it said. It stated what the authors opined to be the most efficient loads for ducks, and it stated that with those sizes, their lethality study would suggest that it is necessary to put four pellets in a duck within a reasonable range to drop him dead. However, it definitely didn't say that BB's were cripplers, and after 20 years of guiding duck hunts in Eastern Arkansas, I can tell you that the right load of BB's AIN'T no crippler load -- its a stone cold killer. As a matter of fact, assuming equal numbers of pellets, BB's are FAR MORE efficient killers than smaller shot sizes.

That being said, if you're gonna use BB's on ducks (AND I OFTEN DO), go with a 1 3/8 oz load, and yup, stay away from those "Xperts". If you're patterning over 90%, you've got more than enough pellets on target to fill that theoretical circle referred to in the CONSEP report, and if they're evenly spaced, you'll put more than 4 pellets in a mallard and transfer considerably more energy in the process than is possible with 1's at 50 yards.

 

[kjm1024]

Pattern them on paper at 40 yds. This is too big of shot to be shooting ducks, it's well documented as to being a crippler. Read the CONSEP report. Ned S the young 81 yr old.

I read the CONSEP report, and that ain't what it said. It stated what the authors opined to be the most efficient loads for ducks, and it stated that with those sizes, their lethality study would suggest that it is necessary to put four pellets in a duck within a reasonable range to drop him dead. However, it definitely didn't say that BB's were cripplers, and after 20 years of guiding duck hunts in Eastern Arkansas, I can tell you that the right load of BB's AIN'T no crippler load -- its a stone cold killer. As a matter of fact, assuming equal numbers of pellets, BB's are FAR MORE efficient killers than smaller shot sizes.

That being said, if you're gonna use BB's on ducks (AND I OFTEN DO), go with a 1 3/8 oz load, and yup, stay away from those "Xperts". If you're patterning over 90%, you've got more than enough pellets on target to fill that theoretical circle referred to in the CONSEP report, and if they're evenly spaced, you'll put more than 4 pellets in a mallard and transfer considerably more energy in the process than is possible with 1's at 50 yards.

Thanks "cannon", I knew I wasn't crazy for thinking this. I asked a friend who has been duck hunting a lot longer than I, what he used for later in the season and he said BB's!! I said that people were saying they have less dense pattern and cripple birds. He said they "drop them dead"! Another friend said all his buddies in St Louis use BBB's all year and swear by them, seems a bit much but whatever works I guess?? Looks like I just made a bad quality purchase and need to buy something better, what shells do you recommend Cannon??

 

[ohsay]

I was going to type "1 3/8 oz Drylocks and a Patternmaster" Cannon, but someone might think I was actually saying it. :lol3:

 

[jrockncash]

I would say Kent fasteel 3'' 3's.

Cannon would say "Dryloks and a patternmaster."

 

[John Singer]

Several years ago, I lived on a small bay on Lake Huron in northern Michigan. One year, the bay hosted a tremendous number of bufflehead. That year, my party killed just over 150 ducks. Over 100 were bufflehead. Toward the end of the season, I ran low on ammunition. While on a business trip to southern Michigan, I stopped at a Meijers store and purchases several boxes of Winchester X-pert Shells in #2 steel.

When I used these shells to shoot bufflehead, many times the ducks would fall when hit then get up and fly away. Frustrated, I later cut open a couple of shells and what I saw was not shot that I was normally used to seeing. What was in those shells looked more like the scrap off of a machine shop floor. Very few pieces were round, many were hollow. Many were tear dropped shaped.

Some people claim to have good luck with those shells. I choose to never use them again.

 

[njonesy_07]

Several years ago, I lived on a small bay on Lake Huron in northern Michigan. One year, the bay hosted a tremendous number of bufflehead. That year, my party killed just over 150 ducks. Over 100 were bufflehead. Toward the end of the season, I ran low on ammunition. While on a business trip to southern Michigan, I stopped at a Meijers store and purchases several boxes of Winchester X-pert Shells in #2 steel.

When I used these shells to shoot bufflehead, many times the ducks would fall when hit then get up and fly away. Frustrated, I later cut open a couple of shells and what I saw was not shot that I was normally used to seeing. What was in those shells looked more like the scrap off of a machine shop floor. Very few pieces were round, many were hollow. Many were tear dropped shaped.

Some people claim to have good luck with those shells. I choose to never use them again.

Agreed! Also, I noticed that the xperts burn very dirty compared to my reloads and Kents. Just shooting 5 rds with winchesters was much dirtier compared to other days of shooting a box or more of Kents/reloads. I won't buy them again, even if they are $9 a box :no:

 

[cannon]

I was going to type "1 3/8 oz Drylocks and a Patternmaster" Cannon, but someone might think I was actually saying it. :lol3:

Is it any surprise that when I walk into any one of 5 restaurants in my home town, the waitress says "hey, honey. The usual?"

I've been referred to as predictable (among other things that would be inappropriate to mention in this venue). I prefer to think of myself as well-grounded. :grooving:

 

[kjm1024]

Several years ago, I lived on a small bay on Lake Huron in northern Michigan. One year, the bay hosted a tremendous number of bufflehead. That year, my party killed just over 150 ducks. Over 100 were bufflehead. Toward the end of the season, I ran low on ammunition. While on a business trip to southern Michigan, I stopped at a Meijers store and purchases several boxes of Winchester X-pert Shells in #2 steel.

When I used these shells to shoot bufflehead, many times the ducks would fall when hit then get up and fly away. Frustrated, I later cut open a couple of shells and what I saw was not shot that I was normally used to seeing. What was in those shells looked more like the scrap off of a machine shop floor. Very few pieces were round, many were hollow. Many were tear dropped shaped.

Some people claim to have good luck with those shells. I choose to never use them again.

It's funny, I actually went home last and cut one of those Xperts open and you're right! I couldn't find a single round pellet in the bunch. So many had flat spots, out of round and just completely mis-shaped. So I cut open a Remington Nitro and it was night vs day, completely round and uniform, perfect. I dont know how Winchester gets away with putting a product like that out, complete garbage, if you're going to make shot, do it right or not at all. Just my opinion.

 

[sharris]

Despite the pellet shape, it patterns pretty uniformly out of my SXS shotgun. I was shooting small ducks at between 15-35 yards with 2 3/4" #4 experts through IC and Mod chokes and didn't have a problem. I had some pattern density problems shooting small ducks with 2 3/4" #2 when I used a different shotgun with a cylinder choke, and had to shoot them multiple times. I felt a lot more confident using the experts after I patterened it and knew what to expect at different distances and with different chokes.

 

[mtbaughs]

Seems like every year the price of these shells sucker me into buying at least one box during the season. The result is always the same as mentioned above. I've shot at mallards with 3" 2's 15 feet from the end of my barrel with these only to watch the birds fly away. These shells are total crap

 

[shoot-n-goose]

I've shot AT mallards with 3" 2's 15 feet from the end of my barrel with these only to watch the birds fly away. These shells are total crap

The key word there is AT. 15 feet from the muzzle the shot is in a relatively small spread. If you hit any duck at 15ft there is not a doubt in my mind that you would know it, and so would the (dead) duck. 15ft is decapitation distance with about any load. Sounds more like a miss to me

 

[mtbaughs]

Call it what you want but I've used the xperts at a variety of distances with different chokes. I was hoping they would work out mainly cause I like the price. Of course I second guessed my shot placement when I experienced this the first time, second time, and so on but it never failed, once I changed to a better shell the birds would fall dead again. These consistantly performed poorly and trust me I wanted them to work well @ there pricepoint.